Ideas for Resto Shaman Regeneration fixes..

[Cynical Person]

These are just ideas very experimental but I don't think they are bad.

I think someone should show this to blizz...

Glyph of Spiritwalker's Grace
Major Glyph
Classes: Shaman
Requires Level 25
Item Level 25
Use: Permanently teaches you this glyph.

Increases the duration of your Spiritwalker's Grace by 5 sec and also reduces the mana cost of your healing spells by X% while active.

Ascendance
5.2% of base mana
Instant 3 min cooldown
The Shaman surrenders his physical form to the power of the elements, gaining the ability to transform into a being of raw elemental energy for 15 sec.

Restoration:
While in the form of a Water Ascendant, all healing done is duplicated and distributed evenly among nearby allies and spells cast have an X% chance to grant (X+SP) mana.

I don't see this as being that unbalanced....

[Nebria]

Using some cd that was made to provide some other buff and give him also some mana regen tool is not really a good idea.
The same problem as glyphed elemental mastery to get incoming dmg reducing.

The problem is when you use it for regen you waste the primary buff as you might not need it at that moment.
If you use the cd for the primary buff you might not get a lot of use from the regen buff.

However I like your Ascendance idea. The Glyph one not so much as you would have another glyph you might have to use to fix a regen problem which should be handled baseline.

[Cynical Person]

I see what you mean for the Glyph but I would very much like someone at blizzard to see the ascendance thing.

I got the idea from the heroic trinket but it really would help a lot to have a personal mana cd along with our tide...

[anothdae]

Using some cd that was made to provide some other buff and give him also some mana regen tool is not really a good idea.
The same problem as glyphed elemental mastery to get incoming dmg reducing.

The problem is when you use it for regen you waste the primary buff as you might not need it at that moment.
If you use the cd for the primary buff you might not get a lot of use from the regen buff.

That is what makes it interesting / fun. To have to choose and balance things, and the choices shouldn't all be easy.

Think about the spriest ability dispersion. You have to be paying attention and think carefully about when you want to use it, and that makes the game fun, those choices. Think about the spirit wolves, a little closer to home, both defensive and offensive at the same time, you have to make a choice as to when to use them and for what.

Choices arent bad, quite the opposite. I would much rather have to choose when and how to best use a mana regen tied to another ability than just have a straight mana regen ability that it is a no brainer to use.

[Cynical Person]

So can we agree this is a decent idea?


Someone post it to the wow forums. D:

[Nebria]

That is what makes it interesting / fun. To have to choose and balance things, and the choices shouldn't all be easy.

I know what you mean. But I don't like a near mandatory glyphs to "repair" a serious reg problem. If there is one at all. It is better they fix it without to depend on a specific Glyph or Talent. And you know what it makes much more fun if you can look for a Glyph without knowing "I have to take it damn it the other one is so cool"
The Ascendence idea is better as it is a skill you already get and will use. It is questionable if it really helps to address a reg problem (if there is one^^). I guess they will play with active reg from water shield if they have to buff something.

Ok you could argument you just have to use the glyph until you mana reg get better with better gear. Yes thats true. And what about PvP? If there is the same problem here you might not have the freedom to use that glyph. As you know there is already a common complain that some glyphs should be baseline as they are needed for serious PvP. We have so much Glyphs but a lot feel mandatory. You won't add one to that list really.

Another skill they could buff could be MTT. A lot of restro shamans want a second affect which benefits the caster only. So perhaps they should seriously think about it. Endus said all other healers have to be balanced around having no MTT (which is true) or else it will be mandatory. Perhaps it is time to just give the restro shamans what they want there. Don't know what the problem is to gave the shaman an increased bonus off MTT.

[Migrin]

Ascendance is a througput cd. We shouldn't have to use our throuputs cds in order to assure we are not running out of mana. I am not playing the beta currently, but if it really is the case, that we need additional mp5, they should either improve the mp5 component of watershield or our base will scaling.

[Deleted]

So can we agree this is a decent idea?

No, it's not. Have you even done raid testing of any sort before even saying there is a problem?

[Tiberria]

They would never add a glyph like that, because it would be mandatory, and mandatory glyphs go against their design intent. I also don't like the tying a CD like that to SWG; SWG is something you should have to use when you need to heal while moving; it isn't necessarily a time you will be casting a lot of high mana cost spells. I always hated the T13 4pc's tie in with SWG for the same reason.

I don't think they really need to do anything fancy, especially at this stage of the Beta. They can easily fix it with reduced mana costs, increasing Water Shield base regen further, or buffing Resurgence or Mana Tide Totem (or adding additional self only regen to Mana Tide).

[looorg]

Instead of trying to come up with new gimmicks you could just solve the problem by giving resto shamans access to Thunderstorm, or a version of it. Then we'll have a solo/ego mana regen ability on command - more or less like every other class? Perhaps rename it to something with water or rain such as invigorating rain (a little raincloud could appear over my head and follow me around and filling my blue bar with goodness), increase/double the cooldown and remove remove the dmg and knockback. Tada! But I guess that would just be to simple instead they'll just keep tweaking the numbers on water shield, eventually they'll get it right ...

[Keiyra]

Or you know, the simplest of all solutions. Buff water shield, and/or buff Resurgence, and/or give an additional selfish benefit from mana tide like they used to have.

[blackblade]

Can't bake mana-regen into a glyph (unless it comes at a tradeoff) -> Glyphs are supposed to be entirely optional.

I would say the smartest way would be a tweak to water sheild's passive regen, or do a mild reduction to costs.

If you want to hit buttons to gain mana, that's a different concern: You want more control over your mana regeneration.



The goal, however, is not to never be OOM.
Players need to be smart about avoiding damage, healers have to be smart about healing unavoidable damage.

Shamans aren't the only class complaining about mana.

[Tiberria]

Shamans aren't the only class complaining about mana.

Every healing class has the ability to go OOM; Shaman just go OOM faster than any other healer. We don't only have to deal with healers in general having severe mana constraints; we also have to deal with the fact that our regen also isn't competitive with that of other healers. The lack of a PW:Solace/Seal of Insight/Mana Tea type of ability to regen mana when you run out at the expense of GCDs really hurts as well. On top of that, Shaman throughput is by far the weakest of any healing class on an aggregate level, and the discrepancy is larger than it was when Cata was first released.

[Aviators]

I don't want Spiritwalker's Grace tied to being a Mana CD. I want to use when I need to cast while moving.

[Hursey]

Sorry, mixing regen and throughput and/or utility just doesn't work. 90% of the time you will waste either your throughput or regen bonus so you can have the otherside of the coin.

Kind of happened a bit in T13 with the resto 4pc. People where poping SWG for the haste, but then didn't have it for the moblity. Fortuantly due to the encounters it wasn't that bigger deal but still.

Also by baking regen into glyphs will make them mandatory eliminating the choice

[Deleted]

Shamans aren't the only class complaining about mana.

Noones complaining about healers needing to care about mana. the problem is that shamans simply have to take a lot more care so in the end, they will heal for less and that means that other healers are better. I'd have no problem if other healers had about the same problems as shamans.

[Zues]

Buff resurgence and water shield mp5 to appropriate levels.

[Protoman]

Here are my suggestions to fix Resto's mana problems:

• -Reduce mana costs some, maybe add mechanics to make spells cheaper like our ULE ELW could make next spell cost 50% less mana or something (depends on if we still have mana problems after these other fixes below are put in place)
  
  
• -Buff passive Mp5 on WS even more. Of the total regen that comes from WS, shift it more towards the passive mp5 than the damage orb procs, so the regen is more constant and less variable when there is raid damage around.
  
  
• -Resurgence changed. No longer based on crit. By not being crit based, our regen isn't as dependent on gear and too many scaling factors like crit or spirit which leads to poor regen at start (when you rely on it most) for better regen later.....and instead have a more constant/reliable/predictable flow of mana procs. Also, by not being based on crit you won't have the problem of Healing Surge becoming more efficient then GHW cause higher crit gives more mana back.
  
  I have two suggestions: The first is more similar to our current Resurg but a set %chance to proc instead of whatever your crit is, and based on %mana with GHW/HW's group giving double the mana of next highest group which is HS/rip/elw, to push GHW/HW as our more efficient "go to" heals. The second suggestion is more like a ppm deal and procs off any heal with a high %chance, low icd, and low-medium %mana. The idea here to give a steady flow of mana that procs basically every 12 sec or whatever ICD works.
  
  1. Now just a standard 20-30% chance, with GHW/HW giving back say 6% mana, HS/Rip/ELW giving back 3% mana, and CHL giving back 2% mana. (numbers can be adjusted)
  
  2. Alternative Resurgence idea: Any heal will proc a %mana, say 5%mana, on a 60% chance with an ICD (maybe like 12 sec?)...(numbers can be adjusted)
  
  
• -Mana Tide Totem improved. Our MTT gives the weakest mana back of all mana CD's and is gimped because of the group benefit, so if it were to give double the mana it currently does that would probably still be balanced for Resto but OP for any other healer and so it's return is limited. This really needs to be changed, since this is Resto's ONLY mana CD and we rely on it so it should prioritize our mana needs first before the raids since other healers have their own CD's and mechanics to sustain mana.
  
  I made my additions based on %mana instead of Spirit because %mana gives more reliable and guaranteed amount, which makes it easier to balance so its solid regen from the start. I also think it should have same overall regen amount but take less time, only 10-12 sec instead of 16 for PVP since totem dies quickly so half the effect is lost if it drags out much longer then 10 sec, condensing the effect will give you better chance to get most of the benefit before it is killed. I have two suggestions here:
  
  1. MTT gives a personal benefit to Resto. So something like "Shaman gets personal +10%max mana back over duration. You and your party also get +200% Spirit for duration." (So assuming that 200%Spirit gives about 10%mana, this CD gives the raid 10% mana via spirit and you 20%mana cause you get the raid buff plus your own personal buff. )
  
  2. A NEW personal Mana CD for Shaman only by bringing Mana Spring Totem (MST) back. Our new MST will have a 3min CD, and return 15-18% max mana over 12 sec. Our MTT would have CD increased to 5min and could still be +200% Spirit, or some %mana, or a combo of both. (This makes our CD's similar to Priests, with Shadowfiend as personal regen and Hymn of Hope as a raid regen buff. With MST, Resto will be able to manage its own CD to time for when it needs it, while using MTT for when it's best for all healers in the raid. This is a much better CD design then trying to balance needs of both you and the raid thru only one CD.)

These simple changes would give us a more well rounded toolset for mana with an actual personal benefit for mana (either thru MTT or new MST CD), plus more consistent and reliable regen that comes at a predictable rate with the changes to Resurgence. The buffed passive mp5 and cheaper spell costs would be the final thing to adjust, depending on how much improvement is gained thru these CD/mechanics changes, but if buffed will also help give us a steady stream of mana and opportunities for cheaper casts. I really think these changes are needed, and our current mechanics are very outdated and simply not very reliable.....there is a reason all other healers have mechanics based on ppm/icd's with a set %chance and %mana.....not crit based......and they all have personal mana CD's separate from raid mana CD's if they have them, and those are based on %mana as well and not Spirit. It's just better and more effective in the long run.

[Wataurenyew]

Instead of trying to come up with new gimmicks you could just solve the problem by giving resto shamans access to Thunderstorm, or a version of it. Then we'll have a solo/ego mana regen ability on command - more or less like every other class? Perhaps rename it to something with water or rain such as invigorating rain (a little raincloud could appear over my head and follow me around and filling my blue bar with goodness), increase/double the cooldown and remove remove the dmg and knockback. Tada! But I guess that would just be to simple instead they'll just keep tweaking the numbers on water shield, eventually they'll get it right ...

It would be interesting if they created an AOE heal with a 30 yd range on a 45 sec or so CD that generated mana instead of consuming it.
It may also be a pain in the ass, but I still think it could be interesting.

I posted this in another thread, but figured it went with this thread as well.

Give us two mana regen CDs, one passive and one active that share a CD and you choose which to use.

Telluric Currents 3 min CD
For the next 3 min your LB casts will return y% mana
Shares a CD with Mana Stream Totem

Mana Stream Totem 3 min CD
Returns X% mana every 2 sec for Z sec
Shares a CD with Telluric Currents

[Chimaera]

The more they buff water shield, and therefore increase our base mana supply, the more they devalue spirit and thus make resto shaman scale worse with it. The best answer to me is to simply reduce spell costs across the board in accordance with how far behind on mana longevity resto shaman are to the rest of the healers. Problem solved.

If they are doing it correctly, to me, water shield should end up being the equivalent of the personal mana cooldown the other healers have. If it has to be more than that because resto shaman spells cost way more than for other healing specs, I feel like that strains the stat balancing.