Why do lesser skilled players feel entitled to see content?

[Pull My Finger]

This, they should make the highest quality game possible, take some pride in their work.

Typically when you make a product to appeal to the masses it turns out cheap and generic.

Blizzard has turned a gormet dinner into a McDonald's hamburger. It sells more, it makes more money, and it is completely forgettable in every way.

I'd rather play an awesome game that 1 million people played than a super streamlined, gear-treadmill queue based MMO simulator that 8 million play.

BS banter. You're not sophisticated and highbrow, even if you like to think so.

[Otimus]

Yes, at the expense of people trying. LFR killed guilds, LFR killed pugging, LFR killed server communities, LFR killed GDKP run, LFR killed alt runs (at least in every guild i've been since DS, nobody ever bother with those anymore). LFR makes it perfectly acceptable to be and stay mediocre at the game and pretty much removes incentive any new player would have to improve themselves to see real raiding content, limiting the recruitement pool for raiding guilds often leading to guild disbanding or shrinking into 10mans. It also made a lot of quality players quit, i know my entire guild save for 3 people (me, our rogue and my old GM that recently came back) entirely quit the game and vowed to never come back (most of them are raiding on Rift now aparently, wich is very similar to TBC raiding).

Yup, LFR didn't damage anything.


Besides, can't think of any North American countries where that has any chances to work, and considering the amount of financial problems europe has lately i doubt they could support it very long. See France (insanely high unemployement rates, to the point a lot are coming over to Quebec) and Greece. Asian countries also have a very strict work cultures, if you think systems like welfare are badly seen in the US...never go to Japan or Korea. Would never work there either.

Purely assumed numbers, but I'd guess the amount of players who's content was "killed" by LFR is probably less than 200,000 or so :x and the amount of people benefiting from LFR is probably somewhere between 2 and 3 million :x (You have to remember, these sort of things aren't made in a vacuum, and aren't made purely for convenience.)

Probably off a way bit, but you probably get my point :x

The benefits outweigh the negatives :x The only core problem is that the game needs more gradual difficulty, rather than "super easy" and "super hard".

[Deleted]

I don't know any parents that doesn't have at least 10 hours of free time in their lives. Wich is all it takes to clear heroic content nowadays, or Normal mode with some heroics at the very least.

the idea of a fresh new parent sticking to a raiding schedule is frankly ridiculous.

[KrazyK923]

But thats how Blizzard used to operate before the merge with Activision, thats how they became one of the most succesful and renowned gaming company, didn't seem to work too badly for them.

I know both people and Blizzard themselves have directly come out and said Activision has no role in what they do, but that doesn't stop people like you, does it?

You know, those people who believe something despite the very source saying you're wrong?

Sounds like the "No guys, doesn't matter what Blizzard said. Garrosh is still corrupted. Seriously guys. Dave Kosak is only the lead quest designer, he's not the lore guy!"

[Dch48]

Anyone who pays the subscription price should be able to see the whole game in some form. It's also just good business for Blizzard not to have people seem locked out and then quit.

Why do more skilled players think they should be the only ones to see all the content? That's a much better question.

[Deldavala]

This, they should make the highest quality game possible, take some pride in their work.

Typically when you make a product to appeal to the masses it turns out cheap and generic.

Blizzard has turned a gormet dinner into a McDonald's hamburger. It sells more, it makes more money, and it is completely forgettable in every way.

I'd rather play an awesome game that 1 million people played than a super streamlined, gear-treadmill queue based MMO simulator that 8 million play.

The thing is that Blizzard started out catering to the masses. Thats the reason they got so popular. Compare WoW to any other MMO that was out at that time and you will see how casual the game was. To them you are the LFR n00b.

[nekobaka]

I'm sorry, what "casual content" was there in TBC? I don't remember any.

WoW was the casual MMO of the time. If you played in BC then you was a casual. Just because someone is a casual doesnt mean they cant get out of the fire or use CC. The overall pacing of the expansion was far slower than today and dungeon burn out was far harder to reach due to lockouts and overall player behavior being far more casual instead of the go go go must have it all finished now mentality that has sunk in an overwhelming amount of the player base. Mentality wise I would say the casuals of BC was far more casual than the casuals of MoP. Patience has gotten very thin among the player base.

[Yarathir]

I know both people and Blizzard themselves have directly come out and said Activision has no role in what they do, but that doesn't stop people like you, does it?

You know, those people who believe something despite the very source saying you're wrong?

Sounds like the "No guys, doesn't matter what Blizzard said. Garrosh is still corrupted. Seriously guys. Dave Kosak is only the lead quest designer, he's not the lore guy!"

Of course.



Just like the guys who, despite most of Blizzard's designers approving of LFR as a tool and thinking things aren't bad the way they are/could be with a small change, state that raiding should be how they want it, and that their way is still the way Blizzard intended it and will always intend it.

[GrieverXIII]

http://unhuman.ca/forum/index.php?/t...nt-dappliquer/

Here's Unhuman's application form, it clearly states that they raid from Monday to Wednesday from 19h00 to 23h00 (its in french, feel free to google translate it to double check if you want).

Those guys are US 8th 25man and had Ra'den on farm for months on a 12hours schedule. Remind me how raiding 6 hours a day 6 days a week is required again?

[Otimus]

I think people also greatly exaggerate the "whining" of casuals and "baddies" and what not.


Most of those people don't say a single word to Blizzard. They just quit playing. They don't "demand" anything, usually. Blizzard just makes efforts to try and keep those people engaged based on what they try to figure out is making them quit/not be engaged.

I'd go so far as to say, to some degree, if you're on any sort of forum, this one or Blizzard's complaining or whatever, you're almost by default not really that casual :x

[Pancha]

Lesser skilled? I would rather say that you should not feel entitled to be the only one to see everything only because you have the time to do said content. You do it at a greater difficulty, which should give you better rewards, which it does. But time does not equal greater skill. Many of those who have former hardcore experience, like myself, doesn't have the time to raid on a set basis. I do my LFR's every now and then, often only once a month, but I do get my share of enjoyment out of it.

[GrieverXIII]

the idea of a fresh new parent sticking to a raiding schedule is frankly ridiculous.

Thats when a lot of raiders become backups/socials until things calm down. There's a different between being a fresh new parent and just being a parent. I knew a lot of parents that would only play when their little treasure is asleep too, considering most raids starts after 7pm its far from being unamanagable, if something comes up i don't know many guilds that had an issue taking a break or simply bring one of the bench raider in his place.

[Otimus]

http://unhuman.ca/forum/index.php?/t...nt-dappliquer/

Here's Unhuman's application form, it clearly states that they raid from Monday to Wednesday from 19h00 to 23h00 (its in french, feel free to google translate it to double check if you want).

Those guys are US 8th 25man and had Ra'den on farm for months on a 12hours schedule. Remind me how raiding 6 hours a day 6 days a week is required again?

I think when most people say stuff about having to raid so and so hours a week they mainly misspeak, and mean playing the actual game for so-and-so hours a week, rather than purely on raiding time.

[Maniac2]

Again, WHERE does it say your 15$ entitles you to anything but server access. I'd love to see it.

You can see it on all Blizzard marketing material, on Mmo champ front page, Emails from Blizzard.

If you check all the trailers, teasers for , lets say, SoO raid, you wont find "hardcore players content only" etiquette. Or " for raid guild only". Its aimed to whole wow comunity, therefore to all of us.

Sorry, even Blizzard dont think you are so special like you think you are.

[Simplex]

What a painful and endless debate to read... I'm right, because my opinion is superior and shared by any other person ingame with a brain... yeah yeah.

I never cared about LFR. I ran it because I wanted to, because it was actually a relaxing experience since every other group content has changed from "let's explore" to "omg you are 3 seconds slower than usual, you so ruined my day". I had fun you know, computer (or any other) games should usually be about having fun. I'm not interested in spending 4 continuous hours a day, 3 or more days a week on raiding, that's not fun for me, at best it would give me some sense of accomplishment definitely not worth the investment.

As I never understood those "I must do dailies because I want to be competitive" (imagine blizz removing weekly valor cap as they did with the daily quest cap... the horror), I will never understand why people care so much about LFR, you don't get anything extra, every reward is weaker (apart from legendaries), you won't put a Lei Shen LFR kill on your CV, you won't get a special achievement saying you killed him in LFR... so why, WHY

[ngc2440]

Bill Gates would disagree with you.

He is an exception to the rule. You should know that by looking at his closest competitors.

[NotFunny008]

Before closed:

Why do you think there is a need for another LFR-hate thread?

Amen to that!

[Blufossa]

There is no hate. Topic is: Why doesn't people want to learn instead of wanting to learn? Would you receive welfare IRL or work a good job?

See, people already work jobs, why would they want the game to be like a second job?

[Yarathir]

What a painful and endless debate to read... I'm right, because my opinion is superior and shared by any other person ingame with a brain... yeah yeah.

I never cared about LFR. I ran it because I wanted to, because it was actually a relaxing experience since every other group content has changed from "let's explore" to "omg you are 3 seconds slower than usual, you so ruined my day". I had fun you know, computer (or any other) games should usually be about having fun. I'm not interested in spending 4 continuous hours a day, 3 or more days a week on raiding, that's not fun for me, at best it would give me some sense of accomplishment definitely not worth the investment.

As I never understood those "I must do dailies because I want to be competitive" (imagine blizz removing weekly valor cap as they did with the daily quest cap... the horror), I will never understand why people care so much about LFR, you don't get anything extra, every reward is weaker (apart from legendaries), you won't put a Lei Shen LFR kill on your CV, you won't get a special achievement saying you killed him in LFR... so why, WHY

Send me your address via PM so I can send you a medal, champion.

[Jagoex]

53-pages later, I believe that it's safe to say that the attention-troll won.

Why do these topics exist in the quantity that they do? Because they create this type of attention. That's why.

Ignore the topics you don't care for and they will go away.