[Megathread] Mass Effect 3

[omglazor]

I can use items and revive allies near walls just fine. And I don't think you should be able to just go into a full sprint independent of your character's facing. That would be ridiculous, and would look rather silly. That's an issue with the engine, not the controls.

When I want to move sideways quickly, I just roll in the direction I want to go and come into a sprint out of the roll. That deals with any facing issues and is basically as fast as sprinting sideways. If my path is obstructed in any way, I just wall bounce, then roll/sprint at the end. I will admit it's not quite as fluid as Gears 2 and 3, due to lack of wall bounce canceling, so it ends up feeling more like Gears 1.

In case someone has no idea what I'm talking about, this video gives a rather good visual demonstration of the concept. Note the video is quite loud.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H8Cu-PI8NvY

Well, for starters we seem to be comparing PS3 controls to PC controls. I have never played GoW or any game with similar controls. I am used to PC titles where characters don't move wall-to-wall unless I tell them to. I imagine these controls work much better on Consoles, especially if they are widely used.

PC titles have always had straight-forward multi-button controls. It is a staple of PC gaming: Mouse + KB. Ctrl crouch, Shift sprint, E for use, Space for Jump, etc. We have a lot of keys on our keyboards that can be mapped to a ton of different actions. Context keys also work on PC, but they need to be mapped out thoughtfully, e.g. Ctrl+Sprint = slide, Sprint+Jump = roll, etc. Mapping console controls on PC 1:1 is a very poor approach that rarely works, and usually leaves the title feeling non-PC: that's when you hear people accusing games of being or feeling like ports.

[OrcsRLame]

Well, for starters we seem to be comparing PS3 controls to PC controls. I have never played GoW or any game with similar controls. I am used to PC titles where characters don't move wall-to-wall unless I tell them to. I imagine these controls work much better on Consoles, especially if they are widely used.

PC titles have always had straight-forward multi-button controls. It is a staple of PC gaming: Mouse + KB. Ctrl crouch, Shift sprint, E for use, Space for Jump, etc. We have a lot of keys on our keyboards that can be mapped to a ton of different actions. Context keys also work on PC, but they need to be mapped out thoughtfully, e.g. Ctrl+Sprint = slide, Sprint+Jump = roll, etc. Mapping console controls on PC 1:1 is a very poor approach that rarely works, and usually leaves the title feeling non-PC: that's when you hear people accusing games of being or feeling like ports.

It's Xbox 360 actually, not PS3. And I wouldn't say that particular control scheme is widely used. The reason ME is similar to Gears is because they both use the Unreal Engine 3.0, which was made by Epic Games the creators of Gears of War. It goes a little deeper than that even though. Bioware had never done a shooter before ME, so they asked Epic for help with designing the combat system, which made it end up feeling a lot like Gears of War. Even if ME isn't a console port, (I don't know if it is or not) it will still end up feeling like a console port because Gears was designed for 360 and that's what the combat in ME was based off of. I don't disagree that it probably feels odd on PC, and it certainly isn't the norm for control schemes.

All that being said, it is still 100% possible to achieve maximum effectiveness on PC. Gears 1 was ported to PC, and the PC players mastered wall bouncing just like the 360 players did. I don't mean to sound condescending, and I mean this in the nicest way possible. It's not the controls, it's you. Yes, the controls are probably not at all what you were expecting, and they could probably be designed better for PC. That does not stop you from improving how you interact with the controls, and working out all the kinks in your gameplay, such as taking cover when you don't mean to. I'm sure you're a good player and will master the controls in time if you give them a chance and play with the correct mindset.

[Leonard McCoy]

Not hard, but limiting nonetheless since you sometimes have to go out of your way to do that action which you wouldn't have to if they were separate buttons.

paying attention to the contextual button is limiting for you. gotcha.

---------- Post added 2012-02-22 at 05:27 PM ----------

So do I, but the concept of paying attention to the controls and waiting for the context to catch up seems preposterous to me. Controls have to work with you, not the other way around. That is entirely what is sluggish about these controls - they do not allow you to do things rapidly and intuitively, as you could in any even mediocre Action game.

Your taking it to an extreme. It's not like the player sits their and waits for the button to show up revive. You move a step back and look theirs revive. Intuitive and rapid as hell.

[Voidism]

I'll boycott the game. :/

[Deleted]

I'll boycott the game. :/

same canceled preorder

[Karrotlord]

I'll boycott the game. :/

I saw that just before I got here. Very sad.

[omglazor]

It's Xbox 360 actually, not PS3. And I wouldn't say that particular control scheme is widely used. The reason ME is similar to Gears is because they both use the Unreal Engine 3.0, which was made by Epic Games the creators of Gears of War. It goes a little deeper than that even though. Bioware had never done a shooter before ME, so they asked Epic for help with designing the combat system, which made it end up feeling a lot like Gears of War. Even if ME isn't a console port, (I don't know if it is or not) it will still end up feeling like a console port because Gears was designed for 360 and that's what the combat in ME was based off of. I don't disagree that it probably feels odd on PC, and it certainly isn't the norm for control schemes.

All that being said, it is still 100% possible to achieve maximum effectiveness on PC. Gears 1 was ported to PC, and the PC players mastered wall bouncing just like the 360 players did. I don't mean to sound condescending, and I mean this in the nicest way possible. It's not the controls, it's you. Yes, the controls are probably not at all what you were expecting, and they could probably be designed better for PC. That does not stop you from improving how you interact with the controls, and working out all the kinks in your gameplay, such as taking cover when you don't mean to. I'm sure you're a good player and will master the controls in time if you give them a chance and play with the correct mindset.

I certainly could work with the controls, but I don't think I could ever be as efficient or as good with these controls as I could with traditional PC FPS/Action controls. The sticking problem can be worked around with time, but that would still mean losing some time to perform a given action.
Simply put - if I am rounding a corner, the action of sticking or unsticking, or the action of staying clear of the corner, still take extra time, even if it is half a second - it is still time lost to inefficiencies. Further, these inefficiencies are artificial as related to human anatomy and motion - we can easily sprint around a corner in person without staying away from the corner, bouncing off of it, or sticking to it. It is a stylized motion system to force a player into a certain playstyle, but I am of the opinion that such a system is not for PCs.

Console games are widely known to force certain usage of controls on you in order to facilitate a specific style of playing, while PC games are widely known for customization and personal preference. As I previously stated, mapping controls from Console to PC 1:1 does not work most of the time as it makes the game feel console-oriented and non-PC.

I am of the opinion that the PC version of the Demo (and most likely the game) was not executed with a PC-centric ideology.

[Leonard McCoy]

I wonder what they look like

[omglazor]

I wonder what they look like

Well, from ME1/2 I gathered that they were Humanoid, but much taller than a Human, possibly looked like Humans, but had longer Arms. You see a bunch of art and statues of theirs on some mission I forget the name of - where you explore an ancient city of theirs, and also in the flashbacks that you keep having in ME1. Hazy right now as it has been a long time since I have played either game, and I am only now replaying ME1 and am not far in, just flying around exploring planets. Not sure about other stuff.

[notalive]

Help Me I can't find the PC Collectors edition (for the uk) anywhere!

Got some contacts who work for EA Guildford just seeing if they can get me one but do any of you know where else might sell it?

Try Irish Gamestop. They had some earlier today, so I guess they're still there.

[calibro]

I'll boycott the game. :/

QFT really

[Ishu]

I wonder what they look like

I'm not sure if this artwork is official, but it looks like it could be.

http://media.desura.com/images/group...t-universe.jpg

[Leonard McCoy]

*sigh* You had an idea this was coming or something along these lines. It's just sad it had to happen to my fav video game series. Well maybe a boycott will work? I don't know. Between this and diablo now requiring me to be online to play it's becoming harder and harder to be a gamer.

[omglazor]

I'm not sure if this artwork is official, but it looks like it could be.

http://media.desura.com/images/group...t-universe.jpg

Not sure if legit, but yeah - it is hinted in ME2 at some point that the Collectors are actually ex-Protheans, which would make that picture plausible

[Egga]

Not sure if legit, but yeah - it is hinted in ME2 at some point that the Collectors are actually ex-Protheans, which would make that picture plausible

hinted? EDI clearly states that they are mutated Protheans, and on Ilos at Vigil you can assume that atleast some of the protheans still lives thanks to the stasis pods

http://www.destructoid.com/it-will-c...c-222045.phtml

this made me abit angry, but not enough to remove my preorder on N7 Collectors edition

[Narfwak]

The stupid GameStop-only items will likely be available as DLC (probably included with other stuff) in the future. The CE-only collector rifle from ME2 was in the Arsenal Pack, so I don't see why it would be any different here. EA may suck, but they're not Ubisoft; they do at least let you buy things from them after a game has shipped.

E:

hinted? EDI clearly states that they are mutated Protheans, and on Ilos at Vigil you can assume that atleast some of the protheans still lives thanks to the stasis pods

http://www.destructoid.com/it-will-c...c-222045.phtml

this made me abit angry, but not enough to remove my preorder on N7 Collectors edition

That's also been refuted as a rumor and is not actually true.

[Grizzly Willy]

hinted? EDI clearly states that they are mutated Protheans, and on Ilos at Vigil you can assume that atleast some of the protheans still lives thanks to the stasis pods

http://www.destructoid.com/it-will-c...c-222045.phtml

this made me abit angry, but not enough to remove my preorder on N7 Collectors edition

You know, I wasn't that miffed by the Kasumi character DLC in ME2, but limiting a day-one DLC option (and a rather vital one at that, considering the Protheans are thought to be extinct) to those who purchased a special copy of them game? I don't like not being able to get the same experience as anybody else who bought the game just because I don't want to pay another $10.

I will not be getting ME3. I love the series, but this, along with the auxiliary games that are going to impact the outcome of your single player game don't sit well with me.

Also, I agree 100% with TotalBiscuit. And that's not something I say often.

[Karrotlord]

Some of the responses on the Bioware forums got me thinking. Say you went out to buy a Harry Potter book. When you get home and open it up, everything that involves Dumbledore is cut out and it costs $10 to get it put back in. Would people still tell you to stfu and go buy it anyway? Why do so many gamers think cutting and charging for stuff like this is acceptable?

[Leonard McCoy]

Some of the responses on the Bioware forums got me thinking. Say you went out to buy a Harry Potter book. When you get home and open it up, everything that involves Dumbledore is cut out and it costs $10 to get it put back in. Would people still tell you to stfu and go buy it anyway? Why do so many gamers think cutting and charging for stuff like this is acceptable?

Cause it's not a book. It's a game. Dumbledore is integral to the book. The Prothean is not. Before today you didn't even know the god damn prothean was in the game and were all ready to play it without him. Do you really think the game will be unplayable without him? Was the second one that much worse without Zaeed? Yes I know its a fucking Prothean but I have a feeling he's entirely a flavour addition. Like Zaeed. I don't agree with their position about selling this stuff on day 1 but I understand why they do it and why the software allows them to do it.

[Voidism]

Some of the responses on the Bioware forums got me thinking. Say you went out to buy a Harry Potter book. When you get home and open it up, everything that involves Dumbledore is cut out and it costs $10 to get it put back in. Would people still tell you to stfu and go buy it anyway? Why do so many gamers think cutting and charging for stuff like this is acceptable?

Indeed. I do have the money, but this is wrong. I can't support a company like this.