Arms to Fury and 5.4

[Deleted]

Hello everyone,

I've played Arms since I've been a Warrior, and despite the fact that it's a pretty terrible spec, I don't have a problem with it as it's never affected me in my runs, for the most part. I'm also very comfortable with it. However, now I just got my second Zerat, Malakk's soul burning greatsword.

I've fully enchanted/gemmed/upgraded the second 2 hander to 530,

Can someone please explain the current situation of fury?

- Which is better, SMF or TG?
- What's the better spec, arms of fury in 5.4 and if fury, what's better, SMF or TG?
- How do you decide what spec you play? For me, I could never go fury as I've never had a 2nd wep drop, but now I have. As a warrior, aren't you stuck playing the spec that you have the weps for?

[Archimtiros]

Hello everyone,

I've played Arms since I've been a Warrior, and despite the fact that it's a pretty terrible spec, I don't have a problem with it as it's never affected me in my runs, for the most part. I'm also very comfortable with it. However, now I just got my second Zerat, Malakk's soul burning greatsword.

I've fully enchanted/gemmed/upgraded the second 2 hander to 530,

Can someone please explain the current situation of fury?

- Which is better, SMF or TG?
- What's the better spec, arms of fury in 5.4 and if fury, what's better, SMF or TG?
- How do you decide what spec you play? For me, I could never go fury as I've never had a 2nd wep drop, but now I have. As a warrior, aren't you stuck playing the spec that you have the weps for?

This information is all over the place but I'll humor you.

Which is better, SMF or TG?

Doesn't matter, whatever weapons are better. Perfect world TG has better AoE returns, SMF has better single target, but the two are extremely close.

What's the better spec, arms of fury in 5.4 and if fury, what's better, SMF or TG?

Arms for any Cleave/sustained AoE situations. Fury for pure/mostly pure Single Target. SMF/TG = Same answer as above.

How do you decide what spec you play?

Same answer as above. What weapons you get is #1 priority. After that, the question is if you want to change specs/reforge every fight back and forth from Arms to Fury. If you want one spec to stick to the whole tier and not have to change, then Arms.

[Deleted]

This information is all over the place but I'll humor you.

I appreciate the info, I know I could have researched more before making the thread.

So Arms still stays below fury next patch? (I haven't read the warrior buffs too closely, obviously)

[Archimtiros]

Arms got buffed to hell. It is very slightly below Fury for single target; the numbers 10-15% come up alot.
For any kind of cleave or sustained AoE however, Arms is doing some of the best damage in the game on PTR, it has a huge advantage over Fury in that regard. At last look its clearly better on I think 6 or 7 of the 14 fights in SoO.

[Deleted]

Arms got buffed to hell. It is very slightly below Fury for single target; the numbers 10-15% come up alot.
For any kind of cleave or sustained AoE however, Arms is doing some of the best damage in the game on PTR, it has a huge advantage over Fury in that regard. At last look its clearly better on I think 6 or 7 of the 14 fights in SoO.

I think I'll just stick with Arms then since the buffs, however lazy that might sound.

(Very nice 550 ilvl by the way. Bloody hell 11 ra-den kills. ;P)

[Deleted]

I am really sad, because Arms will be the best again, and i dont known WHY ? Fury is the only spec that can use 2 two handed weapons. in cat Arms was the best, in the beginning of panda, single minded fury was the best and now arms again. rms is still one of the best pvp class, and there's some other clsses like frost DK and ret pallis with 2-handeds. Where is the unique potential that this class once holded ? Really ?

[Prag]

It's a little early to be sad.

Also, most classes are in the same boat. Mages and Warlocks are, as always, the exception.

(above statement is only 75% exaggerated to make my point)

[Archimtiros]

I think I'll just stick with Arms then since the buffs, however lazy that might sound.

(Very nice 550 ilvl by the way. Bloody hell 11 ra-den kills. ;P)

Its not lazy at all, just depends on what kind of raiding you do. If you aren't quick progression oriented ("hardcore") then its perfectly fine to play Arms because its top spec for all the AoE fights, and only slightly behind for Single Target. It keeps you from having to swap and reforge every fight.

And thanks, I'm not the best but I try

[Alonzo33]

Its perfect right now in 5.4 ptr . making room for both specs to be played , every spec have its own places where it shine ..
Ands stop call for Arms nerfs!!!!

[Adsertif]

Ands stop call for Arms nerfs!!!!

Because pressing one button 85% of your GCDs is fun?

[Deleted]

Because pressing one button 85% of your GCDs is fun?

If you're just spamming OP, then you're doing arms wrong.

Ridiculous. Arms has been terrible for so long, and now that it looks like it's good, or even not terrible anymore, people are saying it should be crap again.

[Deleted]

If you're just spamming OP, then you're doing arms wrong.

Ridiculous. Arms has been terrible for so long, and now that it looks like it's good, or even not terrible anymore, people are saying it should be crap again.

it shouldn't be crap again, people want(as far as i can tell) arms and fury on par(and on par with other classes) - for single target and AoE
but since blizzard doesn't seem to be able to solve it, they rather have arms being pure pvp and fury pure pve.

[Adsertif]

If you're just spamming OP, then you're doing arms wrong.

Have you seen PTR? OP is a waste of a GCD.

The rotation is more boring than frost mage; you just hit Slam and keep CS/MS on cool down single target.

[DOUBLEXBAUGH]

Can you 1 button Arms since it is a priority system?

/cast CS
/cast MS
/cast Slam
/cast OP

With nothing on CD this will cast CS. If CS is on CD it will cast MS. If both of those are on CD it will cast Slam. If CS and MS are on CD and you don't have enough rage for Slam it will cast OP.

Then add a shift mod for when you need to execute.

Would this work? I haven't looked into arms much yet.

[galvin]

Stuff like that only works with abilities that don't have a GCD. So that would not work.

[Archimtiros]

If you're just spamming OP, then you're doing arms wrong.

Ridiculous. Arms has been terrible for so long, and now that it looks like it's good, or even not terrible anymore, people are saying it should be crap again.

Will point you all to this thread: http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/to...229607?page=12
It's not that we all want Arms to be nerfed. More than happy for it to be competitive with Fury, even better on cleave fights (as is its niche). The problem is its boring as hell to play, like terrible even. Any deviation in the rotation barely makes a difference in damage done. Even more, its so strong on AoE, and barely behind single target that most people aren't even going to bother swapping to fury in alot of fights. Your going to see a whole crap load of really bad Warriors doing really good, because the spec is that simple and frankly, overpowered.

[Alonzo33]

the rotation is not perfect .. but not so bad..
being able to compete is more important to me.
take what the devs gives you its better then noting.
its just so redicoulos that Warrior community calls for nerf its own class.

Fury is going to be much better in single target so that not true that this spec wont be played.
calling for Arms to be competitive with Fury means to nerf Arms since i dont see them buffing Fury

[Archimtiros]

Can you 1 button Arms since it is a priority system?

/cast CS
/cast MS
/cast Slam
/cast OP

With nothing on CD this will cast CS. If CS is on CD it will cast MS. If both of those are on CD it will cast Slam. If CS and MS are on CD and you don't have enough rage for Slam it will cast OP.

Then add a shift mod for when you need to execute.

Would this work? I haven't looked into arms much yet.

These kinds of macros stopped working back in.... BC?
All this macro will do is try to cast Mortal Strike over and over again. The only way these macros work is if you have conditional abilities tied to one another, like Charge's range requirements, intervenes targeting requirements or 2 abilities where one is on and one is off the GCD.

Example:
I use a Charge, intervene (if friendly target), victory rush macro.
If I am at range targeting an enemy, it will try to charge, because its out of Victory Rushes range and the target is hostile not friendly.
If I have a friendly target, it will always try to Intervene.
If I am in melee range and Victory Rush is up, it will won't try to Charge because I am within Charges minimum range. (only if V.Rush is actually procced, it will try to charge if VC isn't up, it just wont do anything).

- - - Updated - - -

the rotation is not perfect .. but not so bad..
being able to compete is more important to me.
take what the devs gives you its better then noting.
its just so redicoulos that Warrior community calls for nerf its own class.

Fury is going to be much better in single target so that not true that this spec wont be played.
calling for Arms to be competitive with Fury means to nerf Arms since i dont see them buffing Fury

Fury isn't that far ahead, atleast not on the PTR with T16 vendor + T15 leftover. I'm sure it will scale up some.

And you say the rotation isn't bad... I guess it depends on what you define as bad. It's literally 3 buttons for Single Target. MS, CS, Slam. You can work in overpowers, you can try the Op+HS in CS trick, but it all comes down to like a 2-3% deviation. The spec is a joke. It's like Frost Mage in Wrath, or a combat Rogue without finishers.
Worse even, theres no "random procs" to throw you off or get excited about seeing. There's no "saving CSmash for upcoming movement phase". You smack it anyways, because chances are its going to come back up in 2 seconds anyways. Theres not even rage pooling.

It seriously reminds me of when I raided Arms back in BWL. I hit MS, I hit HS when I had rage, maybe Op if I got (un)lucky and that was pretty much it. Only difference is now Arms has no free GCDs, so I can't even hardly use all the neat fillers we have and missing a GCD for any reason is almost always a DPS loss.

[Mihalik]

I am really sad, because Arms will be the best again, and i dont known WHY ? Fury is the only spec that can use 2 two handed weapons. in cat Arms was the best, in the beginning of panda, single minded fury was the best and now arms again. rms is still one of the best pvp class, and there's some other clsses like frost DK and ret pallis with 2-handeds. Where is the unique potential that this class once holded ? Really ?

First of all in Cata Arms only started performing in DS. SMF and Arms were subpar all the way up to DS, and in DS, TG and Arms won out over SMF thanks to Gurthalak.
Second, a lot of people absolutely hate TG. I am one of them. SMF was created specifically in Cata because of all the complaints in Wrath, when again the entire length of Wrath it was either TG or GFTO.

In MoP SMF and TG compete depending on the fight. Single target SMF, AoE TG, most hardcore raiders pushing content in 5.3 are TG. Arms coming back around and wining by a small margin is not a bad thing. A lot of us are looking forward to play something other then Fury.

- - - Updated - - -

And you say the rotation isn't bad... I guess it depends on what you define as bad. It's literally 3 buttons for Single Target. MS, CS, Slam. You can work in overpowers, you can try the Op+HS in CS trick, but it all comes down to like a 2-3% deviation. The spec is a joke. It's like Frost Mage in Wrath, or a combat Rogue without finishers.
Worse even, theres no "random procs" to throw you off or get excited about seeing. There's no "saving CSmash for upcoming movement phase". You smack it anyways, because chances are its going to come back up in 2 seconds anyways. Theres not even rage pooling.

It seriously reminds me of when I raided Arms back in BWL. I hit MS, I hit HS when I had rage, maybe Op if I got (un)lucky and that was pretty much it. Only difference is now Arms has no free GCDs, so I can't even hardly use all the neat fillers we have and missing a GCD for any reason is almost always a DPS loss.

Actually your rotation in Arms in 5.4 should look like this:

-MS-CS-Slam/No CS, No active crit or str proc OP.
-MS-No CS- OP charges.

Considering Slam now costs 25 rage you will be pooling rage, and conserve OP so when CS is up, you can get in at least 3 Slams. In this case you will be using Dragon Roar and Heroic Throw/Victory Rush as fillers during Rage pooling.

[Archimtiros]

Actually your rotation in Arms in 5.4 should look like this:

-MS-CS-Slam/No CS, No active crit or str proc OP.
-MS-No CS- OP charges.

Considering Slam now costs 25 rage you will be pooling rage, and conserve OP so when CS is up, you can get in at least 3 Slams. In this case you will be using Dragon Roar and Heroic Throw/Victory Rush as fillers during Rage pooling.

On PTR I can fit 4 Slams in every single CS and spam it during every Non MS/CS GCD. In multi minute testings I had maybe a handful of free GCDs where I would actually rage starve and never during CS. Didn't have any open space to HT, VR, Shout or otherwise.
Regardless its already been proven that any deviation from slamming every chance you get/leaving empty GCDs when you can't is like what? Less than 5% difference in damage? The rotation is jokes.

Edit: There's even alot of talk about OP+HS during CS instead of Slams and still it doesn't measure a large difference in damage.

But they finally gave attention to Warrior concerns (post up on MMO-Champ main page) and basically said nobody gives a shit, so I'm going to stop talking about Arms failings, seems we are stuck with it.