Where WoW went wrong

[Deleted]

Haha. I like irony.

thats not irony thats sarcasm

[Bryntrollian]

Guilds don't kick you for being a troll / dick like they used to, are you really going to blame LFG for that ?

---------- Post added 2013-01-30 at 04:23 AM ----------

thats not irony thats sarcasm

Sarcasm = verbal irony....

[Deleted]

Guilds don't kick you for being a troll / dick like they used to, are you really going to blame LFG for that ?

a very valid argument, clearly you can speak for every guild on every server
edit: yay 1000 posts xD

[Deleted]

a very valid argument, clearly you can speak for every guild on every server
edit: yay 1000 posts xD

of which there are 5? no 6 no um.. are there still guilds?

[Bryntrollian]

a very valid argument, clearly you can speak for every guild on every server
edit: yay 1000 posts xD

Im just using what someone else stated

[Otimus]

LFD, LFR and such and such had to be made because a very small portion of the playerbase was doing content. It's actually bizarre and pathetic it took Blizzard so long to make such things, especially LFR, considering how low the attendance for such things have historically been, and how much importance they've put on those activities.


People can whine all they want about socializing and this and that, but the fact is, is most of the people saying this stuff had their own tight knit group, and didn't see what was actually happening outside of the game. The raider's bubble, or whatever, where they don't understand that only about 10% on average of the playerbase at any given time raids.

Blizzard can't keep making content forever that no one gets to see. It'd be a waste of money. The fact they did it for so long is kind of bizarre in and of itself, and shows some real poor judgement!

[Deleted]

I was thinking why EVE, that has been around longer than WoW can still be going strong and continually increasing the number of players and making the news with interesting things that happened in the game, while WoW has deteriorated into a farmville with a "community" of... lets say less than pleasant players who have a severe lack of skills combined with a severe delusions about their own greatness and entitlement.

I believe the reason is that EVE is a world where the players need to make things happen. Being a passive I-demand-to-be-entertained-and-showed-everything-for-no-effort type of player is not going to last there. It motivates, activates and engages players to come up with far greater experiences than what Blizzard can ever design and engineer into a game. WoW used to be much more like that before. The hard bosses stood there as a challenge, mocking the players to come and kill them. If you wanted to kill them, you had to organize yourself into a well managed guild, you had to build addons, you had to theorycraft and perfect your rotations, you had to commit and work as a group over a long period of time. I.e., you had to make things happen or they wouldn't. For some reason Blizzard decided that this is not "fun", and it's much more "fun" to push a button, get teleported to an instance with randoms you will never see again, then randomly smash your buttons for a short while until stuff falls over and hands you loot.

[inboundpaper]

Well, you see the front of Ironfogre is no longer the cool place to be, no wonder your alone.

[Hypro]

One thing i liek about swtor... You have a LFG tool but its from your realm..

[Lazy Gecko]

The bulk of social interaction in WoW today feels way too much like chat roulette. Meet a bunch of strangers through automated queueing systems, play for 15-30 minutes and then never see eachother again. Doesn't help that this also creeps into the persistent world through CRZ. All of this really erodes the sense of living in a virtual world and community, which was supposed to be the defining aspect of a MMORPG.

My best memories of the game will always be related to meeting other players on the same realm and bonding friendships or rivalries over the long term. Those situations became rarer and rarer as all those systems were introduced for the sake of convenience. The point of the barriers to getting to experience the content of the game was to act as a catalyst for social encounters.

I think this principle has been largely lost on Blizzard as quests, raids, etc get increasingly scripted and story-focused and making sure everyone can experience the story without having to say a single word to another player. For me, in a MMORPG the real story should be about the players that inhabit the world.

[Gilian]

Where opinions were expressed on the internet*

Except it is not an opinion. Or do you have massive social interaction in your LFD groups? "Hi" ....zerg.... "Thnx, bye." I don't even bother with that anymore because no one really cares.
Like I said to a friend, I rather play with bots who have decent performance instead of with people who go afk and slack and the only time they interact with you they are assholes. There is just no benefit to playing with other people in LFD/LFR. They only cause grief.
Only one out of twenty LFD runs I get a group or one person I like to play with but I will never see them again and most of the time there is still no social interaction.

I don't see how this is an opinion. It's also not an opinion that this game has become very easy, streamlined and automated. And it is also not an opinion that these changes have a bad effect on the community and the game. If you never experienced it differently and you are unable to think outside your own experiences then you should just not post and move on to another thread.

[Synstir]

In my opinion where wow went wrong is changing directions per xpac.

So we got cata and that xpac was very alt friendly, people leveling their alts, getting them into end game. Leveling was quite fast, little to no grinds.
Then mop hits, levelingtakes ages, dalies to grind rep and stuff..... alt unfriendly. Quite the opposite direction.

So players used to cata or joining wow find themselves with no time to achieve things.....
This is where I think wow is going wrong. Not everybody will adapt to these changes.

I understand the lack of content is what decided for mop to be grindy, all things gated behind dalilies.\
I can understand why Blizz is keeping up the argument that dailies are not mandatory.. but at the same, after all these years blizz knows exactly what their players find mandatory and what not.
They are fighting the lack of content in a way that doesn't appeal to their players (very much) and changed the direction quite a bit.
personally I believe that is the wrong way to do it.

if you change directions that radically, it will have an impact.
And I think that that is one of the biggest (not the only one though) reasons for the decline we see in subs (players).

Personally I am very curious about the impact of mop on the subs. IN the end that is where we'll be able to see how it is liked or not in the player's mind.

[Deleted]

So what you're saying is vanilla was bliss. Urgh, really?

You wouldn't last a week if the game rolled back, and you would've quit if the game hadn't rolled forwards. People that gush about Vanilla WoW are aliens to me. Once you'd reached level 60 it wasn't fun, the raids were so dreadfully easy, etc etc etc.

What the OP or author of the quote in the OP has done is thought:"Oh man, I loved WoW back then it was so much better and more fun" and what that really means is "I was a lot younger back then, the game was fresh, I had a lot of time on my hands to play and doing things for the first time is usually more fun than doing them for the five-hundredth."

Why won't the community get over this? It's like the same argument that content is getting easier. No it isn't, we're all still here after several years and we're considerably better at the game than we were before. Yes, pretty much anyone with two ounces of brain can complete LFR, but so what? If you really did play in vanilla you'd know pretty much everything up to Naxx was near enough a faceroll with a full raid (I was a raidleader during vanilla into two quaters of Naxxramas).

[Deleted]

In my opinion where wow went wrong is changing directions per xpac.

So we got cata and that xpac was very alt friendly, people leveling their alts, getting them into end game. Leveling was quite fast, little to no grinds.
Then mop hits, levelingtakes ages, dalies to grind rep and stuff..... alt unfriendly. Quite the opposite direction.

So players used to cata or joining wow find themselves with no time to achieve things.....
This is where I think wow is going wrong. Not everybody will adapt to these changes.

I understand the lack of content is what decided for mop to be grindy, all things gated behind dalilies.\
I can understand why Blizz is keeping up the argument that dailies are not mandatory.. but at the same, after all these years blizz knows exactly what their players find mandatory and what not.
They are fighting the lack of content in a way that doesn't appeal to their players (very much) and changed the direction quite a bit.
personally I believe that is the wrong way to do it.

if you change directions that radically, it will have an impact.
And I think that that is one of the biggest (not the only one though) reasons for the decline we see in subs (players).

Personally I am very curious about the impact of mop on the subs. IN the end that is where we'll be able to see how it is liked or not in the player's mind.

Yeah I can't wait to see the numbers either. Don't get me wrong I Love MoP, but I really miss the social aspect : > I'm lonely in an mmo on one of the most populated servers

[Surfd]

I was thinking why EVE, that has been around longer than WoW can still be going strong and continually increasing the number of players and making the news with interesting things that happened in the game, while WoW has deteriorated into a farmville with a "community" of... lets say less than pleasant players who have a severe lack of skills combined with a severe delusions about their own greatness and entitlement.

I believe the reason is that EVE is a world where the players need to make things happen. Being a passive I-demand-to-be-entertained-and-showed-everything-for-no-effort type of player is not going to last there. It motivates, activates and engages players to come up with far greater experiences than what Blizzard can ever design and engineer into a game.

While EvE is a nice example of a game that generally encourages player interaction (at least if you want to live in Low-Sec, High sec is every bit as carebare friendly as a WoW pve server is for the most part), trying to hold it up to WoW in the numbers category is a fairly bad idea. EvE, on it's best day, has about 1/10th the population of WoW, if that. WoW could lose EvEs entire subscriber base in subs and not even notice the loss on an appreciable level.

EvE was also designed from the ground up to be almost completely player driven in the sense that EvE lives or dies based on its in game economic model, which is powered almost 95% by player driven interactions.

As to EvE makeing the news, that is mainly because EvE has a VERY different culture from it's GM / Dev community when it comes to Player VS Player interactions. 95% of the "news" that breaks in EvE is usually in the form of what the average WoW player would consider "Guild Drama", just on an epic scale. In EvE, pretty much ANYTHING goes when it comes to PvP, up to and including things like using social-engineering to get someone placed high up in a rival guild's command structure so that they can steal the guilds assets from the guild banks and the like. As far as the Dev team in EvE is concerned, so long as you havent done something the code should prevent you from doing, every dirty trick in the book is fair game. Can you imagine what would happen if Blizzard tried something like that in WoW?

[Deleted]

My lord. Why are people so goddamn serious about this game? Play it if you like it, if you don't like it don't play it! Whats the big deal?

[Hanto]

Living in the past must suck. Idk about you, but with most guilds I join I have pictures to remember things just like that first one you linked. Accomplishments as a guild (such as a legendary) and little things like just hanging out having fun are stories that those pictures tell. Hell, on my rogue in Cata, I have pictures of my guild and I RP-walking through Stormwind strutting the daggers I had just then obtained. Just because you don't have friends to have fun with doesn't mean everyone experiences the same.

WoW is aged and there aren't a ton of MMO gamers that haven't at least tried it. People have had a taste and, based on their own presumptions (such as playstyle, community, endgame, or just plain grow out of it), either drop it or keep it. Kangodo explains the very reason why things are how they are. The community is sour when the game doesn't go their way and the vocal part of them (such as yourself) complains; where as back then the game was purely A GAME with the respect that you took it as is and made do.

[AnotherInternetOpinion]

Have a look at you guys go. This thread derailed so fast. Great. I repeat great community.

[Deleted]

Are unsocial people still blaming lf tool for them being unsocial ?

Oh gosh..

I have lost count of how many times it has been said but .. since you keep bringing up this nonsense crap i will do it too:

LFD/LFR is a tool. How you use it its up to you.

Community was better in Classic / tbc?

Dont make me laugh , if you actually lived through those times you'd know its exactly as now.

There were unsocial people back then and there are now.

Blaming LFR/LFD is just a quite childish excuse.

Anyways ... lol .

[bigrichard]

No one has been hanging out in Ironforge since Burning Crusade. Of course it is going to be empty out there.