Anaxie's Totally Revolutionary SoO Retribution T16 BiS & Theorycraft

[Deleted]

in fact he is a "numbers" guy the question would be the same. every sim shows str much lower (2:1 ratio) then our sec stats. and if a "numbers" guy go to an str build i go to be attentive^^

[Deleted]

I'm sure there's a good reason he's doing that, a guy like Exemplar wouldn't just do it for no reason.

[anaxie]

He could be testing something, shouldn't take an armory inspect for facts. I know I fondled around with mastery+divine purpose in T15 with good results and people tore me a new one on real ID with it x]


Update on the guide though, there will be a 6.0 beta guide coming out during early beta and it will be changed and altered as beta goes on, so if anyone is able to chip in on it and help/give feedback when beta launches, i would appreciate it

I don't agree with the

4 – Use Divine Storm when you have Divine Crusader procs and 5 Holy Power, if you’re using the Tier 16 Four set.

Here is the issue: So you have 5 holy power thats cool! However Even at 2-3 holy power I find it more beneficial to use use up the proc assuming atleast Crusader strike is on cooldown. This ensures 2 things.

#1 If you proc DS again! Whoooo you can use up that proc! when the chain ends CS is up or just a global away so you bypassed using exorcism.
#2 If you HP cap while holding DS's and CS is sitting off cooldown that is an awful situation. But... what can you do? Surely you cannot use TV with a DS proc it's VERY likely that you will overwrite the proc, far greater too if you are running Divine purpose.

Holding the Free DS and going through the motion is obv better when you know a huge cluster of adds are about to pop and you go completely ham on them.

~ Also another point, it's pretty much my own fault for being so lazy with my OP.

The immersius hands should be added into the OP as a BiS alernative with hands too. Pre Garrosh and all it's likely to be the offset MOST paladins come across. Shoulds MIGHT be alternative replaced with the Protectors ones may need to check those VS garrosh.

Also lastly Xal'toh whatever axe should technically be better then mace since the has less rating and eats at the expertise gem budget which in the long run makes the weapon weaker to alternatives by a margin larger then the spread on the others.

But hey aslong as you get a 580 wpn who cares? Fuck yeah party time.

Anywho weapon graph is essentially Spear > Sword=Axe> Mace

Sword Crit/haste
Axe Crit/mastery

It really means absolutely nothing since gems get converted into mastery once the 40% point is obtained. If you flip ratings on an item you simply revert a gem and you have the exact same results. The only benefit would be towards say, Human paladins.

As for Dwarf mace BiS, considering the lost rating points it might just barely break even. It's below the spear though certainly Double combo of our best stats is the only way to have a pure gain on both without playing the balancing act.

[Tanyn]

I ended up using the Immerseus gloves. I also got the Mace from Nazgrim. I just switched my rings to the ones from Shamans and Thok (yay for 4 BiS items off 1 boss?) and it pretty much fixed my stats. Couldn't pass up the H-WF weapon. I know Crit isn't horrible, but I still mentally have a hard time picking it up on my gear.

[Deleted]

But hey aslong as you get a 580 wpn who cares? Fuck yeah party time.

This is my thinking precisely. I was fortunate enough to coin heroic warforged mace from Nazgrim. As such, I'm not now attempting to get any other weapon. I'm certainly not measuring up the Garrosh axe for the same reason I'm not bothered about the Tusks of Mannoroth. When I've killed Garrosh on heroic mode (which won't be until way after many of you guys), I am not all that bothered about gear. I'll still want to carry on raiding SoO, sure, but what's the point of gearing so you can delay swapping your nice epics for greens for one more level with the new expansion?

[Neldarie]

Sword>Heirloom>Pole>Axe>Mace for humans
Heirloom>Pole>Axe>Sword>Mace for everyone else
(Pure rating perspective)
It depends on your ilvl and other gear you're wearing of course. I'm just going with best possible setups in highest possible ilvls when rating weps and their ratings gains/loses.

Expertise on items is the new aids of this tier (similar to hit in ToT), due to insane amount of redsockets you get to work with when wearing BiS. So any time ure forced to gem str-rating into reds = you're losing out.

Remove Heirloom if Warforged.

[Montoyal]

4 – Use Divine Storm when you have Divine Crusader procs and 5 Holy Power, if you’re using the Tier 16 Four set.

From what It's worth since I'm not one of the pre aproved rets around here, using our T16 proc has a higher priority than using Exo though during AW using our DS proc becomes very high priority only below HoW.

The priority I mention is as follows:
Inq > FreeDS(5HP) > TV(5HP) > HoW > FreeDS(AW) > TV(AW) > CS > Judge > FreeDS > Exo > TV(3/4)

[anaxie]

So essentially the exact same rotation in the OP? Sweet

[Montoyal]

Apparently I shoudl check OP from time to time. Good to know we agree.

[Deleted]

Yeah. He has no idea how to play and is just a "numbers" guy. Easy explanation really.

100% Bold reds and 1/14H. should totally be writing "how to ret" guides. It's a reason EJ has fallen so far from grace since Wrath. The place used to actually have quality people around / running the show.

Needless to say. Try to stick with things myself, Neldarie, Dakeshi, Killmour, and the rarely seen Solsacra. Mostly opinions you can count on.

Wow you do try to be a dick for the sake of doing so. Exemplar has probably been one of the most important players for our class throughout most of the game. You do realise how many inaccuracies he helps find in Simcraft using his spreadsheet right? Him and Theck both work closely together, and I would take his advice over yours any day.

So far your advice has been to "if I do it, you should since I got more heroic experience than you" and brown nosing other top rets. I'm pretty sure we can all agree gemming full strength is not optimal, but before calling him a trashcan I'd probably ask him why he is doing it. It could be purely to get more accurate numbers on scaling.

You don't have to be 14/14 HC to do math and be correct.

[anaxie]

Arrogance is part of the Anaxie flavor everyone adores. Perhaps the title isn't bold enough.

Also... most important to whom? Inexperienced players too green to know any better?

[Deleted]

Well I for one as an academic myself appreciate the fact that Theck and Exemplar have 2 completly different ways of measuring stats and dps and communicate together when discrepencies occur. This reduces the risk of getting wrong numbers from both tools and provides us with a way to debate, test and sim our ideas and gear choices out with a higher margin of accuracy.

Nobody would find be able to accurately find out when to stop going for X stat or Y untill live tests actually confirmed it.

[Deleted]

Arrogance is part of the Anaxie flavor everyone adores. Perhaps the title isn't bold enough.

Also... most important to whom? Inexperienced players too green to know any better?

Not the first time and it won't be the last. I for one take what you say with a good bit of weight because I can verify it. However, you need to understand that the way you present your ideas is no better than someone in LFR who has never completed any higher level mode explaining tactics. You don't provide calculations, you don't provide videos of yourself carrying anything out (that I know of); so there isn't even empirical evidence for what you say. We have to just suck it and see.

Now this is fine, you're not paid to do this, you do it out of the goodness of your heart (or to feed your ego, don't care which) and for that I'm sure a lot of us are quite grateful. But, yeah, your manner will elicit such responses from time to time. I'd just ignore it and keep up with the comments.

[ujx]

Arrogance is part of the Anaxie flavor everyone adores. Perhaps the title isn't bold enough.

Also... most important to whom? Inexperienced players too green to know any better?

What is there to be arrogant about? You take completely obvious common sense stat weights and make a BiS list. Everyone else in this thread does PTR, contributes to rotations/builds, and has worthwhile things to say.

If everyone listened to you like you think they do, we'd all be using DP instead of SW.

[Charleslol]

Anaxie got a rank 1 parse on Ultraxion and decided to make this thread. There's nothing revolutionary about it. Most of the good posts in this thread have been from rets who are not named Anaxie. Rename the thread IMO.

[Tanyn]

Make your own thread.

[Envvyy]

Charles, Ex #2 Retribution paladin of <vodka> says that you are bad and you should feel bad.

[anaxie]

Charles, Ex #2 Retribution paladin of <vodka> says that you are bad and you should feel bad.

Duality says RiP

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Anaxie got a rank 1 parse on Ultraxion and decided to make this thread. There's nothing revolutionary about it. Most of the good posts in this thread have been from rets who are not named Anaxie. Rename the thread IMO.

Solsacra says hi

[Charleslol]

nice ninja edit

[anaxie]

What is there to be arrogant about? You take completely obvious common sense stat weights and make a BiS list. Everyone else in this thread does PTR, contributes to rotations/builds, and has worthwhile things to say.

If everyone listened to you like you think they do, we'd all be using DP instead of SW.

Bro, it was myself and Solsacra who started the entire 40% haste cap thing in the first place. Nevermind I created the list before we even had this tiers weights and turns out I was pretty much dead on while everyone was drooling over Garrosh shoulders.

Would you like fries with that?

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Not the first time and it won't be the last. I for one take what you say with a good bit of weight because I can verify it. However, you need to understand that the way you present your ideas is no better than someone in LFR who has never completed any higher level mode explaining tactics. You don't provide calculations, you don't provide videos of yourself carrying anything out (that I know of); so there isn't even empirical evidence for what you say. We have to just suck it and see.

Now this is fine, you're not paid to do this, you do it out of the goodness of your heart (or to feed your ego, don't care which) and for that I'm sure a lot of us are quite grateful. But, yeah, your manner will elicit such responses from time to time. I'd just ignore it and keep up with the comments.

It's just a game in the end. People need some thick skin in this thread imo.

Kinda why I like Neldarie so much, hes been around so long he knows not to take anything personally and we end up getting along swell.