Paragon just killed Will of the Emperors on heroic.

[Deleted]

there's this amazing thing called video evidence and statistics. Look at the difference in mechanics.

When did I saw it was easy? I said 25 man raiding is more difficult than 10 man raiding, thats it. Stop putting words in my mouth.

He may have put a few words in your mouth but the foam got there on it's own.

[Varyk]

You didn't even clear the relevant content of T11 (the hard content of Cata) and haven't even seen a heroic of the new tier. Please stop talking and making yourself seem stupid. Go back to T13 where they handed you 8/8.

I wasn't even raiding seriously then? I guess Ragnaros heroic was easy? (hardest boss up to that point) You're ridiculous.

We're 6/6 you moron...we switched to 10 for will (because we ran out of time and it's easier). we spent all day tuesday on stone guard. check wow progress dipshit.

---------- Post added 2012-10-11 at 04:19 PM ----------

or its because its just easier to get 10 people together rather than 25? just a thought

Of course it is.

Infracted

[Deleted]

Cool, I am still waiting to see who gets the real world first though.

[Stommped]

That explains why no 10-man guild other than them is more than 2/6 heroic. Yep. Obvious Truth.

The obvious truth is that 10-man is harder since only one guild in the world has managed to beat more than 2 heroic fights. That's what the evidence supports.

But you haven't even attempted ANY heroic fight yet, so obviously you know what you're talking about.

You are a fucking moron.

Infracted~

[Varyk]

He may have put a few words in your mouth but the foam got there on it's own.

Excuse me for not letting people walk all over me in a forum and try to suggest I said something when I didn't.

[Soisoisoi]

I'll just quote what I put on their Facebook page:

So about the 10v25 thing.
25man is harder:
*Because you have to get more people and keep them organized.
*Potential for more mistakes (see first point of 10man)

10man is harder because:
*If someone dies, that's a bigger percentage of your raid gone.
*You have less cooldowns.
*You have less buffs.
*Less ability to class stack.

It's not hard to organize a 25man (relative to 10man) when you have a group of amazing players who work well together, sure in 25mans there's more potential to make mistakes, but even if one person dies you still have 24 others to make up for it. If someone dies in a 10man only 9 people can make up for it. Fights with extreme healing or dps requirements will emphasise this.

Ya'know, if the 25mans were tuned properly with the scaling of HP/damage/etc from 10 to 25, then 10man would be harder. If anything I'd say they are about equal because they're not tuned exactly like that though. Excluding obviously over or under-tuned fights for either of course. Agree or not, I really don't see why everyone is shouting "25man is harder, who cares". Paragon are an amazing guild, like many others. If you don't care for Paragon any more why are you here, trolling?

OT: Grats Paragon, world first for this raid.

[Trakanonn]

And how many top guilds were they racing? ZERO

Congrats....

[dokilar]

Of course it is.

so getting the extra 15 people together to do 25 mans is now part of the criteria for determining how hard content is? im confused

[DistortionSleep]

Lol Paragon claimed 10 man's to be easier through out Cataclysm and all the Paragon groupies agreed with them. Now that they are 10 man only, and 10 man is claimed to be easier the same groupies are jumping down there throats. Imbeciles!

[Deleted]

Grats to Paragon on their kill, be interesting to see if the other guilds catch up once the next raids launches.

[Eadoin]

I'm curious how the guild who publicly claimed 10 mans were never apart of the 'true race' handles a world first 10 man clear.

Also, to be fair, the argument that there's less guilds past 2/16H on 10s and 25s is a pretty lousy excuse for trying to claim 10s are harder than 25s. It's well documented that Paragon is the first of the "world elite" guilds to do so in 10 man, so obviously there's going to be more progressed 25 man guilds. Based on the normal modes this tier clearly favours 10 mans but Heroic could very well be a different story and we won't really know where the two difficulties are until we see the 'not-top-world' guilds start killing Heroics.

[Irielle]

Seriously this 25 vs 10m shit is getting really old. THEY TOOK 10 OF THE BEST, IF NOT -THE- BEST PLAYERS IN THE WORLD. They carry NO ONE. When you have a perfect team, you get perfect results. Is that so hard for people to grasp. Perfection is just that, perfection. It doesnt mean that 10 is easier. This discussion is SO old.

[Varyk]

so getting the extra 15 people together to do 25 mans is now part of the criteria for determining how hard content is? im confused

No, it isn't. Not directly anyways. You have to manage all of these extra abilities and cooldowns tho. You have 4-8 healers worrying about 25 people instead of 2-4 healers worrying about 10. Obviously healers have roles, but you still have to keep everyone alive. This argument is getting ridiculous tho. I said i felt 25s are harder than 10 (i didnt say 10 was easy and 25 was hard, or anything of the sort).

[Deleted]

Great job and probably from the "skill requirement per individual" on the same level or even higher than 25. However, now that they got their world first after a looooooong lack of progress raids and failing tier 13, I'm kind of hoping that they would revert their decision and go back to 25 for the next instances. Get some people back, recruit some more, maybe even merge with another Finnish guild. It could work, it could fail, in any case it would make the next race a whole lot more interesting.

[Unknown User]

there's this amazing thing called video evidence and statistics. Look at the difference in mechanics.

And statistics say 10 man is harder going by how many guilds have gotten past 2/6 on both modes relative to how many guilds there are on either mode.

When did I saw it was easy? I said 25 man raiding is more difficult than 10 man raiding, thats it. Stop putting words in my mouth.

"significantly easier on 10 man"
You could have said "significantly harder on 25 man", but you just had to phrase it to make it sound like 10 man raiders are inferior.

[Tanex]

I wasn't even raiding seriously then? I guess Ragnaros heroic was easy? (hardest boss up to that point) You're ridiculous.

We're 6/6 you moron...we switched to 10 for will (because we ran out of time and it's easier). we spent all day tuesday on stone guard. check wow progress dipshit.

---------- Post added 2012-10-11 at 04:19 PM ----------



Of course it is.

You didn't even face Rag when he was hard, you finally downed him probably getting carried post triple nerf. Pretty sad if you ask me, not something to brag about. All day and no kill, what a joke. If you didn't have crap players maybe you'd down some content, but that's ok; least you're not 10m right?

If your guild isn't top 100 US in any mode... you can't say anything.

[Alusen]

Guys the 10vs25 is getting old, I personally don't care if you believe that it counts or not but lets not get this thread locked because it just becomes a flame war.

OT, grats to Paragon great to see them still doing well.

[Rukentuts]

Yea and you are the most stupid from them all. In 25-man you can stack more classes and combat resses etc etc. And if one player dies it isn't so crucial as 25-man as it is in 10-man.

Uh...stacking combat resses died a long time ago.

[Cereyeth]

10 man, nobody cares.

[Hubbl3]

And how many top guilds were they racing? ZERO

Congrats....

Yep, they should go back to 25 man :< in 10 man there is no competition