Why is conservatism considered right-wing?

[Valanna]

This is disgusting. Get this spin garbage off the forums.

I agree, they're also about hindering progress in cancer research and deprive homosexuals and women of their rights.

[Deleted]

From Wikipedia:


Shouldn't conservatism be a branch for itself in that case? I can understand that it's right-wing in the US, but in other countries, such as eastern European countries, wouldn't conservatism be considered left-wing since the past was communist, and today more and more is being privatized, thus society turning more and more right-wing?

no - because the russian revolution which moved the country toward communism took the country away from the tsar system, where the kings and nobility held all the power and wealth - to be conservative in that sense would have been to support the tsar system -

[Catta]

This thread is about the generalized conservative movement, not a minority of extremists.
No, the vast majority of conservatives do not seek to discriminate based on sexual orientation, gender, or religion. Your bias is showing very heavily.

If they arent they are either apathetic or unable to prevent the minority from forcing the party in that direction. Its plain to see...

[Deleted]

Communism is left-wing. People growing up in the Soviet Union grew up with left-wing ideals. If conservatism means retaining politics of the past it means that conservative eastern Europeans would support communist policies, thus conservatism turning left-wing over in eastern Europe.

#

the world has existed for more than 100 years...

[Valanna]

This thread is about the generalized conservative movement, not a minority of extremists.
No, the vast majority of conservatives do not seek to discriminate based on sexual orientation, gender, or religion. Your bias is showing very heavily.

I'm only referring to policies in your major conservative party and those of its recent presidental candidate. While I do admit I'm biased, I don't see any counter-arguments, only an appeal to the masses. The appeal became invalid the minute they voted for Romney, and by extension, his policies.

Sexual orientation: Gay marriage issue, very obvious.
Gender: Abortion issue, again, obvious.
Religion: Subsidies and tax-cuts to religious organizations. While it may not directly deprive you of your rights, it's certainly discriminating against those belonging to religions getting a lesser degree of benefits and those belonging to no religious organization at all.

[Skizo]

I agree, they're also about hindering progress in cancer research and deprive homosexuals and women of their rights.

Actually, the U.S. has the greatest research hospitals in the world, and they exist as a product of a very conservative and capitalistic medical system. A significant portion of cancer research money comes from wealthy donors. So no, you're pretty much flat out wrong on that point.
Just because you view what is and is not a right differently doesn't mean that they are only looking out for rich white people. Your perspective is precisely what is wrong with american politics, and you need to educate and enlighten yourself on the rationales of other people's positions.

[Wells]

Right wing policies essentially are defined by standing for inequality, either meritorious or not. Conservatism boils down to opposing change. Since the standard for most of human history has been gross inequality they line up.

[Catta]

Actually, the U.S. has the greatest research hospitals in the world, and they exist as a product of a very conservative and capitalistic medical system. A significant portion of cancer research money comes from wealthy donors. So no, you're pretty much flat out wrong on that point.
Just because you view what is and is not a right differently doesn't mean that they are only looking out for rich white people. Your perspective is precisely what is wrong with american politics, and you need to educate and enlighten yourself on the rationales of other people's positions.

But you have fallen far behind in stem cell research. People are going to China for stem cell treatments now.

[Skizo]

This thread has devolved into a kind of circle-jerk between people who hate conservatism and reinforce other people's generalizations.
I have no interest in talking to four people who have different perspectives on the same issue that all roughly agree, there's no way that could possibly be fair for me.
Continue in your mutual love of positional argument, folks.

[zpiff]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conservatism

[Catta]

This thread has devolved into a kind of circle-jerk between people who hate conservatism and reinforce other people's generalizations.
I have no interest in talking to four people who have different perspectives on the same issue that all roughly agree, there's no way that could possibly be fair for me.
Continue in your mutual love of positional argument, folks.

You ignore the several of us pointing out very specific examples that are held by the GOP, or do you consider that hating too?

[Milchshake]

Right wing policies essentially are defined by standing for inequality, either meritorious or not. Conservatism boils down to opposing change. Since the standard for most of human history has been gross inequality they line up.

Another crazy thing about current American conservatives:

They believe in infinite wealth. Everyone could get rich if rules and regulations didnt get in the way. They see no physical limitation to wealth accumulation.

But they for some reason believe freedom is a zero-sum game. By expanding or guaranteeing freedoms for minorities or under privileged, they take away rights for white christian hetero males.

Cant formalize a disable rights treaty... because then you cant home school that fetus someday.

[Daerio]

Actually, the U.S. has the greatest research hospitals in the world,

This is a lie - among many relating to our health care system - that you should refrain from spewing without supporting facts.

In the US, we grow up with this impression, somehow, that our health care system is the best in the world. We may even have the impression that it's because us 'mericans are so hard working, and capitalism works to our advantage so well. We're taught that BECAUSE we don't have socialized (evil word) medicine, we have the best system in the world.

These are lies. Compared to other first-world nations, and even some third-world nations, our health care system (including research, especially when it comes to pharmacological development) is among the worst in the world. It's because in most cases, companies make MORE money off killing people (letting them die, or suffer) than they do from curing them. Nations with socialized health care don't have this issue - they SAVE more money by curing people than treating them for their entire lives.

I would think a heavily invested right-winger (such as yourself) would know better than to even think about approaching the issue of health care. I guess not. (not that liberals in the US are above reproach either)

[Valanna]

Actually, the U.S. has the greatest research hospitals in the world, and they exist as a product of a very conservative and capitalistic medical system. A significant portion of cancer research money comes from wealthy donors. So no, you're pretty much flat out wrong on that point.

I was simply referring to the recent debacle concerning stem-cell research and how apparently it's immoral and wrong. It's the path of research in cancer that looks to be the most hopeful, so I don't see how hindering that isn't hindering progress in cancer research as a whole. What would a liberal do to stop the same wealthy donors of donating to the same research? Just because some of these donors might hold a conservative political stance doesn't mean it's a conservative political system that allows them to make donations.

Just because you view what is and is not a right differently doesn't mean that they are only looking out for rich white people. Your perspective is precisely what is wrong with american politics, and you need to educate and enlighten yourself on the rationales of other people's positions.

Very well, you've denied our claim, care to provide a counter-example or are you only going to deny it? Of course, the post that you quoted and in turn the one I quoted before that are both smug in nature, but still provide a decent picture of it all. How can I educate myself when all the rationales I get thrown at me when I do try to educate myself either appeal to scripture or a distorted view of socialism and liberalism? If that's all you've got I've got nothing to educate myself on and thereby stand by everything I say and will not apologise for it.

[Skizo]

This is a lie - among many relating to our health care system - that you should refrain from spewing without supporting facts.

http://www.bukisa.com/articles/34873...best-hospitals

The U.S. has the best hospitals in the world, that is a fact.

[Valanna]

This thread has devolved into a kind of circle-jerk between people who hate conservatism and reinforce other people's generalizations.
I have no interest in talking to four people who have different perspectives on the same issue that all roughly agree, there's no way that could possibly be fair for me.
Continue in your mutual love of positional argument, folks.

How many there are of us can hardly matter. Reverse appeal to the masses, quite interesting. As long as your thesis can be proved to be more valid than any of ours, you win. I promise, none of us will appeal to being more than you and by extension then be right. And if any of my like-minded participants do so, I shall spank them.

[Mezzolith]

They believe in infinite wealth. Everyone could get rich if rules and regulations didnt get in the way. They see no physical limitation to wealth accumulation.

I don't think they believe in it, they just parrot it to keep the plebs stupid and happy.

Picture related: http://i1.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/...11/962/027.jpg

[Valanna]

http://www.bukisa.com/articles/34873...best-hospitals

The U.S. has the best hospitals in the world, that is a fact.

And the by far most expensive health care, along with 37th (or something around there) highest quality health care. Your hospitals might be fantastic, and your research, but even if that is the case, it's not a valid counterargument to the original point.

[Catta]

http://www.bukisa.com/articles/34873...best-hospitals

The U.S. has the best hospitals in the world, that is a fact.

You do realize that the link says the majority is in North American, some of the most excellent in Europe and some in Asia right. And then it shows only those from the US on the page. So you actually dont know whether or not they are actually the best or not.

[Skizo]

How many there are of us can hardly matter.

No, it is literally a shouting box. It absolutely matters, there isn't a right in political issues, it is primarily opinions. I am presenting reasons why people think the way they think, and yet you insist on misrepresenting their positions. That's fine that you think that because I'm sure you would never speak like that in real life, but it honestly isn't worth my time.
If you want to think you are better than other people because of the way you think, go right ahead. It's quite a hateful way to think, but generalizations can't objectively be proven wrong. You can't prove that something doesn't exist.