Throne of Thunder - World First Heroic Thread!

[scwasp]

They had already done it on 25man before they did 10man, so of course it was much easier for them the second time.

Yes that's clearly it. They were obviously unable to objectively analyze the differences between the 10 and 25 man version because they killed one version first...

[XypheriaTN]

GO GO PARAGON! Fuck yeah

[Akylios]

EU servers going down now, so I guess Lei Shen survives the first lockout.

[Rinoa]

I am very pleased to see that this heroic race lasted more than one lockout. ^_^

[Deleted]

Finnish friend of mine told me that Paragon had heroic Lei Shen wipe @ 5%. While it is only rumors, lets be happy and spread em. So if that indeed is the case, I think it wont be many days when 10m world first kill is coming.

[jsz]

I am very pleased to see that this heroic race lasted more than one lockout. ^_^

By the skin of it's teeth

[Rinoa]

By the skin of it's teeth

Aye, it must have been close for sure. ^^"

[archkiller]

Heroic Ragnaros in fireland barely last more than 1 lockout too in 2011.

[Deleted]

I have nothing against Moonz but that they were able to kill Twins before any 25 man guild (BL/Method) mus tbe a small proof that it is an easier fight than on 25man.

The whole point is that they need it like 10 pulls to kill's this boss ... So sadly this is a average bad point to show how the fight is tuned. I mean 2 hours for paragon since Iron Qon? How many wipes did they do? Did they take aswell a break?...etc etc...Did they simply 1 shoot him>?
Aswell for Moonz.
This is why sometimes i hate 25=10 man. Is not

[scwasp]

The whole point is that they need it like 10 pulls to kill's this boss ... So sadly this is a average bad point to show how the fight is tuned. I mean 2 hours for paragon since Iron Qon? How many wipes did they do? Did they take aswell a break?...etc etc...Did they simply 1 shoot him>?
Aswell for Moonz.
This is why sometimes i hate 25=10 man. Is not

Council and Twins are prime examples for why you can't say the 10 and 25 man are 1 race. Council took a lot longer to kill on 10 man. While Twins took like 2 hours on 10 man, and so far almost 3 days on 25 man, with no kill yet even.

[eschatological]

Monk = beating enrage timer? Discuss!

I imagine it's not for enrage, but for transitions. In 10 man first transition, you have 1 quadrant without a healer, and 2 quadrants with 2 ppl each. Immunities for static shock would be important for soaking in those 2 quadrants as I don't think two people are going to easily survive a static shock unless they're tanks (we have 2 tanks in one of the 2 ppl quadrants in NORMAL and they still get wrecked).

Considering in H-Lei Shen the conduits don't overload and are still active the rest of the fight, that static shock is gonna be a huge pain in the ass in 2nd transition, even with the minimum 2 levels (+1 level 1st transition, +1 level 2nd transition) and the fact that you have to cover only 3 quadrants (is that even true in heroic? Does that quarter of the room still get electrified if the conduit doesn't overload)?

That being said, Smirk only has one immunity to soak Static Shock (bubble) which is on a 5m CD, and monks have multiple, including the ever OP Diffuse Magic (dispersion basically, 90% reduction) on a 90s CD, Zen Med on a 3m CD (another 90% soak),

[Isotope]

I think people need to stop and take a breath. This whole 25m vs. 10m thing is just silly and I will explain it all to you and I hope some people can just stop with this non-sense.

Only fools tell you that either 10m or 25m is harder than one another. The fact is some fights are easier on 25m while others are easier on 10m. They usually balance out and the instance as a whole is the same. Now as a person who did Heroic MSV on both 25m and 10m I can tell you that 25m was easier OVERALL. However some fights were harder on 25man than they were on 10man.

People who say 10m raids are a little bit less forgiving if somebody dies are correct in a way. Cutting edge progression if a person dies on either 10m or 25m it could be GG. However in a casual mediocre raid setting a death in a 10m could be the end of the attempt while a death in a 25m is no big deal. Most of these fights on Normal are tuned so that it accounts for the 5ish people you're carrying as a 25m.


Now as for this whole world first thing. Put aside your already self imposed bias and think for a second. Lets get rid of this as a whole WoW term and use it as something else. Lets say there is a huge obstacle course race coming up that can be made of either 10 or 25 people. I decide to get 9 friends together and do it while you decide to get 24 friends and family to do it. Now we both start at the same time and have to do the same obstacles but some were easier for us as 10people but some were easier for you as 25.

So as we're coming down the finish line my group finishes first place and your group second place and first place for 25 people. There can only be one team who finished it all first. It doesn't matter if it was a team of 10 or a team of 25, there is only one of them that can cross the finish line first.

So please just stop with this 10m or 25m fanboi bullshit. It is pointless and as a whole makes our community look stupid. The top raid groups in 10m don't compare themselves to the top raid groups in 25m, and the same goes with them. So stop trying to compare the two when they aren't. Both groups know that their can only be one group who can finish before everybody else. It's about time that everybody else got on board with their thinking.

[Mattmage]

Apparently Blood Legion is already 9/13 again...

[Horizon]

I think people need to stop and take a breath. This whole 25m vs. 10m thing is just silly and I will explain it all to you and I hope some people can just stop with this non-sense.

Only fools tell you that either 10m or 25m is harder than one another. The fact is some fights are easier on 25m while others are easier on 10m. They usually balance out and the instance as a whole is the same. Now as a person who did Heroic MSV on both 25m and 10m I can tell you that 25m was easier OVERALL. However some fights were harder on 25man than they were on 10man.

People who say 10m raids are a little bit less forgiving if somebody dies are correct in a way. Cutting edge progression if a person dies on either 10m or 25m it could be GG. However in a casual mediocre raid setting a death in a 10m could be the end of the attempt while a death in a 25m is no big deal. Most of these fights on Normal are tuned so that it accounts for the 5ish people you're carrying as a 25m.


Now as for this whole world first thing. Put aside your already self imposed bias and think for a second. Lets get rid of this as a whole WoW term and use it as something else. Lets say there is a huge obstacle course race coming up that can be made of either 10 or 25 people. I decide to get 9 friends together and do it while you decide to get 24 friends and family to do it. Now we both start at the same time and have to do the same obstacles but some were easier for us as 10people but some were easier for you as 25.

So as we're coming down the finish line my group finishes first place and your group second place and first place for 25 people. There can only be one team who finished it all first. It doesn't matter if it was a team of 10 or a team of 25, there is only one of them that can cross the finish line first.

So please just stop with this 10m or 25m fanboi bullshit. It is pointless and as a whole makes our community look stupid. The top raid groups in 10m don't compare themselves to the top raid groups in 25m, and the same goes with them. So stop trying to compare the two when they aren't. Both groups know that their can only be one group who can finish before everybody else. It's about time that everybody else got on board with their thinking.

And you're just putting fuel on the fire, assuming that in this tier 10/25 are equall just because previous tiers where is like saying “last arena season was balanced so this one must be balanced to”.

Comparing 10/25 is like a 400 m runner comparing himself with a 100m runner but not by trying out the distance, rather he tinkers with his time (maybe his time / 4 – a second or two) and believes that is a realistic estimate.

[Rinoa]

Mattmage, keep in mind that when a tip-top guild kills a boss for the first time it usually doesn't take them long at all to get it down a second time - even if they still are kind of undergeared and the boss is tough. If BL is at 9/13H again it hardly comes as a surprise.

[Excaliban]

Are the top guilds going to extend their id or will they clear everything again in order to get more gear?

[Deleted]

Are the top guilds going to extend their id or will they clear everything again in order to get more gear?

clear everything again for gear

[Rinoa]

Remember that the best of the best are very often directly blocked by gear, whereas almost all other guilds aren't. In order to kill some of the ridiculously difficult bosses they absolutely require more gear, which means that it's extremely unlikely that any top guild will extend their lockout; especially the first one.

Edit: 1000th post. Go me.

[scwasp]

Are the top guilds going to extend their id or will they clear everything again in order to get more gear?

Blood legion didn't extend id. And I doubt any of the other top guilds extended the lockout. From what we know, dark animus is a crazy dps check among other things, which a new round of heroic gear will help a lot of guilds overcome. Considering that the Consorts are also not down yet on 25 man, it's very likely they are also tuned to require a lot of dps. So like Dark Animus, it will probably help a lot with more heroic gear.

[DakonBlackblade]

I think BL will get it this time around (Lei Shen at least) simply because the US headstart will give them an enourmous advantage on this second lock theyll be at Twin tomorrow with a bag full of new TF heroic gear when Method, Paragon and the Rusina Guild wich I never remember the name will be starting theyre runs.