[Cat] Feral Druid MoP Discussion Thread

[Geri0n]

Did anyone else see this?

Wild Charge: Renamed from Feral Charge. No longer costs energy. Now has a 15 sec cooldown, down from 30 sec. Can only be used while in combat.

Does this mean that we can no longer open with our charge? Or does activating WC send us into combat?

[Deleted]

Just FF first then charge, le sorted!

[Vyncent]

Looking over the new info posted on MMO today, I am confused by more than one of the 'talents' listed. However, this one "Primal Fury: Gain an additional 15 Rage every time you deal a critical strike with autoattack or Mangle and gain an additional combo point every time one of your combo moves deals a critical strike." confuses me most. To the best of my knowledge cats use and have always used energy, so what to we gain by having a 'talent' that gives of 15 rage? To my understanding the idea of separating everything was so that Cats could be Cats and Bears could be Bears. I am not trying to sound stupid here, just trying to understand some of the way this new system is supposed to work to our benefit!

[Drihan]

Looking over the new info posted on MMO today, I am confused by more than one of the 'talents' listed. However, this one "Primal Fury: Gain an additional 15 Rage every time you deal a critical strike with autoattack or Mangle and gain an additional combo point every time one of your combo moves deals a critical strike." confuses me most. To the best of my knowledge cats use and have always used energy, so what to we gain by having a 'talent' that gives of 15 rage? To my understanding the idea of separating everything was so that Cats could be Cats and Bears could be Bears. I am not trying to sound stupid here, just trying to understand some of the way this new system is supposed to work to our benefit!

Could be they are planning on splitting it up, but they just leave it like that for now. It could also be that if would be a shared talent between the two. I really have no idea.

[aliandren]

Looking over the new info posted on MMO today, I am confused by more than one of the 'talents' listed. However, this one "Primal Fury: Gain an additional 15 Rage every time you deal a critical strike with autoattack or Mangle and gain an additional combo point every time one of your combo moves deals a critical strike." confuses me most. To the best of my knowledge cats use and have always used energy, so what to we gain by having a 'talent' that gives of 15 rage? To my understanding the idea of separating everything was so that Cats could be Cats and Bears could be Bears. I am not trying to sound stupid here, just trying to understand some of the way this new system is supposed to work to our benefit!

so i hear arms warriors don't go into defensive stance ever.

[Elunedra]

It's a (huge) buff if you didn't ignore this:
Cat Form: Now also increases autoattack damage by 100% and....

auto attack damage and weapon damage are often seen as the same thing but it is not, that 100% increased auto attack damage might have 0 affect on our attack and only buff melee damage instead, just like Savage Roar does atm

---------- Post added 2012-03-29 at 01:40 PM ----------

I ma getting confused over wildcharge, will it still give a free Ravage! in cat? as that what i totaly loved about Cata it be said to loose it

[aliandren]

auto attack damage and weapon damage are often seen as the same thing but it is not, that 100% increased auto attack damage might have 0 affect on our attack and only buff melee damage instead, just like Savage Roar does atm

---------- Post added 2012-03-29 at 01:40 PM ----------

I ma getting confused over wildcharge, will it still give a free Ravage! in cat? as that what i totaly loved about Cata it be said to loose it

pretty sure it is understood by everyone that the 100% increase does not impact the specials. The point is that Savage Roar 30% damage increase nets the specials back to where they were. 100% auto attack damaged baked into cat form is > the 40% that Savage Roar currently yields. that means we are getting +60% auto attack damage at the expense of a longer ramp up time for our specials (this has significant impact on PvP).

[Deleted]

pretty sure it is understood by everyone that the 100% increase does not impact the specials. The point is that Savage Roar 30% damage increase nets the specials back to where they were. 100% auto attack damaged baked into cat form is > the 40% that Savage Roar currently yields. that means we are getting +60% auto attack damage at the expense of a longer ramp up time for our specials (this has significant impact on PvP).

i will tell you what is significant impact on pvp for feral druid monk will be able to dispell your bleeds priest shamman will be able dispell your roar 30% dmg redaction from the one and i dont know how mach from the bleeds and we all know that feral got so good energy regen that this will not be so big of a problem (sarcasm end)

[Elunedra]

pretty sure it is understood by everyone that the 100% increase does not impact the specials. The point is that Savage Roar 30% damage increase nets the specials back to where they were. 100% auto attack damaged baked into cat form is > the 40% that Savage Roar currently yields. that means we are getting +60% auto attack damage at the expense of a longer ramp up time for our specials (this has significant impact on PvP).

i think it will lower the ramup as auto attacks do not require a ramp up they are just there.

[Deleted]

Using a Character from World of Logs:

Auto attacks:
~10k Crits, ~5k Hits with 50% SR
~6.6k Crits, ~3.3K Hits without 50% SR
~13k Crits,~6.7k Hits with the MoP Cat increasing Auto attacks by 100%
~17k Crits,~8.7k Hits with the MoP Cat increasing Auto attacks by 100% and SR 30% Bonus

Auto attacks increase by 57%, So an Average DPS of 7.5k becomes 13.k with SR and 10k Without.

Also Bleeds are getting buffed
Rip:
(953+(0.1035*AP))*8 over 16 Seconds is becoming (1943+(0.21*AP))*8 over 16 seconds. While The buff is to make up for mangle no longer adding 30% extra damage, we still gain the 30% Bonus from the Effect of SR (mangles 30%=SR 30%)

[tangedyn]

auto attack damage and weapon damage are often seen as the same thing but it is not, that 100% increased auto attack damage might have 0 affect on our attack and only buff melee damage instead, just like Savage Roar does atm

It's confirmed - the 100% increased auto attack damage affects all skills that scale of Weapon Damage too.

[Deleted]

It's confirmed - the 100% increased auto attack damage affects all skills that scale of Weapon Damage too.

Without SR what do shreds hit for compared to live?

If anyone has Beta(range of people from full BiS HC, full normal gear, full PVP) what do skills hit for

[Deleted]

It's confirmed - the 100% increased auto attack damage affects all skills that scale of Weapon Damage too.

confirmed by who?

[tangedyn]

https://twitter.com/#!/riftmaker/sta...22810227593216

Confirmed by Reesi too, this time with actual tests on a dummy instead of believing the tooltips.

But seriously, WTB fucking beta so I don't have to depend on others to test beta mechanics.

[ultimar235]

i saw the passive thingy "Stampede" to give us a free ravage after a charge but how do we get it as i dont see it in out abilty's list,

It's removed, no more free Ravage. There is no passive Stampede.

I'm 90% into 85 at the moment and i'm noticing a lot less burst. Lost almost 10% crit compared to live as well so building combo points is harder. Also the new SR is really lame to keep up. Bear form is entirely pointless as Cat as well.

Only things i'm like is Mighty Bash and Cenarion Ward. CW is nice for that bit of extra heal at no GCD cost or resource cost. Might Bash is pretty overpowered, wouldn't surprise me to see it nerfed. Then again other classes have 5 sec stuns on same kind of cooldowns.

[Shifthappens]

Feral druids are pretty screwed atm in beta, cant kill anyone, i know its early beta and all

Change to old Savage Roar was the most dumbest move by blizzard. why in gods name... spec again became abit more chelanging but its so stupid in PVP

[teddabear]

Bleeds scale with AP, not weapon damage, so they are going to end up weaker compared to direct damage.
This is consistent with what is happening to DOTs for other classes. DOTs have been a nightmare to balance around because of how much DPS can vary for the strong DOT classes depending on the opportunity for multi-DOTing.

Again, I wouldn't worry too much about actual overall numbers. Near the end of beta Blizzard will do a final balancing pass to try to keep the DPS consistent between all the available classes for the upcoming tier of content.

...and Blizzard did such a good job in Cataclysm.

[tangedyn]

...and Blizzard did such a good job in Cataclysm.

Yep they did. DPS balance has never been closer in any other expansion. If you discount stuff like frost mages and bm hunters, of course.

---------- Post added 2012-04-03 at 10:28 AM ----------

https://twitter.com/#!/riftmaker/sta...22810227593216

Confirmed by Reesi too, this time with actual tests on a dummy instead of believing the tooltips.

But seriously, WTB fucking beta so I don't have to depend on others to test beta mechanics.

Looks like I may be wrong about this - fucking tooltips.
I'm done working with 2nd hand information, I can't do this shit properly without a real fucking beta account.

[FaerieDragon]

I'm just gonna have to wait for Beta so I can see for myself where we sit in MoP.

[Deleted]

Quick overview of what we gained and lost:

						feral		guardian

mangle (no debuff anymore)			x		x
rake						x		x
ferocious bite (with BitW)			x		x
primal fury (rage/cp on crit)			x		x
thrash (also in cat form)			x		x
nurturing instinct (agility -> spell power)	x		x
barkskin					x		x
leader of the pack				x		x
berserk						x		x
skull bash					x		x
maul						x		x
swipe						x		x
dash						x		x
faerie fire					x		x
pounce						x		x
maim						x		x
stampeding roar					x		x
might of ursoc (last stand)			x		x
bear hug					x		x

tiger's fury					x
feral instinct (stealth improvement)		x
shred (20% dmg on bleeding targets)		x
savage roar (30% phys dmg)			x
rip						x
predatory swiftness				x
omen of clarity					x
leather spec (agi)				x
ravage						x
infected wounds (slow only)			x
mastery: bleeds					x

savage defense (-40% phys dmg taken)				x
survival of the fittest (-6% crit chance)			x
vengeance							x
lacerate							x
thick hide (bear amor/magic dmg reduction)			x
leather spec (stam)						x
survival instincts (bear only)					x
frenzied regen							x
enrage								x
mastery: armor							x

glyph of bloodletting			built into rip
blood in the water (rip refresh with fb)built into ferocious bite
furor					built into cat/bear form
king of the jungle			built into tiger's fury
endless carnage (rake/sr duration)	built into rake/sr
rend and tear (shred dmg fb crit)	built into shred/fb
nurturing instinct 20% healing taken	glyph of cat form
feral swiftness				50% built into cat form, 50% from talent (same tier as charge)
glyph of berserk (10sec extra duration)	gone
stampede (free ravage after charge)	gone
glyph of tiger's fury (-3 sec cd)	gone
fury swipes				gone
primal madness				gone
pulverize				gone