Mists Fury Warrior Guide

[Ascar]

Are you talking about TG here? Because unless you are, I really doubt upgrading my weapons is going to make up for the difference. Currently my shockwave hits 50% harder than my Wild Strike. Tested on live that is.

It's funny that you're asking about TG, as SMF wildstrike hits harder than tg's with the 35% offhand dmg boost^^. As i said, it's highly gear dependent, but for bis gear they are definitly close.


About the gaining rage thingy.

Yeah, i think you are mistaken there. You somehow think, if you save rage in CS you have more rage to spend in general, but thats just not true.

I think you agree that our overall ragepool for a fight doesn't change by the usage of shockwave, as it does not generate or cost any rage.

If you save out 30 rage on a ws or 10 rage on an RB or procced WS by using shockwave during the CS window you will still be able to utilise this rage after the CS ends.

Yes that's right, that's why we do not lose rage by using shockwave, but we are still not gaining any additional rage, we're just spending it at some less beneficial point. You are somehow thinking that you gain rage by doing something without a rage cost during a gcd. Thats not the case. It's just like you do not actually gain more rage by waiting 1 GCD. The ragebar fills because you are just not spending any.

So obviously we will spend the rage we save during CS somewhere outside of CS, but that doesn't mean we spend more rage, just the same amount of rage at a different time or with different abilities.


Just to make the point how much the better cooldown stacking influences dragonroar exactly clear. The cooldown stacking on DR will make this ability about 70-100% better than used without cd stacking, throughout the whole fight. That Bloodbath, Synapse Springs and DR all lie on 1 min cd and the others are off the gcd, is just godlike. You have to think DR always triggers 30% extra dmg on bloodbath, gets full benefit of 1920 strength of synapse strings, gets nearly always the 3000 strength procc of relic of xuen (55 icd, proccs aprox every 60sec!), in a 6min fight benefit of 1/3 strength pot. (with prepot) and 1/3 guaranteed Skullbanner dmg boost. All of these effect SW just for 1/3rd. Also your meta socket is a guaranteed 3% dmg bost on DR.

30% dmg bloodbath, 10% dmg from crit boost, 6255 additional average bonus strength for DR in current gear. (at 44k attackpower bis geared raidbuffed, 6255 str should be roughly a 35% attackpower gain).

For SW you got: 10% dmg bloodbath, 3,3% / ~35% critchance(w. avg reck) => ~1% crit dmg boost, 2085 additional average strength (15% ap), and a 7% extra crit with unglyphed reck t14 2pc.


So instead of ~93% dmg boost , we are looking at about ~37% dmg boost on SW. So without consideration of cooldowns, SW needs to do significantly more damage than DR to be worth using. (This is just a rough estimate from the above and the % is not entirely correct, but for the sake of the argument it's sufficient.)


edit:
@reptiel
i just checked your armory and i really don't see the reason why your shockwave does so significantly more damage than your wildstrike. Yes your gear is ~20 ilvl above your weapons that significant and shockwave should do more damage than ws at it scales better with attackpower but not with weapon dps. But 50% seems way to much even raidbuffed. Also your raging blow mainhand hit should be close behind shockwave, but way better if you add the raging blow offhand hit. Did you forget that?

I tested it for myself on life and WS/SW are pretty close for me, during enrage + colossus and without, though WS has a wide dmg gap (min to max) and shockwave does always the same amount. RB mainhand + offhand is way better than sw for me.

[Maxie]

I am kinda confused, SimCraft shows that the hit is main stat priority both in my gear, and bis, may be it is because i ran Patchwerk-like simulations?

I assume it measures the below 7,5% value of hit.

Just went out and tried Shockwave on a dummy (highly scientific, I know), and initial reacton after getting used to it is:

1: You can't count every Shockwave as being affected by CS, there are other attacks that are higher in priority and that can push it back a couple of GCD:s and once it's out of sync with CS, it's out of sync for a good while...

2: Total DPS felt about the same as DR. Can easily be accounted for by player error or RNG.

3: I felt like with Shockwave I ended up delaying procced wild strikes so much that sometimes the procc fell off. Has happened before without it but it was a lot more frequent with SW.

All in all, it felt clunkier for the same result or slightly less. Might just be me not being entirely used to having SW, however. And I really do like the synergy between DR and Blood Bath. So I'll probably stick to that, for now.

Note: might be the armory being weird or w/e but it shows your gloves as unenchanted and a missing tinker thingy on the back, Reptiel. Just mentioning it since I realized after about a week that I hadn't added an extra socket to my gloves. Derp.

[nyjl]

I assume it measures the below 7,5% value of hit.

Yepp, that was the problem, once i've cheked "only positive deltas" everything became fine. Thanks.

[Ochron]

Reptile, I'm looking at your guide and I think you've made some mistakes. Namely your value for RB. It would seem you're only looking at RB Main Hand damage instead of adding Main Hand and Off Hand damage. Otherwise, your Raging Blows are super weak. Running a Sim has my Average MH RB at 80k and my Average OH RB at 44k....

Honestly, DR is the better choice because it takes up less GCDs and you don't need to waste CS debuffs to use it. In fact, doing so is stupid. Shockwave needs to land inside CSmash everytime for it to be competitive with DR and by doing this you waste a GCD inside CSmash everytime.

[Maxie]

Reptile, I'm looking at your guide and I think you've made some mistakes. Namely your value for RB. It would seem you're only looking at RB Main Hand damage instead of adding Main Hand and Off Hand damage. Otherwise, your Raging Blows are super weak. Running a Sim has my Average MH RB at 80k and my Average OH RB at 44k....

Honestly, DR is the better choice because it takes up less GCDs and you don't need to waste CS debuffs to use it. In fact, doing so is stupid. Shockwave needs to land inside CSmash everytime for it to be competitive with DR and by doing this you waste a GCD inside CSmash everytime.

I sort of feel that too. It's not very rare to have 1-2 RB and a bloodsurge procc available during the CS anyway. And as I've said before, I just love the Bloodbath - DR synergy.

[nyjl]

What's with BiS list? What tier pieces should we get?

[Ochron]

I have to look at this again, but I'm pretty sure this list is our BiS

Helmet of Resounding Rings
Necklace of Congealed Weaknesses
Shoulderpads of Misshapen Life
Cloak of Peacock Feathers
Battleplate of Resounding Rings
Bracers of Defiled Earth
Gauntlets of Resounding Rings
Patroller's Girdle of Endless Spring
Legplates of Resounding Rings
Jasper Clawfeet
Ring of the Bladed Tempest
Dread Shadow Ring
Relic of Xuen
Lei Shin's Final Orders
Shin'ka, Execution of Dominion< TG
Kilrak, Jaws of Terror<SMF

[Maxie]

This might be a stupid question, but it has been in my head for a while. I have glyphed recklessness, so there's a decent while of my recklessness that is during the "rage build up phase". While the high crit rate does give me some RB:s and some extra rage, I'm wonderwing whether I should try to use as many abilities as possible during this time period, or to build up some rage for the next Colossus Smash. Basically reck vs CS, which is the biggest multiplier of damage?

[Requiel]

I have to look at this again, but I'm pretty sure this list is our BiS

Helmet of Resounding Rings
Necklace of Congealed Weaknesses
Shoulderpads of Misshapen Life
Cloak of Peacock Feathers
Battleplate of Resounding Rings
Bracers of Defiled Earth
Gauntlets of Resounding Rings
Patroller's Girdle of Endless Spring
Legplates of Resounding Rings
Jasper Clawfeet
Ring of the Bladed Tempest
Dread Shadow Ring
Relic of Xuen
Lei Shin's Final Orders
Shin'ka, Execution of Dominion< TG
Kilrak, Jaws of Terror<SMF

With SMF its better to have Scimitar of Seven Stars In your off hand and not double jaws.

[Ochron]

With SMF its better to have Scimitar of Seven Stars In your off hand and not double jaws.

For what reason, exactly? How I see it is that both weapons do the same exact damage and have the same stats besides the fact that Kilrak has +40 more of both. Only difference between the two is the gem slot. So, it comes down to what exactly is the current conversion rate between Agi and Crit? Will 500 Agi beat out 320 Crit?

I guess I'll need to run sims or something to figure out what that conversion rate is, huh?

Although, it does seem unreasonable for Agi= .64 Crit. So, I guess that is where you are coming from with that comment.

[Freedom]

Uh, Sha Crystals are Unique Equipped like the JC gems so you cannot get an Agi and Str gem at the same time, otherwise dual wield specs like SMF/DW Frost/TG/Enh/DW WW/Rogues (lol) would shit all over everyone with the extra 500 stats, even if they are not your primary stat. So since there's no difference in weapon damage and you can toss a Piercing, or more likely Smooth because the socket bonus is nothing noteable, gem into the gem socket Scimitar would handily beat Kilrak.

Not to mention snapping up not one but 2 heroic end-boss weapons that have a Sha-Touched gemslot would be a rather dickish move when people still need one.

[Ochron]

Ah, for whatever reason I was thinking that each gem was Unique Equipped and not the gem that is cut into the specific gem. Aka- Crystallized Horror Unique instead of Crystal of Fear Unique. That is my bad, folks.

[tenj]

world of logs is broken so can someone tell me how much there pulling on heroic Gara'jal and if they changed there reforging in anyway.

[IpAriaHI]

Im having a hard time keeping my rage pooled before a CS to get a really good dump phase. I stay sub 30 rage a lot of the time (yes, exp and hit capped) and sometimes can't even get a second filler in on a regular rotation when BS doesn't proc. What are some mistakes may I be committing to have such low rage?

[Saevus.Reptile]

Reptile, I'm looking at your guide and I think you've made some mistakes. Namely your value for RB. It would seem you're only looking at RB Main Hand damage instead of adding Main Hand and Off Hand damage. Otherwise, your Raging Blows are super weak. Running a Sim has my Average MH RB at 80k and my Average OH RB at 44k....

Honestly, DR is the better choice because it takes up less GCDs and you don't need to waste CS debuffs to use it. In fact, doing so is stupid. Shockwave needs to land inside CSmash everytime for it to be competitive with DR and by doing this you waste a GCD inside CSmash everytime.

Wow yes, this is quite embarrassing. I don't know why I missed out on that! Thanks a lot for pointing it out. I humbly apologize for the mistake and I'll have it updated asap.

---------- Post added 2012-10-22 at 06:32 AM ----------

On the Dragon Roar thing I'm inclined to start believing it might actually be better. I'll be running a ton of LFRs on live today checking both abilities out in every situation again and seeing how DR fits into the rotation.

---------- Post added 2012-10-22 at 06:36 AM ----------

Note: might be the armory being weird or w/e but it shows your gloves as unenchanted and a missing tinker thingy on the back, Reptiel. Just mentioning it since I realized after about a week that I hadn't added an extra socket to my gloves. Derp.

The armory doesn't seem to show the engineering enchant on gloves. On the back well, I never use a parachute or glider anyways so I doubt it's going to make a difference anywhere.

[meteo]

world of logs is broken so can someone tell me how much there pulling on heroic Gara'jal and if they changed there reforging in anyway.

I can only tell you what my recount was showing (quite inaccurate although the own recount tracks nearly correctly). I did not change reforges but we didn't kill him yet and I had the highest totem priority (10man!)

Whenever we reached the enrage, my DPS was usually +-5k around 100k (I would have gone higher without the enrage and more executes. So higher DPS is possible)

Armory



EDIT: Why don't people believe me when I tell them to use HL more? Just saw a 255k crit yesterday

[Saevus.Reptile]

I've recently been thinking about charge.

2 possibilities:

1) During the execute phase would it be beneficial to go out of melee range and charge back in whenever possible? At worst this is going to delay an MH/OH swing by 1 second or so. Doing it right after the MH swing pretty much allows you to avoid delaying that portion alltogether.

And if (1) is a damage increase then:

2) Would Bull rush glyph in this case further increase these benefits? On a single target fight it could replace Heroic leap glyph. On more multi-target oriented fights it could replace unending rage.


Obviously both (1) and (2) would have to happen in fights where the damage income isn't so huge that you can practically spam execute (like on Elegon).

[Maxie]

Next valor point item? Was thinking belt.

Armory: http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/characte...ricatus/simple

Oh and also, if I have 1-2 RB + a BS procc available during a CS, and I'm already enraged, should I push back BT?

[Ascar]

About pooling 1 RB stack before using BT->CS and risking a RB stack overflow / delaying CS.

Boss armor with Sunderarmor active reduced physical damage by 32%. (tested on live raid dummy). In other words, bypassing all armor is a 47% damage increase.

As long as your chance of losing a RB stack by overstacking (BT+CS line crit) is lower than the dmg gain by using a garanteed additional RB instead of WS/SW pooling 1 RB stack before BT->CS is definitly worth it.

At 25% critrate raidbuffed the chance of overstacking RB with 1 stack by doing BT->CS is 12,5%. So in every 8th CS you loose an RB stack, while still having CS with 2 RB stacks. A 47% dmg increase means roughly, if you do 2 more RB during CS instead of outside CS, you made up for 1 RB stack. At 25% crit you will gain dmg equally to 3,5 RB without CS while loosing 1 RB without CS, winning effectivly 2,5 RB.
Well the dmg increase is can't be measured as exactly 2,5 RB in this case, as we would use other abilities during CS without the additional RB's, but as WS/HS cost 30sec, do significantly less damage and in every situation you just procc 1 or 0 RB by doing BT->CS this will save you rage in CS. So just looking at the abilities, without considering the higher chances for better Bloodbath/CD burst phases, this is a really good dps gain.
Chances at 30% crit raidbuffed (bis gear) would be 18% for overstacking. Should still be highly valueable dps gain.

The harder question is, if it's better pooling 1 RB then BT(crit)->RB->CS-> or BT(crit)->risk CS->. As you would still guarantee 1 RB during CS debuff and avoid risking 1 RB stack. Though in this scenario you delay your CS by 1 GCD, you are using one more weak BT during CS and if you are always using the delay approach you'll be able to do 1 CS less in a 6minute fight at 30% crit, because BT is the skill with double crit chance and cs the low crit spell.

I'm absolutly prefering the risk approach, it results in more CS with 2 or more RB useable and thereby also increases the chances for better CS. It makes rage pooling easier for CS because chances you will have to do 2 WS for 30 rage in a CS are significantly lower and you have better chances for good Bloodbath/CD bursts. (the value for 1 additional RB used during Bloodbath/Synapsesprings + CS is even higher than just measuring RB during CS vs RB w/o CS + WS in CS)


So i recommend always pooling one RB stack before BT->CS (if reck is on cd!) and just risk losing one RB stack with double crits. More CS phases with higher hitting abilities is worth losing 1 Raging Blast without CS and cooldown!

[Jakesterwars]

Next valor point item? Was thinking belt.

Armory: http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/characte...ricatus/simple

Oh and also, if I have 1-2 RB + a BS procc available during a CS, and I'm already enraged, should I push back BT?

Belt would be your best bet because it's the only "good" one until Heart of Fear/Terrace of the Springs come out.