Get rid of Hardmode raid difficulty?

[Deleted]

I agree with OP. Hardcore raiding has always been a niche. A lot of "hardcore raiders" (some are raiders only by definition) will insult those who don't care about raiding, link DPS call your a retard because you don't care about a rotation and want only to have some fun. World of Warcraft is World of Warcraft, not World of Raiding.

We are all human beings in the end ...

I'm also not quite sure if people who abuse words like 'retard', 'scrub', 'idiot', know the meaning of these words ....

[Primernova]

Scrap 10 man also. Raiding is raiding, not an oversized dungeon group. There is nothing epic about a 10 man "raid"

10 man is fine but it needs to go back on a seperate lock out and drop lower Ilevel gear again.

[Surfd]

I agree with Sulfuric, Raiding was supposed to be a challenge from the beginning of the game,

If you believe that, you honestly have no idea what the original design intent behind WoW was. Remember, WoW was designed intentionally to be an easily accessable casual friendly MMO by people who were dissatisfied with the nut crushingly difficult model that EQ used back when EQ was the main MMO on the market. Considering the current state of EQ vs WoW, and considering what happened to sub numbers when Cata tried to crank the base difficulty curve up a notch, I think it is fairly clear which option is the better of the two.

[Vorkreist]

I agree with OP. Hardcore raiding has always been a niche. A lot of "hardcore raiders" (some are raiders only by definition) will insult those who don't care about raiding, link DPS call your a retard because you don't care about a rotation and want only to have some fun. World of Warcraft is World of Warcraft, not World of Raiding.

We are all human beings in the end ...

I'm also not quite sure if people who abuse words like 'retard', 'scrub', 'idiot', know the meaning of these words ....

Your the reason this game reached this horrible state. People who want to just have "fun" and not "care about their rotation" screwing the game for those around them and bitching to blizzard for free loot and brain dead content.

[Deleted]

From a perspective where it is about not having a boss in 3 versions i would aggre, because it feels rather silly that first you kill a boss in lfr but he is actually much stronger so you kill him in normal mode but wait he hasn't unleashed his full strength so you have to kill him in heroic mode.
It just feels like these are super stupid bad guys, we want to take over the world but you can switch a switch and then we won't hit you as hard because we will only fight you in normal mode.

[Seriss]

From a perspective where it is about not having a boss in 3 versions i would aggre, because it feels rather silly that first you kill a boss in lfr but he is actually much stronger so you kill him in normal mode but wait he hasn't unleashed his full strength so you have to kill him in heroic mode.
It just feels like these are super stupid bad guys, we want to take over the world but you can switch a switch and then we won't hit you as hard because we will only fight you in normal mode.

By that logic, you could never kill a boss twice because "Hey, didn't I kill you last week already? What is this?"

[Deleted]

Yet more people who want the line of what's 'right' and 'wrong' in terms of raiding drawn at a point they're past.

"I can get 25 people each week, so therefore 10 man isn't right"
"I can do Hard modes, therefore everyone should be able, remove everything else"

All topics like this do is show how closed minded people can be, as if nothing exists outside of the tiny little bubble they live in.

[Sildor]

If anything, blizzard are more likely to introduce a new "Elite" setting and remove one of the lower options. This is already happening with 5-mans.

In TBC the 5-man normals were roughly of the same difficulty, or maybe slightly easier than heroics in MoP, and the heroics were a hard option for players who found the normals easy. This time around the challenge modes provide the exact same thing. Essentially heroic is the new normal (since half of the MoP 5-mans don't even have a normal mode, and neither do the troll heroics or 4.3 heroic in Cata), and challenge mode is the new heroic.
Raiding is already taking the same direction with normal modes being very easy, heroics are hard but gradual nerfs seem to be a rule rather than the exception for all instances by now, and there are new "Elite" modes, like doing the content without the aid of the gradual nerf. Wait another expansion and normal modes might be completely gone like with 5-mans.

[Shink]

They want multiple difficulties so they can just release one raid and say "here you go, enjoy for a year while we work on another patch that will last you another year"

[Soxoffender]

Your ideas are intriguing to me and I wish to subscribe to your newsletter.

[Deleted]

They want multiple difficulties so they can just release one raid and say "here you go, enjoy for a year while we work on another patch that will last you another year"

I'm curious if you actually believe this, because there's no evidence that this is where they're headed and there's also no logic to them even thinking this way.....

Essentially this is just you making stuff up and posting it in quotes as if that stops the entire idea being stupid, which it doesn't btw

[Nekovivie]

Being in a guild thats only interested in heroic modes, normals just seem like a waste of time, a needless step on the road to unlocking heroic.

I would be in favour of just LFR + Heroic.

[Tigerlady]

10 mans shouldn't be considered raiding. They should be called "squadrons" or something.

You know what you said -Azshira

[fangless]

I only mentioned keeping LFR just because it's completely obvious they won't scrap the idea after having put so much effort into it.

But normal/heroic mode just seems unnecessary. Back in BC/Vanilla, fights were fights. You thought a fight was hard, because maybe it was. You didn't think, well maybe they should split up the instance, remove some abilities, and THEN we could kill it. You just got better, and accomplished things. You didn't feel like you were forced into heroic bosses because they didn't exist, you just said "This boss is difficult".

Did people think Muru was hard? Yes. Did we think that it was unfair there was no easy version of him (nerfs aside!)? No. You just raided.

[Toxigen]

There should only be one raiding difficulty, hard.

This man speaketh the truth:

http://flavortextlore.wordpress.com/...ecline-of-wow/

[mitbrandir]

Unless they make the standart difficulty equal to first time Cthun kill for a raid group , maybe , otherwise no. There has be a difference between someone who doesn't know what he's doing and between someone who does know what he's doing.

[Halym]

10 mans shouldn't be considered raiding. They should be called "squadrons" or something.

Shitposting detected.

Warning: The above is also "shitposting" btw. -Azshira

[cherb]

Is it so hard to realize there is a very very wide array of commitment time and skill in the 9 million subs for WoW? I will give you an analogy: my beer league hockey.

There are 7 different levels. From A to EEE.

Do you think that the players currently in C would like to go up against a team in A and get destroyed 22 - 0? The guys in A are ex-semi pro players. The guys in C are average Joes that played organized hockey till they were 18 and got fat. Your answer seems to be: well they just need to get in shape and learn to play more hockey.

Nope, not the point, they play hockey for fun. The guys in A find it fun to work out and play hockey at such an advanced level, the guys in C might have a single practice a month for the heck of it.

A is World First heroic raiding. B C D E is midcore and all in between (aka most of you folks) EE and EEE is raid finder. I play beer league hockey in an EE team and a C team. I don't try very hard in EE, I try my hardest in C.

You shouldn't get the same trophies for being shitty and not wanting to improve.

[Rakoth]

You shouldn't get the same trophies for being shitty and not wanting to improve.

What trophies? You mean the fact that the A league get's to have Heroic Loot, they get to have their name posted in various WoW websites? They get to be envied by the players in leagues B and C? They get to earn their realm first kills, if not world to 10? They get to say they are the top 300 players in the world? Ohh my, if that's not enough for them.

B C D E get's to have their "heroic" and "normal" level gear, those are your trophies. Mounts, titles, better stats, higher DPS to show off.

EE get's to have raid finder gear and get to be looked down by the other 6 tiers.

You should be able to play the game you want to, and enjoy yourself, even if you don't want to improve.

As a child, if you won a competition, did it frustrate you that others would get "participation medal"? In that sense, does it bother you that there are different levels of education? The graduate from Harvard and the graduate from Kalamazoo community college in business get a diploma, a "trophy". The harvard grad get's a better "trophy" then the community college grad. Maybe that comparison will hit closer to home.

[Sierra85]

its sort of like the reason they removed normal mode dungeons at max level?