So the first numbers from WoL are in

[h3lladvocate]

Disc seems quite powerful. Only fight I've really considered Holy so far is on our Durumu attempts, Holy better AoE mobility feels like it is nice. And I wouldn't consider spec too much on Ji-Kun, there is so little damage, it quite a boring fight. This is from 10 man perspective.

[Ariahna]

Ji'kun will be greatly influenced by the strategy your guild uses. I was one of two healers that never left the main platform, and since the groups were so spread out (people basically stood in the area of their marker for nests) and the absence of eight players in two of the groups made healing feel very inefficient for me as holy. Next week I'll probably go disc if we use the same strategy. But overall I think holy is pretty strong for most fights.

[nobodysbaby]

My first impression is not much changed really from 5.1 except I see more Atonment healing and PW:S. A large chunk is still SS, wich makes me wonder if the nerf was implemented properly? Holy has its strengths, wich are mobility and smart aoe via PoM, CoH and LS, but not much on top of the raw healing. Disc remains top notch with mitigation, strong dps and very good healing/absorbs without much mana issues. For heroic I definitly believe Disc will be the better option for most of the fights. It doesn't seem there will be many rerollers from Disc back to Holy. Discs new mastery and the buff to Atonment seems to keep their head high?

My personal experience + talking to a lot of priests, is that the Chakra mechanic does ruin a lot of the usefulness of Holy and also the fun factor, besides the other benefits that Disc has. It is really The reason NOT to play Holy for many! No doubt Holy does have strong AoE healing, but I do believe they need more flexibility (read no more AoE/ST stances) and perhaps something more, like Inspiration or Chakras made into output CD's instead of pure stances on a too long CD. Blabla, rinse and repeat.

[Kalmah]

In 10man, I honestly feel like it's not worth going holy unless the fight allows me to sit in sanctuary, like for example on Garalon. Switching chakra is incredibly annoying, for so little pay-off. Also the fact that atonement healing is so incredibly good at healing low random raid damage while adding meaningful dps.

[Annoying]

Holy is extremely strong with 2pT15+Divine Insight, from what I've tried. Didn't get to use holy on Lei Shen, due to needing the bubble, but on the trash before My PoM was doing like 30% of my healing, and was doing fantastic numbers. I'll test it out more.

[Mazi]

Holy is extremely strong with 2pT15+Divine Insight, from what I've tried. Didn't get to use holy on Lei Shen, due to needing the bubble, but on the trash before My PoM was doing like 30% of my healing, and was doing fantastic numbers. I'll test it out more.

Argh, yeah. I want it horribly. I'm even betting that using LFR over heroic t14 gear will be better HPS than not having the 2pc... PoM is so good this tier in general.

[Deleted]

Normal modes really cannot be used as a parameter for anything, however there are some things to note:

Disc > Holy
Disc > Holy @ Horridon (no matter gear)
Holy > Disc @ 2 piece t15
Holy > Disc further @ 4 piece t15

What I find more interesting though is how this forum looked during the PTR, there were numerous posts stating "THE WORLD IS DOOMED, THE PROPHECIES OF THE FOUR HORSEMEN ARE TRUE AND EVERYTHING IS GOING TO DESCENT INTO MADNESS" (or something like that) were obviously wrong, Discipline is more than fine. The weakest specs at the moment are Resto Druid/Shaman. Mistweavers are in an odd place where they suck in normal modes, suck until they get their 2 piece t15, but in heroic modes with their 2 piece t15 they become the strongest healers in the game by a large margin.

[Deleted]

I tried to check a lot of the ranks on wol, and discovered them to be mostly bugged logs. I would take ranks atm with a grain of salt, its obvious there are a fair few disc ranks from the times inner focus was bugged and constantly active. You also get to see logs with warlocks and shadow priests doing ridiculous things like 400k hps, or shamans doing 600k hps.

[Deleted]

I don't know what logs people are looking at. I see disc capping out at 100-110k HPS and pretty much everyone else doing >100k HPS with massive overheal. This is worse than anyone expected, after the crit/mastery changes.

This the same as disc dominating dragon soul in the MoP pre-release patch. Disc is balanced in most of the normal mode encounters rather than strong and it is balanced because they are fights with strong burst and nice low healing phases.

Treseme, what are you smoking. Resto druids and resto shamans are doing really well in the logs. Look at them pulling 130k HPS with 35-45% overheal. Picking a random log from the top 10 druids on jin'rok (excluding the bugged PTR reports) --> http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/r...73&e=2043#Riah.

Much stronger than disc. All the high logs on jin'rok from disc are bugged PTR reports.

There is currently practically no disc priest pulling anywhere near the HPS you can see from top logs of other classes in the few fights allowing high HPS. All the other fights where damage is low-moderate and very burst disc is just balanced.

This is exactly as predicted. As soon as the people gear up a bit more and get their tier sets, its going to be a bloodbath.

Disc is by far the weakest output spec and all the high HPS fights prove that without a shadow of a doubt.

Look at this log:

http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/o...?s=8053&e=8713

Inner focus bug abuse pure and simple. The real disc is doing like 90k HPS here, everyone is rocking 120k and with a ton of overheal too.

Disc players should be (a) alarmed, (b) getting a holy spec ready for when they get their tier set if they don't have one already.

Unless ofc blizzard comes out with another ridiculous hot fix.

[Dianthe]

I am not sure why you are so stubbornly negative Havoc... There are multiple people doing both 10s and 25s who confirm that either they, or discipline priests they play with can do just fine. The discipline priests in our guild did not "cap at 100k HPS", SS is still very powerful if used right. Shielding a bunch of groups and filling in with PoH/Cascade, works just fine... Are you really trying to convince yourself that because Disc is not doing 30% more healing than everybody else they are in a bad place now? It is really not the case...

[Deleted]

Post the logs if you want to discuss and provide numbers. What fight, how much HPS, how much overheal.

I am not trying to convince myself of anything. I looked at the numbers, then looked at the logs, then tried it myself and there is no escaping the only logical conclusion. Disc is already not doing so well in most fights. Your disc priest might be doing well, but that is a function of gear and other healers and it does not mean that disc is strong. I am still doing well and I am at or near the top in most fights, but I don't blind myself to the reality and the difference between my numbers and what other healers in the logs are pushing out.

Filling in with PoH/cascade? Who is even doing that. PoH is the very last priority in aoe healing and it is a tiny proportion of any disc's healing, if they want to produce decent numbers.

PWS spam is as good now as it will ever be, it has next to zero overheal in a high overheal environment and it absorbs a decent amount of the incoming damage. That is because you have over >500 ilvl, for ilvl 500 tuned fights, which are supposed to be easy for skilled players (and they are).

Holy has its strengths, wich are mobility and smart aoe via PoM, CoH and LS, but not much on top of the raw healing

Holy has seriously higher raw healing. Check the high overheal fights in this tier. However holy suffers greatly from overheal sensitivity and the fight design on normal has too little healing between big bursts on too many fights. Even so holy is doing about the same as discpline on most of those fights. On higher HPS fights, holy is way ahead.

[Deleted]

Treseme, what are you smoking. Resto druids and resto shamans are doing really well in the logs. Look at them pulling 130k HPS with 35-45% overheal. Picking a random log from the top 10 druids on jin'rok (excluding the bugged PTR reports) --> http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/r...73&e=2043#Riah.

I told you, heroic modes are the only parameter that can be used for balance. I think MWs will require another nerf because in heroic modes with certain gearing I think MWs will be overpowered. Just like I have a strong belief that Resto Shaman and Resto Druids will be the worst 2 healers for them. Disc and Holy will perform very well, but Paladins and MW will dominate heroic modes.

[HPLathus]

Inner focus bug abuse pure and simple.

explain? I consider myself well versed in both forums/disc and holy.. and I have yet to hear of this disc bug?

---------- Post added 2013-03-10 at 04:47 AM ----------

Holy has its strengths, wich are mobility and smart aoe via PoM, CoH and LS, but not much on top of the raw healing

Raw healing, holy priests have always been kings. THey have massive amounts of HPS and HPM with mastery.


Overhealing yes, but the overhealing comes from a spell that costs 0 mana, so overhealing shouldn't really be that big of an issue as holy.

[Deleted]

explain? I consider myself well versed in both forums/disc and holy.. and I have yet to hear of this disc bug?

---------- Post added 2013-03-10 at 04:47 AM ----------



Raw healing, holy priests have always been kings. THey have massive amounts of HPS and HPM with mastery.


Overhealing yes, but the overhealing comes from a spell that costs 0 mana, so overhealing shouldn't really be that big of an issue as holy.

On a PTR build when heroic Megaera testing was available Inner Focus was bugged where it be up constantly allowing PoH to 100% of the time proc DA (and at this time DA shields were really strong). That's the bug. It's fixed on live.

[HPLathus]

Ah thanks.

So stupid that WoL uploads logs from PTR >_>

[Deleted]

On a PTR build when heroic Megaera testing was available Inner Focus was bugged where it be up constantly allowing PoH to 100% of the time proc DA (and at this time DA shields were really strong). That's the bug. It's fixed on live.

That bug was up more than just Megaera hc testing. I have been on PTR for a few normal 10 man encounters and the thing was still bugged. Quite useful for the Dark Anima trash!

[nobodysbaby]

I checked the dates on many of the top logs. Where are those bugged logs making Disc looking too OP? The top ones I checked on the frontpages (that werent Japanese or German) were from after 5.2 were released and the most % of healing came from Atonment. You're saying those are PTR logs?

Really all I see in 10 man is Atonment. The healing done just looks way off to be mostly dps healing, it's too rewarding (and too easy) in 10's. A bit better balance in 25's though, with more healingstyles viable, but Disc will get better when they learn the fights and I am also pretty sure they will scale better than Holy (mastery worth more+crit worth more+manaregen making it possible to reforge out of spirit).

You can't blame bugged logs for Disc looking really good even after the nerfs.

Btw, did something happen to Paladins mastery? Seems it has gone even higher. Perhaps it's just Disc DA nerf?

[Deleted]

Btw, did something happen to Paladins mastery? Seems it has gone even higher. Perhaps it's just Disc DA nerf?

Spot on. Anyway, they're normal logs. They don't matter. Give it a few weeks, let all healers get their 2 piece/4 piece bonuses (allowing Paladins to also drop their absurdly overpowered t14 4 piece) and then you can make a judgement on how well Disc is performing. I think it can't outperform Holy this tier though, Holy is just far too strong with the set bonuses that have been given and Holy will no longer suffer from poor mana management due to the sheer number of regen trinkets available from ToT.

[ramennoodleking]

Last night I was disc for Ji-Kun, mostly because I was Wing Leader for Flight Team Alpha (our dubbed platform group name) mostly so I could use atonement and still keep my aces alive. However, I did feel that PWS spam when not using SS (for AoE healing) was going to be the way to go, which I predicted during PTR.

But then for Durumu and Primordius I was holy, ranking 2 and 1 on the fights, respectively. I think like 56k for Durumu (not enough healing to be had) and something like 103k on Primordius. For Jin'rokh before that I was also holy and did 95k with 300ms world lag, my cable line had just taken a hit from a large branch.

This is all in 10 mans.

Holy feels very good ATM.

I missed the fights in between Jin'Rokh and Ji-Kun, so i cant comment on them, because a storm messed up the cable line between my house and telephone pole, and right in the middle of Jin'rokh until Sarurday night I couldn't play.

[Deleted]

Looking at our logs from Tortos and Ji-Kun our Holy is beating all the other classes in raw healing, including our disc, without significantly doing more overhealing than any of the other classes. Atm the Holy is pushing around 15-20k more hps than other healers. Might just be a difference in skills, but before patch the numbers were definitely different.

Ji Kun: http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/r...?s=6840&e=7322
Tortos: http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/r...?s=3417&e=3811

Haven't gotten to try disc yet myself, but will be interesting to see if it's still possible to beat our Holy.