Pandaren racials was OP, now its ridiculous...

[Fest]

Except no... even at +100% its comparable to worgen/goblin, and even the super hardcore world first guilds arent all worgen/goblin.

Is it a good PVE racial? Yes. Is it the best? Maybe / maybe not. Will it be required for cutting edge world firsts? No.
Is it a good PVP racial? No. Is it the worst? Maybe.

There is no way 300 of a main stat is going to be worse than 1% crit or 1% haste for any class seeing as they said they still want agi/int/str to be the go-to stat. The difference between panda and worgen/goblin is going to be HUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUGE, let alone the difference between panda and any other race.

[Awfulist]

They need that race change revenue! $$$$$$$$$

[Minky]

I doubt it. I really do doubt someone sat there and said "Make the Pandaren Racials overpowering, so we can get people to Race Change for more money!".

As I said before, the stats are not overwhelming when compared to the inflation rate on items. Currently it is like the rest of your raid will be eating the +60 Food, and you're eating the +90 Food. Not exactly game breaking.

---------- Post added 2012-04-03 at 09:56 AM ----------



I saw almost no-one race change on my realm for the "Huge Benefits" of 1% Haste / Crit. Anyone who did wanted to race change anyway...

Maybe not; but I saw a ton of people racechange away from Human when their EMfH racial was nerfed - and then transfer back to Human when it was buffed to be overpowering again.
:|

[Haxlax]

1. Mist of Pandaria is released.
2. People race change to Panda for the racial
3. Blizzard nerfs it
4. QQ flood

[s_bushido]

If you're planning to Min/Max you're 'forced' into rolling the Race that's best suited to your class and/or role. Whether you choose to or not is, as you eluded to, optional.

As I said, I'd rather they just removed combat-affecting racials all together and put them into specific classes.

They should not change an aspect of the game to suit a purely optional playstyle. Every class has minor advantages/disadvantages compared to the others, and yet they haven't deemed it necessary to remove all of their distinguishing features just because <Bleeding-edge Guild X> decided to stack mages for their world-first kill.

[Dirgon]

In the last QQ thread on this, I broke down the math using rogue T12 BiS EP numbers, and found the panderan racial to be slightly (~ 30 EP) higher than the goblin 1% haste, which is currently ranked slightly below Orc and greatly below Troll.

Currently at 85 for rogues, using EP values for BiS T12 (BiS T13 wasn't modeled at EJ), Goblin 1% haste is worth 128.057 haste rating. 128.057 haste rating is worth 217.69 EP. Current food awards 90 agi, so double that for an extra 90 agi, and you get an EP of 243 EP

For current Cat numbers, it's marginally better. We can probably expect around the same, if not better, come MoP.

Blizzard has in no way said they want agi/str/int to be the go to stats. I'm pretty sure awhile ago they said they don't like currently how much stronger main stats are for every class and they want to emphasize the importance of secondary stats, which will wind up devaluing main stats and probably making this an even weaker racial in relation to the secondary stat racials. (Cannot find source, I'm sure someone else has it, though)

[Waaldo]

ok, i really was pissed first i saw panda racials +100% Buff Food Bonus. because i thought new buff food will give like +100 mainstat and that would be reason enough for every hardcore player to reroll panda. But +300 mainstat on Buff food? are u kidding me? this is ridiculous. My bloodelf got +5 arcane resistance and panda + 300 mainstat?

really.. gtfo

They don't just "get +300 main stat" You as another race other than pandaren get +150 and they get double that.
And as a Belf you don't just get +5 arcane resistance, you also get a silence/mana recovery spell. That's like saying mage's fireball hits for 50k, but my rogues auto attack hits for only 3k. They are two completely different things.

[Fojos]

People said the same thing about the Dreanei. Anyone serious enough will take that +1% Hit.

People said the same thing about the Worgen. Anyone serious enough will that that +1% Crit.

It won't go live with that much of a buff. However even if it did, it is hardly overpowering. The stats in PvE wont compare to the inflation we're seeing on items, and will give a very minor boost in a raiding environment, not worth a race change. In PvP Battlegrounds it is the same with Raids, not enough of a stat increase compared to the stat inflation.

300 x 25 = 7500

Let's say they were all DPS. That would mean an extra 22500 - 37500 DPS, minus some insignificant numbers from other possible racials.

[Dirgon]

They don't just "get +300 main stat" You as another race other than pandaren get +150 and they get double that.
And as a Belf you don't just get +5 arcane resistance, you also get a silence/mana recovery spell. That's like saying mage's fireball hits for 50k, but my rogues auto attack hits for only 3k. They are two completely different things.

This is incorrect. Food on the beta for level 90 currently gives +300 main stat maximum. With the Panderan racial, they will be getting 600 main stat for a net gain of 300.

[Naposim1337]

stupid blood elf xD you. will. reroll.

[Maoli]

Racials should be for fun IMO and disabled in Pve/Pvp encounters. Problems solved.

[Curanhadin]

i may be mistaking but i thought i read awhile back that all the races are having there racials slightly buffed or altered to bring them in pace with the pandas. plus im sure all the numbers will change somewhat with the beta patches, also didnt blizz speculate on remevoing resistances out of the game? if so a lot of racials will have to be reworked that have a racial resist.

[DestructicusMAX]

There is no way 300 of a main stat is going to be worse than 1% crit or 1% haste for any class seeing as they said they still want agi/int/str to be the go-to stat. The difference between panda and worgen/goblin is going to be HUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUGE, let alone the difference between panda and any other race.

There is no math here, only assumptions. At level 90, 1% crit or 1% haste could easily be 600 rating. Is 300 agi better than 600 crit rating? Maybe? Is the difference HUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUGE? No. The fact is, none of us know the math right now because beta is capped at lvl 86. We have no idea how much rating will deteriorate. Beta is beta.

Also, wtb mfing ilvl squish to solve this problem.

[s_bushido]

There is no math here, only assumptions. At level 90, 1% crit or 1% haste could easily be 600 rating. Is 300 agi better than 600 crit rating? Maybe? Is the difference HUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUGE? No. The fact is, none of us know the math right now because beta is capped at lvl 86. We have no idea how much rating will deteriorate. Beta is beta.

Also, wtb mfing ilvl squish to solve this problem.

Heh, if Pandaren were implemented today, the Worgen crit racial would be worth something like 180 crit rating and the poor panda would be stuck with 90 agi/str/int.

The closest one would be Draenei casters with their 100 hit rating racial. Truly gamebreaking.

[Deleted]

Chill out folks, we're talking about cute panda people here. No one should talk seriously about them other than their creators, and even then that'll be extremely subjective. The whole game's really light hearted and full of parodies. Go take a walk and enjoy life. There are much more important things to think about other then whether a cartoonish, racially parodied, Panda man generates incorrect numbers in a computer game.

[Nayura]

Is it a good PVE racial? Yes. Is it the best? Maybe / maybe not. Will it be required for cutting edge world firsts? No.
Is it a good PVP racial? No. Is it the worst? Maybe.[/QUOTE]

Exactly, and if you have that big of a problem, why not re-roll a Pandaren then?

[Fest]

There is no math here, only assumptions. At level 90, 1% crit or 1% haste could easily be 600 rating. Is 300 agi better than 600 crit rating? Maybe? Is the difference HUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUGE? No. The fact is, none of us know the math right now because beta is capped at lvl 86. We have no idea how much rating will deteriorate. Beta is beta.

Currently on my Worgen rogue agility is worth 2.76 and crit is worth 1.04. Yes, the difference between the two racials even in today's game is pretty damn big. This problem will on get worse with more levels.

[anothdae]

There is no way 300 of a main stat is going to be worse than 1% crit or 1% haste for any class seeing as they said they still want agi/int/str to be the go-to stat. The difference between panda and worgen/goblin is going to be HUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUGE, let alone the difference between panda and any other race.

You are using current numbers for that assumption and based on the datamined items there is going to be a big leap in stats. Doing napkin math with the first level of dungeon heroics, the +300 stat food is exactly the same relative power as the +90 food is now.

So tell me, is +90 stat vs +1% haste/crit "HUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUGE" right now?

HINT: No.

Look at the pvp power of EMFH, compare the trinkets and see that that racial is worth an average of 404 primary stat right now, AND it is in a controlled burst.
Is +90 so much more "HUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUGE" than +404?
Is every PVPer a human?
HINT: No.

Yes, this is PVP not PVE, but the math is much simpler than trying to show that for ~most~ specs +1%secondary is comparable to +90primary.

---------- Post added 2012-04-04 at 04:24 AM ----------

Also, wtb mfing ilvl squish to solve this problem.

There is no problem to solve, except to explain to some people that the numbers will in fact rise in MOP, and that percentages will scale.

If these people actually looked at the datamined numbers from enchanting and gear, they would see that the relative strength of gear to professions / food will stay about the same, and that the racial while good for PVE isnt "ridiculous", it wont be "required" for any level of play, and for same classes/specs isnt even best.

[Alliryian]

I really REALLY hate people that just say "it's beta" for every little complaint people have and act all holier than thou, like we have NO RIGHT to complain about things in a beta. Isn't that what the beta is for? To find what fails and complain? Just because it's in Beta and CAN change doesn't mean it will. And it CERTAINLY doesn't mean it shouldn't be discussed.

Bitching about people bitching about things from beta on UNOFFICIAL forums will change NOTHING.

See what I did there :\

So that means your doing 2 completely useless thing's? kk, aslong as you admit it.

[Nayura]

Hahaha, oh lord, what a joke. But that's what forums like this are for, isn't it?