How would you feel about 15 man raids?

[TheViper]

15man would be the perfect solution for everything, .

except our entire raid would quit the game, seriously. Theres very very very few things that id quit over, having to raid at anything less than 25 people for the "grand epic adventure" is one of them. A sentiment shared by the core of our guild. Im not sure how other 25man guilds feel, some would have to feel the same way

[Very Tired]

Or the 25 man guilds can recruit 5 more and run two 15 mans... Honestly, how many 25 man guilds don't have a few players on the bench?

I mentioned that in my first post, a guild forming 2 different raid teams is also drama waiting to happen. The team behind always complains about which team they are on.

[Orangetai420]

I mentioned that in my first post, a guild forming 2 different raid teams is also drama waiting to happen. The team behind always complains about which team they are on.

You did, my mistake.

[Irielle]

personally i say just get rid of 10mans, have 25 as the only size with the 3 difficulty modes. Those casuals with little time can do LFR. Casual but decent guilds can do normals while heroics for the higher end. Yeh you will have to do 25man raiding, it should feel epic, it should be hard, it should take some effort.

Please refrain from "its 25 man it should be hard" insinuating that 10m isn't hard. This is NOT the thread for it.

[Straif]

Every raid size is frought with pros and cons, but a little change can be good. I thought the transition from 40 to 25 would cause drama but for us at least it was fine. And going rom 25s to 10s worked fine as well.

Going back to 20 from 10s would be very dificult for most guilds and would probably be too much change all at one, but to go from 10s to 15 would be managable for most guils IMO.

Our 10s guild would love to get back to larger scal raiding and would look forward to staffing up a little for 15s.

Unfortunately, 25s are so few nowadays, that the question is really limited by what would work for us 10 man guilds now, and I think the change would be both managable and a fun challenge. And having 15 instead of 10 would shake things up a little - ina good way. I wish they were doing it for Panda.

And perhaps more importantly - having just 15 mans to design and tune around would yield some good benefits - which wuold be some combination of more or better content. Tuning 10s and 25s both, in addition to the 3 levels of difficulty - is kind of a waste IMO.

[Synaxis]

I'd be okay. I like smaller raids better, 15 beats 25 but I like 10 best still.

[Edison]

I'd honestly love it

[TheViper]

Please refrain from "its 25 man it should be hard" insinuating that 10m isn't hard. This is NOT the thread for it.

i was more pointing out that, the reason some people dont do 25 is the "closeness" of 10man, thats fine, but this is epic raiding, bands of hero's joining together against overwhelming odds and im sorry but 10 people just dosent feel at all like overwhelming odds. I guess the playerbase is now throughly divided, those that were around pre bc and those that came after bc, And well yeh logistically a 25 person raid is harder to put together, thats just common sense, nothing to do with the encounter itself.

If you want to kill x boss with a bazillion hp, yeh your going to need 25 people, hell id make it probably 30 if ihad my choice. 40 was a touch too many probably, that was a logistical nightmare running those raids.

[Sprucelee]

Never gonna happen, 25s are still way to popular and the raiders in them are far more opposed to this, while also generally leading the raiding scene.

Even if it is 2000 vs 20000 guilds, it is still 50,000 raiders to 200,000, and maybe even closer with the benches. 1/5 of the raiding population, and the most hardcore to boot, is substantial.

[Deleted]

It would be cool, why not? Who knows what Blizzy will decide

[Deleted]

no,no,no,no and no! i dont get why people want to raid 10/15m? imo they feel like doing another dungeon.. while 25m actually feels like raiding...

[Moltrasio]

I think it would be amazing. It would allow more people to become active in a community. I do like 10 man and getting together 25 people is frustrating. 15 sounds like that perfect middle.

[Anyankha]

Seeing how currently we (my guild) cannot make 2 10s, and our 10 group consist on 12 ppl in which 2 roles rotate around, 15 would be a blessing.

[Caiada]

I'd rather, if the game were made differently today, it be 18-man, with 6-person dungeons, and a 12-person 'inbetween.' 36-person Scenarios.

Right now, I'd prefer it to stay.

[Quintana]

I've been raiding with the same 6 people for about 4 years now, every content patch we end up bringing new faces in to round out our 10 man. While I wouldn't be against 15 person raids, it would make it incredibly hard for us to continue doing what we do.

[Deleted]

You can have various ways to develop a model for raiding that is

More functional than the current one
More fair than the current one
More fun than the current one

You can keep the dual aproach (that i don't like from immersion point of view, Flexy Ragnaros, Flexy Nefarian, apply to platform games not RPG's), but swap the numbers of the "small" and the "large", seperate achievements, keep loot the same.
A 6 (dungeon) - 12 -24 model, with the above elements would serve the purpose much better than the odd 5/10/25.
http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/...-Raiding-Model

Bring one size raids per Expansion. Make it so that the size is in between the existing ones, in a way that has part of their advandages and minimizes part of their flaws. 15? 18(6 people groups)? 20? All would work and the initial whinning for the change will wind away slowly as the people enjoy the benefits, by having more content, better quality of raids and encounters, and no issues with others that have it easier, or others that have less rng, or the model that is forcing them to do things.

Bring different sizes for different raids, but make it in a way that the one is direct muliplier of the other. A 5-10-20 system would be optimum here. People would be able to enjoy content with variety, but still with reasonable logistics for transition from small to big and from big to small. Going from 10 to 25 is odd, you lose people as you re trying to go from 20 (2 groups) to 25 due to extensive benching and big raids not happening. Transition from 25 to 10 recuires also extensive benching to go for 2 groups, or maintaining larger roster for 3 small groups, but again will create extensive benching when you do 25.

In all the above, balancing is either non existant, or not a big issue, since achievements are seperate. People just accept the obvious, that the available sizes can be equal but they are not the same. Pretty much the principal that goes for men and women in modern societies.
In all the above rage and envy of what the other does, is either non existant or way reduced.
In all the above the loot, especially when tiers and normal loot drops, have EXCACTLY the same analogy (e.g. 1 tier per 10, one normal item per 10).

I really wonder why people are so obsessed with number 10 and number 25.
I really wonder why the game developers lack the spine to deal with a problem for so long.

It used to be frustrating, now, after ALL those discussions, the rage, the division of the community, the alteration of the game to the point that it is all about the person and not about team and social activity, it is getting dissapointing.
And dissapointement is usually followed by apathy.
And that results to 1 simple phrase: "I quit".

[Nestoras]

15 man raids, as a single raid size, might be the single best thing that can happen regarding raiding in Mists of Pandaria.

New Continend.
Expanding the amount of things offered at max level not related to raids.
New lore and aproach.

And 15 people raids!

A size large enough to provide great setup, and small enough to to keep the organization the creation and the maintenance of those teams at a reasonable level, allowing you to explore and enjoy the other things offered, while still having a complete raiding experience!

I prefer smaller sizes my self, but 15 is the absolute sweetspot, for the reasons i mentioned above!

[Deleted]

I dont care what size raid they end up with... as long as its ONE UNIFORM RAID SIZE.

Im sick of hearing the arguing between 10 and 25man raiders, its sickening and sad at the same time. The truth is that nobody knows who the best team of players is simply because theyre not raiding the same content with the same amount of players... so Blizzard take note, u must create the next expansion with only one size raid available in this game to stop all the hate!

We have had an entire expansion where nobody knows whose got the best raid team on most realms simply because the top raiders r playing 2 totally different games. 10 and 25 r not the same, so get everyone playing the same content with the same amount of players... that way we will truly find out who the best raiders are on every realm.

[Kuruption]

I know that making one raid size is probably the best thing to do in the game, but if it went to 15, I think I'd quit. Granted, I've ran 10s for a while, but when I jumped back to 25s in Firelands, it just seems more fun to me than doing a smaller number. Plus the drama that would ensue, I just wouldn't want to deal with it.

[Deleted]

I'm all for 15 man raids. Any chance of a poll?