Mega-Thread: Gun Control Thread

[Daelak]

You would think since Obama is from Chicago he would care a little more, but those kids don't get you votes, the rich white ones do.
The way wells talks about things I think he lives on a fantasy island.

He does care, the vast majority of gun related crime happens in the south-side of Chicago, a one square mile. But I guess you have a "better" idea to deal with blacks killing blacks?

[Cthulhu 2020]

Mass is a pretty anti-gun state. The populace was unable to stop a SWAT team, not that any tried, and was equally ill equipped if the terrorists had attempted a home invasion. Luckily for the home owner where the boat was, the guy was wounded and in no condition to do anything. He probably had several hours before the police got there (via call from homeowner).

It's cute that you think terrorists are going to start doing home invasions, or that a gun would have stopped the Boston Marathon bombing. Heck, there were air marshals on the 9/11 flights WITH GUNS while the plane got taken over.

[lockedout]

Mass is a pretty anti-gun state. The populace was unable to stop a SWAT team, not that any tried, and was equally ill equipped if the terrorists had attempted a home invasion. Luckily for the home owner where the boat was, the guy was wounded and in no condition to do anything. He probably had several hours before the police got there (via call from homeowner).

Did you see the picture of the supposed blood stain that he found?
There is only one spot of blood on the entire boat. None inside, NONE.
The spot of blood is on the fender of the trailer the boat is sitting on.
If he was shot twice how did he manage not to get blood ANYWHERE else on the boat?

[Daelak]

Did you see the picture of the supposed blood stain that he found?
There is only one spot of blood on the entire boat. None inside, NONE.
The spot of blood is on the fender of the trailer the boat is sitting on.
If he was shot twice how did he manage not to get blood ANYWHERE else on the boat?

Conspiracy to take our guns I bet.

[Svifnymr]

Let's outlaw pens and pencils while we're at it, makeshift shivs. Hell, the keyboard I'm typing this on might be useful as a bludgeon should the need arise. But really...

Let's go back to cars. I, and many other people, need to use cars every day. I, nor anyone I know (not counting military friends), have ever needed to use a gun. Yet, cars are just a privilege.

I guess that's still sophistry. But I see the difference.

See, we're not supposed to compare cars and guns, but folks do, so here's the comparison, we're discussing private ownership of such.

Taxi drivers/ security guards are cars/guns for hire, you don't need your own to function in society?
Buses/police, mass transit/protection for your societal needs.

There is no reason for you to privately own a vehicle, doing so contributes harm to the environment and furthers the dependance on fossil fuels.

Even if you do believe in private ownership, you certainly don't need a car that goes over 60 (magazine limit) or a sports car that serves no transportation purpose (assault weapon). In addition, drunk driving kills thousands every year, breathilizers should be requires for all car operation (safes).

[lockedout]

Iair marshals on the 9/11 flights WITH GUNS while the plane got taken over.

Source please.
I just read this a second time.
So there were air marshalls on the plane with guns that decided they would rather die than use the gun against a box cutter?

---------- Post added 2013-04-22 at 04:13 PM ----------

Conspiracy to take our guns I bet.

I don't see how that would work.

[Felya]

Source please.
I just read this a second time.
So there were air marshalls on the plane with guns that decided they would rather die than use the gun against a box cutter?

There is something that happens on a plane when a bullet pierces it's wall, that does not happen on the ground.

[lockedout]

See, we're not supposed to compare cars and guns, but folks do, so here's the comparison, we're discussing private ownership of such.

Taxi drivers/ security guards are cars/guns for hire, you don't need your own to function in society?
Buses/police, mass transit/protection for your societal needs.

There is no reason for you to privately own a vehicle, doing so contributes harm to the environment and furthers the dependance on fossil fuels.

Even if you do believe in private ownership, you certainly don't need a car that goes over 60 (magazine limit) or a sports car that serves no transportation purpose (assault weapon). In addition, drunk driving kills thousands every year, breathilizers should be requires for all car operation (safes).

I am going to again explain why comparing gun ownership to car ownership doesn't work.

You have a right to bear arms in the constitution.
Having a license to drive a car is a privelage.

[Svifnymr]

Who are you addressing on this forum specifically? Did someone claim that background checks would have stopped the Boston Bombers?

It would appear they didn't try to get guns legally, oddly enough, given that the older one at least seemed perfectly law abiding until, you know, he wasn't anymore. I'd think where they actually got the guns from would be part of this discussion, but we don't know where that was (gunshow/internet or friend of a friend or...) so can't really discuss anything I guess.

[lockedout]

There is something that happens on a plane when a bullet pierces it's wall, that does not happen on the ground.

Yeah nothing, the plane would have landed fine.
What do you think they are armed for on the plane then?
Not to use their firearm?
No one is going to choose to die.

[Thephayul]

There is something that happens on a plane when a bullet pierces it's wall, that does not happen on the ground.

its called depressurization, and its not a fatal situation. it happens from time to time.

[smelltheglove]

It would appear they didn't try to get guns legally, oddly enough, given that the older one at least seemed perfectly law abiding until, you know, he wasn't anymore. I'd think where they actually got the guns from would be part of this discussion, but we don't know where that was (gunshow/internet or friend of a friend or...) so can't really discuss anything I guess.

this reminded me, thephayul had some questions regarding gun shows and background checks, i know you are the guy with answers about it. hopefully he will ask them again

[lockedout]

this reminded me, thephayul had some questions regarding gun shows and background checks, i know you are the guy with answers about it. hopefully he will ask them again

Private sale from a collectors collection requires nothing but cash.

[Felya]

I am going to again explain why comparing gun ownership to car ownership doesn't work.

You have a right to bear arms in the constitution.
Having a license to drive a car is a privelage.

Why are there age restrictions on guns?

[Svifnymr]

The "waiting period" has probably saved more lifes than it has taken, so the point of the stories is that stupid people get killed eh?

In what possible way do you think there is any way to measure that?

If you're mad enough to go out, buy a gun, you're mad enough to wait a couple days. Waiting periods are just pointless arbitrary hindrances to inconvenience buyers.

[Felya]

Yeah nothing, the plane would have landed fine.
What do you think they are armed for on the plane then?
Not to use their firearm?
No one is going to choose to die.

No, it would be something. You are talking about 9/11 hijackers and still have the gull to say no one is going to choose to die?

[lockedout]

No, it would be something. You are talking about 9/11 hijackers and still have the gull to say no one is going to choose to die?

I don't understand. I said if there were air marshalls on the 9/11 planes they would have shot the hijackers. There is no evidence marshalls were on that plane did nothing and died because of it. If you shot holes in the plane it would land perfectly fine.

[Naxere]

Heck, there were air marshals on the 9/11 flights WITH GUNS while the plane got taken over.

I've never heard this, source?

[lockedout]

Why are there age restrictions on guns?

Depends who you are buying the gun from.
Federal law provides no age limitations with respect to the sale of a long gun or long gun ammunition by an unlicensed person.

---------- Post added 2013-04-22 at 04:26 PM ----------

I've never heard this, source?

You never heard it because he made it up.

[Svifnymr]

This whole "bad people will always be able to get a gun" think seems to be based on shaky assumptions. Its not like there is a guy on every street corner with guns under his trench coat.

If we're assuming a dedicated criminal that is going to acquire a gun for some nefarious reason, he will most likely eventually get that gun, though we can do our best to catch him beforehand or inconvenience him as much as possible beforehand.

Background checks serve a useful purpose, though I doubt any of the dedicate criminals I mentioned in the first post are caught by them.

Waiting periods though, serve no purpose.

Straw purchasers need to be prosecuted, which might happen more if it was a $1000 fine per instance rather than a 5 year felony right off the bat. Most such cases aren't even investigated though. Criminals attempting to purchase a gun should also be investigated at a minimum, and it'd be nice if the 40% of denials that are Fugitives could somehow be looked into.