What is the inherent reason to have only dual spec

[mickybrighteyes]

Soooooo, some would use it, some wouldn't. No one would get hurt. Ummm, sound argument?

And your sound argument is to merely state it wouldn't hurt to implement without proving it's need.

As I understand, the respec cost cap is 50? that's what it was when I was still jumping speccs.

Now today you can get more then enough to handle respecc costs from dailies, soloing dungeons, or selling a single item (sometimes even simply to a vendor). No speccs have any glaringly obvious difficulty in handling solo play unless the term solo is taken to mean soloing raids and or dungeons or other group gameplay.


Again. Why is it even needed? I'm not questioning that it isn't wanted or that it wouldn't see use by people. But I see no reason to implement it into WoW in the games current state.

[Self Inflicted Wounds]

This makes sense, though it seems like more of a problem with the game not saving bars rather than a need for a 3rd spec.

Why not make something so unimportant easier to deal with?

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And your sound argument is to merely state it wouldn't hurt to implement without proving it's need.

As I understand, the respec cost cap is 50? that's what it was when I was still jumping speccs.

Now today you can get more then enough to handle respecc costs from dailies, soloing dungeons, or selling a single item (sometimes even simply to a vendor). No speccs have any glaringly obvious difficulty in handling solo play unless the term solo is taken to mean soloing raids and or dungeons or other group gameplay.


Again. Why is it even needed? I'm not questioning that it isn't wanted or that it wouldn't see use by people. But I see no reason to implement it into WoW in the games current state.

Why are portals in SW/ORG needed? They aren't. Lets take them out. All portals, forever. Also, you know ho you get insta ported to dungeons now? No more of that either.

Its needed because its a stupid, clunky system that needs an overhaul. If I can just sit in SW and get instantly ported to ZF, why can't I just change between 3 specs at will, like I can with 2?

It seems like you are arguing just because you know others want this feature, and you could care less about it. It would save some time and something you can already change, that would literally only be positive impacts. There would be ZERO negative impacts to this change.

[Togarox]

Why not make something so unimportant easier to deal with?

Personally, I would be fine with allowing people to pay a large amount of gold for tri-spec. If you change your spec that often, your going to be paying it anyways.

edit: odd how I jumped ahead of you in posts btw. Gives the impression I can read minds.

[Deleted]

You no longer think of your friend as a Feral or a Balance druid. She is just a druid who can fill any role just like any druid.

source

We added talents in vanilla so rogue 1 and rogue 2 could be different. With tri spec, what if every rogue feels the same again?

source

That's Ghostcrawler's stand on it.

I don't even use my second spec so I really have no need for a third, although I do understand the frustration for hybrids who wish to be able to perform all roles at all times, even if that is a bit silly. Not sure how I feel about it.

Your spec should be a choice but as it is at the moment the cost of changing it is so incredibly low that it barely exists anyway.

[melodramocracy]

So they implement tri spec.

Next?

'Blizz, why do I run out of mana when I change specs? This is pointless, please change it. QOL.'
'Blizz, why do I need a reagent to change glyphs and talents? This is pointless, please change it. QOL.'

Appeasement is a never ending, and ultimately fruitless battle.

[Urti]

Its not like having to reconfigurate one of your dual spec settings to get third spec is anything important. There is no reason to not have 3spec system.

If you're gonna go tri-spec, you might as well just get rid of specs all together. Just three flavors in a big general pool of traits you can pick from willy-nilly. "Choose three of these three options" really isn't a choice at all.

My opinion is that if you really want to use all three specs of a class, just roll an alt.

[mickybrighteyes]

Why are portals in SW/ORG needed? They aren't. Lets take them out. All portals, forever. Also, you know ho you get insta ported to dungeons now? No more of that either.

Removing something isn't comparable to adding something. Regardless of how pointless either items can be viewed.

Its needed because its a stupid, clunky system that needs an overhaul. If I can just sit in SW and get instantly ported to ZF, why can't I just change between 3 specs at will, like I can with 2?

It seems like you are arguing just because you know others want this feature, and you could care less about it. It would save some time and something you can already change, that would literally only be positive impacts. There would be ZERO negative impacts to this change.

And it seems you're not going to provide any further insight beyond you believe it's needed.

[smartazjb0y]

The problem is that spec choice is in such a weird place: it's inconvenient to go change to that 3rd spec, but it's still pretty trivial.

I'd say the biggest problem is action bars, and the game not saving them (I think). GC said that them adding an action bar saver into the game itself would get rid of a lot of cries for tri-spec, and I think it would. You'd just need to port to a trainer and change specs, but your bars would still be there. It'd just be a slight time/gold sink.

But I also see no reason to not have tri-spec. You already have dual spec. If you're a warrior who only wants to DPS? Well, with dual-spec you can still technically tank. Your raid leader could ask you to tank, and even if you don't have prot as one of your specs, it's easy enough for you to just go to a trainer and change specs.

And saying tri-spec eliminates individuality between members of the same class? That's dumb. I'm not even sure if other players can see what 2 specs you have, and what your offspec is doesn't really matter to a lot of people. I'm a Fury warrior, not a Fury warrior with an Arms offspec.

[Self Inflicted Wounds]

Removing something isn't comparable to adding something. Regardless of how pointless either items can be viewed.



And it seems you're not going to provide any further insight beyond you believe it's needed.

I did, you're just ignoring them. The irony is you have never had one counter point besides the old "I wouldn't use it" argument.

[Deficineiron]

Its needed because its a stupid, clunky system that needs an overhaul. If I can just sit in SW and get instantly ported to ZF, why can't I just change between 3 specs at will, like I can with 2?

As I said earlier, this is an example of the perils of embracing accessibility as a game design philosophy - players rightly conclude that there is no game-based reason not to expand to more and more game areas the convenience culture.

[Stricks]

Do away with "dual spec" as it is right now and just allow us to spec by choosing a specialization like we do at level 10 or when we respec. Each specialization has it's own layout.

[brirrspliff]

Its not like having to reconfigurate one of your dual spec settings to get third spec is anything important. There is no reason to not have 3spec system.

there is also no reason to not have a 6 spec system.

[Stricks]

I think the main shitty thing is that it gives healers/tanks the short straw. On my pally I am a healer/tank spec. Everything on timeless isle requires DPS. Not only am I gimped because I have to build two sets of gear, but also because I can't have a third spec that is actually useful on timeless isle/questing in general. It's just another reason not to be excited fill one of those two roles.

[Heladys]

This makes sense, though it seems like more of a problem with the game not saving bars rather than a need for a 3rd spec.

Yes, and Ghostcrawler has said as much too.

I'd be totally cool with keeping dual-spec if the game would kindly keep hold of my third spec choices and bars and retain them for the day I ultimately re-activate that third spec in some way.

Two active specs and an effort hurdle - even a cost - to go back to town and activate a third spec in lieu of one of the current two would be utterly fine by me.

[mickybrighteyes]

I did, you're just ignoring them. The irony is you have never had one counter point besides the old "I wouldn't use it" argument.

You're main points thus far have been how little you believe it impacts the game or how simple it is to implement. I never dissagreed those points so I had no reason to argue them.

I asked about "need" and all I see is people's testimonials that they want it (cause they'd use it). Need, however, to me needs to be proven in a different matter, and dabling around with a specc once in awhile doesn't prove need in my book.

[Self Inflicted Wounds]

As I said earlier, this is an example of the perils of embracing accessibility as a game design philosophy - players rightly conclude that there is no game-based reason not to expand to more and more game areas the convenience culture.

I just want it to be known that I'm not exactly arguing for universal convenience. I think its ridiculous to have 3-4 FPs in westfall, when its a tiny zone to begin with.

But picking your spec isn't a deep choice anyway. You aren't locked into that choice. The prices for respeccing really haven't changed. It was meaningful back in the day because it was ****ing expensive. Now, you can easily make that cash in a matter of minutes. Its literally pennies.

[NightZero88]

there is also no reason to not have a 6 spec system.

You're right. There isn't. Honestly if they're going to implement a tri-spec they should do what GW1 did from release. In town or at least out of combat you can freely change any talent, glyph or spec. Yes, it'd promote people changing specs/glyphs for each different set of trash, boss, etc. but what exactly is the problem with that? I think it's GOOD. It's promoting learning your class.

On the argument of, pally A doesn't want to heal and if we introduce tri-specs their RL may insist they add a healing spec. Well first of all, your RL can already tell you to do that. Second of all, if you don't want to heal say no and if they force it, move to another guild. It's no different from what it is now except it would be slightly easier for a RL to ask because it wouldn't be as much of a time waster. And hell, maybe you'd find out you love healing you just have never done it because of the time waste in respeccing.

All of the arguments against tri-spec or unlimited spec are not really arguments and instead people just saying no because it either doesn't affect them (pures) or because they are arguing for the sake of arguing. There is no downside to this at all.

[Bullettime]

Spec limitations are perfectly fine provided the specs are distinct enough to feel meaningful. For hybrids, it's easier to defend the whole bit of "RP flavor" that they use due to drastic differences between the specializations. We are playing an RPG afterall and there do need to be SOME restrictions in order to make player based choices to feel truly impactful.

However, Rogues, Hunters, and Mages pretty much shatter that since there's no flavor to be had in any of the 3 specs. Especially in the case of Hunters and Rogues, flavor based restrictions are laughable when all 3 specs play near identically with different names on the tooltips.

[Self Inflicted Wounds]

You're main points thus far have been how little you believe it impacts the game or how simple it is to implement. I never dissagreed those points so I had no reason to argue them.

I asked about "need" and all I see is people's testimonials that they want it (cause they'd use it). Need, however, to me needs to be proven in a different matter, and dabling around with a specc once in awhile doesn't prove need in my book.

No, there are more than mere testimonials. We don't need tri spec like we don't need LFR, or don't need a new expansion. We don't need many things. We want them. And I have given many GOOD reason for its implementation.

Literally your only rebuttal is "I wouldn't use it" .. well thats fine. Don't use it. That was my first reaction to hearing about pet battles being implemented.

[NightZero88]

You're main points thus far have been how little you believe it impacts the game or how simple it is to implement. I never dissagreed those points so I had no reason to argue them.

I asked about "need" and all I see is people's testimonials that they want it (cause they'd use it). Need, however, to me needs to be proven in a different matter, and dabling around with a specc once in awhile doesn't prove need in my book.

Ok, how about this. In the past (not so much anymore) I had a tank set, balance set and resto set. I queue up for LFR and my wait time is 10 minutes on a healer and 30 minutes on a DPS. I swap to my 3rd spec which is tank and the queue is instant. I join the LFR and we kill it. What did this do? It reduced EVERYONE'S queue time because another tank entered the mix that wasn't there before. No downside only positives that affect everyone. By my group getting queued faster thus completing faster everyone else's queue times are reduced. And I am one person. There are lots of druids, pallys, monks etc. out there. Even if only 50 people do it, that's 50 more people than now. This would apply to heroics as well. Additionally, many times in the past I had to cancel raids because a tank didn't show up in our small group. If I could swap to a 3rd spec we could have run and simply replaced a DPS or a healer but we just called the raid because I didn't feel like spending 30 minutes gemming/glyphing/reforging etc. Yes that is lazy on my part but had I had a 3rd spec I would have done that ages ago instead of never having done it because there was no point.