Alliance Dalaran

[Verdugo]

Distracting tactics. Dalaran moving back distracts the Forsaken while Gilneas and Stormgarde grow in strengh, thus getting rid of the advantage the forsaken have, natural barriers (the separation between Azeroth, the continent, and Lordaeron only linked through one bridge and the wild ocean separating anything else) then Dalaran pops out.

Unless Dalaran is already infiltrated by the Forsaken, ready to be sabotaged if they tried something like that.

[Florena]

Distracting tactics. Dalaran moving back distracts the Forsaken while Gilneas and Stormgarde grow in strengh, thus getting rid of the advantage the forsaken have, natural barriers (the separation between Azeroth, the continent, and Lordaeron only linked through one bridge and the wild ocean separating anything else) then Dalaran pops out.

I'd say the advantage of the Forsaken lies in the valkyr, the plague, and overall having less morals than the other races.

---------- Post added 2012-07-17 at 07:04 PM ----------

Unless Dalaran is already infiltrated by the Forsaken, ready to be sabotaged if they tried something like that.

Not if the forsaken inviltrators got caught. =P But yeah I really don't expect to see Dalaran copy/pasted ANYWHERE even if it does rejoin the Alliance, and if they do get a new city/town it will probably be in Dustwallow to replace Alliance quests int he zone.

[jishdefish]

So, if Alliance gets Dalaran, as a raid-portal-outside-Org staging point, then the Horde could get a commandeered ziggurat (maybe Voltarus? Drakuru isn't using it anymore). It wouldn't be the first time the Forsaken have claimed something from their time in Northrend.

[Deleted]

Something else I'm curious about...in beta, Theramore hasn't been altered yet. I'm getting nervous that maybe they don't PLAN to update the zone outside of the scenarios, and while Theramore will be destroyed int he present, it won't be in the past when Dustwallow Marsh is set, a huge thorn in the side for RPers that would want to go see the place. Of course, maybe they're just not done with it yet, or will introduce it in the PTR instead.

I do hope they don't go lazy on this, at least if they destroy it, destroy it, not leave it there.

Ok people still don't seem to get it...THEY WOULD NOT REMOVE DALARAN FROM NORTHREND. DALARAN IN NORTHREND IS SET IN THE PAST AND WOULD NOT BE TOUCHED. JUST LIKE HOW THRALL IS STILL WARCHIEF IN NORTHREND. Sorry for the caps but this has been explained MANY MANY times in the thread already.

And blizzard has stated they do not even out losses and gains, they find that to be boring story telling, so losing something does not mean we're due to get something in return, nor does one factoin gaining something mean the other must too.

They removed Naxx from the Old World even though the Old World was set into the past of Wrath. They removed the Wrathgate questline, even though it was set in the past. They Removed Hemet Nesingway and replaced him with his son the first time(when he went to Nagrand) although the Old World was in the past. What's the difference?
They can simply make the Kirin Tor base down, where the portal down from Dalaran goes, add one of each profession trainer there, the pet vendor and one gear vendor for each type, the heirroom vendor and the former badge vendors, only for both factions all of these. And we're done. It's not like Dalaran today is a place everyone hangs in.

And the losses and gains thing is a big fat lie. Why didn't worgen get to quest in Silverpine? Because then the Horde would have had less 10-20 zones. Why didn't the Alliance get Gilneas city? Because then they'd have had more capitals then the Horde. Why did Dalaran go neutral in first place? Because Horde didn't have where to hang out. These were all made for balance, and these are just a few of the examples.

[Callace]

Blizzard won't be doing significant changes post-Cata. When fans asked them about the future of Gilneas, their reaction was, "what??".

Neutral faction portals for Dalaran are already in MoP. At the most, they'll move a certain NPC to Dalaran.

You guys should know what to expect by now. You think they're going to spend time on old cities, now!?

Not a fucking chance in hell.

[Florena]

So, if Alliance gets Dalaran, as a raid-portal-outside-Org staging point, then the Horde could get a commandeered ziggurat (maybe Voltarus? Drakuru isn't using it anymore). It wouldn't be the first time the Forsaken have claimed something from their time in Northrend.

I think even that's more than we can assume at this time.

---------- Post added 2012-07-17 at 07:09 PM ----------

I do hope they don't go lazy on this, at least if they destroy it, destroy it, not leave it there.


They removed Naxx from the Old World even though the Old World was set into the past of Wrath. They removed the Wrathgate questline, even though it was set in the past. They Removed Hemet Nesingway and replaced him with his son the first time(when he went to Nagrand) although the Old World was in the past. What's the difference?
They can simply make the Kirin Tor base down, where the portal down from Dalaran goes, add one of each profession trainer there, the pet vendor and one gear vendor for each type, the heirroom vendor and the former badge vendors, only for both factions all of these. And we're done. It's not like Dalaran today is a place everyone hangs in.

Naxxramas was a long outdated raid, and not a critically important city for an entire expansion's worth of content. And yes blizz has moved npcs around. Replacing a capital city, even for an old expansion, would require a LOT more work than displacing a raid that hasn't been current content in years and swapping a couple npcs around.

[Austilias]

Blizzard won't be doing significant changes post-Cata. When fans asked them about the future of Gilneas, their reaction was, "what??".

Neutral faction portals for Dalaran are already in MoP. At the most, they'll move a certain NPC to Dalaran.

You guys should know what to expect by now. You think they're going to spend time on old cities, now!?

Not a fucking chance in hell.

I'm afraid this is more in line with Blizzard's way of doing. If I had my way, Gilneas would currently be a World PvP zone with daily quests/scenarios and large amounts of honour per kill so that it really would reflect the 'war' that's supposed to be going on there currently. As it is however, they've justified leaving it empty with the Battle for Gilneas battleground, in which we're 'in Gilneas', so to speak.

The amount of things that happen in the books that aren't reflected in WoW is already quite staggering; much as i'd wish it to be otherwise, the whole Jaina scenario will likely be no different.

[Slowpoke is a Gamer]

Distracting tactics. Dalaran moving back distracts the Forsaken while Gilneas and Stormgarde grow in strengh, thus getting rid of the advantage the forsaken have, natural barriers (the separation between Azeroth, the continent, and Lordaeron only linked through one bridge and the wild ocean separating anything else) then Dalaran pops out.

But then we're building to 11 again. It's a capital with no real point in-game, the only result would be shipping the Forsaken to Kalimdor, and moving the Night Elves in. Another Cataclysm, and we all remember what happened with the first Cataclysm.

---------- Post added 2012-07-17 at 02:16 PM ----------

I'm afraid this is more in line with Blizzard's way of doing. If I had my way, Gilneas would currently be a World PvP zone with daily quests/scenarios and large amounts of honour per kill so that it really would reflect the 'war' that's supposed to be going on there currently. As it is however, they've justified leaving it empty with the Battle for Gilneas battleground, in which we're 'in Gilneas', so to speak.

The amount of things that happen in the books that aren't reflected in WoW is already quite staggering; much as i'd wish it to be otherwise, the whole Jaina scenario will likely be quite different.

In a perfect world where resources and time were not issues, I would put another expansion after MoP that does take the war up to 11. Ships the Forsaken to Kalimdor and the Night Elves into Lordaeron. Make Dalaran a replacement for Darnassus, and make Theramore a replacement for Undercity.

And turn Blood Elves and Dwarves into neutral races.

And add a faction-specific class again.



But resources and time are issues. And none of that will be done because new content was proven to be more important than revamped content in Cataclysm.

[Austilias]

But then we're building to 11 again. It's a capital with no real point in-game, the only result would be shipping the Forsaken to Kalimdor, and moving the Night Elves in. Another Cataclysm, and we all remember what happened with the first Cataclysm.

The amount of capitals that a faction has is not game-breaking however, nor do I understand why people want them to be equal anyway. Both factions have about 4 capitals (The Horde actually has '5' if you include them having taken back their Echo Isles as opposed to the Gnomes who failed with Gnomergan, again..), but to be honest and realistic, only 1 city per faction is ever populated; Stormwind and Orgrimmar. Do I think Gilneas should and will be taken back? Most certainly. Stromgarde? Not sure. Does it matter that much either way? Not really.

[Callace]

Naxxramas was a long outdated raid, and not a critically important city for an entire expansion's worth of content. And yes blizz has moved npcs around. Replacing a capital city, even for an old expansion, would require a LOT more work than displacing a raid that hasn't been current content in years and swapping a couple npcs around.

That's right. The amount of work they'd have to do would be significant, and it would be visible in Beta by now (like everything else).


Blizzard is so persnickety about their cities, there is no way they would make a change without us knowing by Beta.
They will never change factions for one of their cities. Their world design is EXTREMELY static. Blizzard designs things with the intention of only doing it once and never looking back. They said that the Cataclysm was a one-time deal in that regard. And given all the hand-waving they've shown at further revamps, I tend to believe them.

[Thulvaso]

This is what I want to happen.

Dalaran moves from Northrend to the ruins above Theramore. From here Jaina will lead (with Varian) the training of the Alliance forces to finally attack Orgrimmar in the last patch.

[Slowpoke is a Gamer]

The amount of capitals that a faction has is not game-breaking however, nor do I understand why people want them to be equal anyway. Both factions have about 4 capitals (The Horde actually has '5' if you include them having taken back their Echo Isles as opposed to the Gnomes who failed with Gnomergan, again..), but to be honest and realistic, only 1 city per faction is ever populated; Stormwind and Ironforge. Do I think Gilneas should and will be taken back? Most certainly. Stromgarde? Not sure. Does it matter that much either way? Not really.

I'm not saying the numbers are a problem.


But the fact of it is putting an Alliance zone and capital in the middle of a dominant-horde zone is going to lead to an empty zone and capital. It has to have content linked to it.

[Callace]

I'm afraid this is more in line with Blizzard's way of doing. If I had my way, Gilneas would currently be a World PvP zone with daily quests/scenarios and large amounts of honour per kill so that it really would reflect the 'war' that's supposed to be going on there currently. As it is however, they've justified leaving it empty with the Battle for Gilneas battleground, in which we're 'in Gilneas', so to speak.

The amount of things that happen in the books that aren't reflected in WoW is already quite staggering; much as i'd wish it to be otherwise, the whole Jaina scenario will likely be no different.

This thread is so silly because it essentially goes 180 degrees against Blizzard's design philosophy of "get it done and don't return".
We'll either see something new (which I doubt) or nothing at all. Most likely nothing.

And the fact that they already included a neutral faction portal for Dal eradicates any chance of something like this from happening.

Blizzard is fucking STINGY! Time to get real guys.

[jishdefish]

I think even that's more than we can assume at this time.

Way more, sorry, I should have specified that I was talking hypothetically.

[Austilias]

I'm not saying the numbers are a problem.


But the fact of it is putting an Alliance zone and capital in the middle of a dominant-horde zone is going to lead to an empty zone and capital. It has to have content linked to it.

Could be easily fixed I say; Dalaran operatives in Silverpine are known for their espionage as seen in the Forsaken quests. I'm sure with Jaina being in control of Dalaran that they could whip up a few portals and have you gathering information/eliminating threats and so on. The Twilight Highlands questline for the Alliance, for example, has a Dwarf flying/porting us all the way from Stormwind to the Twilight Highlands; would take much for something along those lines to have quests there and to justify the presence.

---------- Post added 2012-07-17 at 08:26 PM ----------

This thread is so silly because it essentially goes against 180 degrees against Blizzard's design philosophy of "get it done and don't return".
We'll either see something new (which I doubt) or nothing at all. Most likely nothing.

And the fact that they already included a neutral faction portal for Dal eradicates any chance of something like this from happening.

Blizzard is fucking STINGY! Time to get real guys.

True again. Our one-faced Pandaren Females demonstrate this point to a tee. It's a case of as little as they can do, even with regard to the one and only newest race, for maximum profit. Good business tactics surely, but not good for gaming quality.

[Callace]

I'm not saying the numbers are a problem.


But the fact of it is putting an Alliance zone and capital in the middle of a dominant-horde zone is going to lead to an empty zone and capital. It has to have content linked to it.

The issue isn't balance. It's workload. Blizzard wouldn't commit so much work to something with so little payoff. It isn't Minecraft.

---------- Post added 2012-07-17 at 07:28 PM ----------

They won't waste development money on this idea.


/thread

[Slowpoke is a Gamer]

Could be easily fixed I say; Dalaran operatives in Silverpine are known for their espionage as seen in the Forsaken quests. I'm sure with Jaina being in control of Dalaran that they could whip up a few portals and have you gathering information/eliminating threats and so on. The Twilight Highlands questline for the Alliance, for example, has a Dwarf flying/porting us all the way from Stormwind to the Twilight Highlands; would take much for something along those lines to have quests there and to justify the presence.

---------- Post added 2012-07-17 at 08:26 PM ----------



True again. Our one-faced Pandaren Females demonstrate this point to a tee. It's a case of as little as they can do, even with regard to the one and only newest race, for maximum profit. Good business tactics surely, but not good for gaming quality.

An ideal scenario for me would be to finally do what should have been done in Cata.

Instead of shipping Worgen off to Darnassus, have them stay and use the forsaken zones for questing. The seeds for quests are already there since NPC Worgen are so common in Silverpine and Hlilsbrad.

[Scuffs]

One of the strongest mages in the world.

of warcraft

[Slowpoke is a Gamer]

The issue isn't balance. It's workload. Blizzard wouldn't commit so much work to something with so little payoff. It isn't Minecraft.

---------- Post added 2012-07-17 at 07:28 PM ----------

They won't waste development money on this idea.


/thread

From my understanding the focus here has shifted from an argument on can it happen (which is a yes) to a discussion on how it could happen.

We've managed to sidestep the workload idea by just saying "do it in a MoP patch".

[Anonymitylol]

I hope the horde mages come up with an dalaran equivalent which will be one of the two fronts (other being dalaran) in the expac after MoP.

That won't happen, the alliance is going to be compensated for losing theramore. Remember, we lose a major city in mop(Even if it's only lorewise, it was still a city), it would only be right to give us a new one. The horde didn't lose one.