Do you consider your nation's values and ideals to be in line with your own?

[Crissi]

Ah the ol manifest destiny.

Your make a valid point my lil vixen, though we are no more guilty of imperialism than any other country in history. In fact i'd say over the last 100 years or so we haven't been nearly as imperial as we could be.

True, we're no better or worse than Britain and the like, I was just stating historical facts because I <3 history

[Theinquisition]

I didn't say it was a bad thing. Just that we have a pretty strong history of expansionist imperialism, starting basically from day one and peaking in the late 1800s. If anything, we've moved away from imperialism.

I'd agree with ya.

Sorry I get defensive when talking about our nation. Seems like we are always getting beat up.

[Spectral]

Well idk if the word conquered is necessarily true, but I see the point.

Again, to be clear, I'm glad we did. That was the era, and competing on the world stage meant being imperialistic. We wouldn't have become a credible country if we hadn't taken some shit. All I'm saying is that it's silly to act like our old school principles included anti-imperialism.

Sorry I get defensive when talking about our nation. Seems like we are always getting beat up.

No, worries! I'm pretty damn pro-American. I don't really believe in being proud to be from somewhere (I was born here, it's not like I did something), but I'm glad to be from here and part of this.

[The Casualty]

Well, so has every other nation in the history of human kind, so IDK why people insist on beating ourselves up for things that no one is left alive to be persecuted for.

Oh I don't disagree with you, I just don't think it's very fair to say we are against it when we have been for aggressive expansion (just like most other burgeoning nations in that time period) since the get go.

[Underverse]

ahhhh not even close.

[Theinquisition]

Again, to be clear, I'm glad we did. That was the era, and competing on the world stage meant being imperialistic. We wouldn't have become a credible country if we hadn't taken some shit. All I'm saying is that it's silly to act like our old school principles included anti-imperialism.



No, worries! I'm pretty damn pro-American. I don't really believe in being proud to be from somewhere (I was born here, it's not like I did something), but I'm glad to be from here and part of this.

Pretty much agree with you, although I do believe that each of our individual contributions build this nation, for better or for worse.

[Spectral]

Oh I don't disagree with you, I just don't think it's very fair to say we are against it when we have been for aggressive expansion (just like most other burgeoning nations in that time period) since the get go.

My favorite person to listen to talk about this is Dan Carlin; he's got a really interesting historical perspective on the USA's bipolar personality when it comes to these sort of things and the conflicts that arise in the public mind because of it. I can't really do it justice in a post though, I recommend just downloading some Hardcore History and burning time on it!

[Redlokyldoreifanggore]

Most of our principles, such as states' rights, gun rights, privacy rights, individualism and counter-imperialism.

States don't have rights. There is absolutely nothing that gives our individual states "rights". They have powers, something drastically different and as such are much more malleable. Privacy rights are very open to interpretation nowadays as our Founders had no idea we would one day be connected by the data enigma that is the Internet. You should also consider that "privacy" wasn't an official civil right until Roe v. Wade. The general idea for implementing it is in Amendment 9, which merely states that there may or may not be other "rights" that are specifically mentioned in the Constitution. The Right to Bear Arms (not gun rights, necessarily) took into consideration the very, very inaccurate muskets and various other weak handguns along with classic hand-to-hand combat weaponry which, in all honesty, could be anything if you want to look at it with a broad persepctive. Looking at weapons that are available now, do you think they would be of the same opinion? As for imperialism, honestly, how do you expect to run a country when it doesn't broaden its influence economically, socially, and/or militarily, especially one with such an influx of "immigrants" (I use this in a modern sense) who don't necessarily abide by one single culture. Imperialism is, for the US, a vital point to our survival and continued power and reverence (or hatred) amongst the world. Individualism? That's cultural, not governmental, unless the government specifically says what you can and cannot wear in your day-to-day life as a common citizen. If the government specifically says everyone must wear Red-White-and-Blue tie-dye and jean shorts, use only Facebook and CNN, wear only cowboy hats or baseball caps, and ascribe your life to the Christian religion, THEN you have a problem.

Another thing a lot of people fail to realise is that the Founders wanted a strong central government. They tried letting states be powerful, that was under the Articles of Confederation. Things went bad, so they changed it. It's why Congress has been able to do so much with treaties, interstate commerce, and other matters that make them look tyrannical (if you're an idiot). It's why segregation is gone, it's why states can't have obnoxious claims to certain borderlines, rivers, and other traversing areas, it's why there's an incredibly mismanaged amount of copyright and piracy issues.




Now, as to your initial point, I feel that many of my own personal interests would be absolutely ridiculous to running a legitimate country. While I'd never spy on my friends or play God with the lives of those across the seas, I know that my country is, at the moment, protected from foreign threats. Of course who knows when the next psychotic gun enthusiast is going to be near me. So yes I feel my nations values don't reflect my values, but no I don't feel that that is necessarily a bad thing, in some cases.

[Crissi]

My favorite person to listen to talk about this is Dan Carlin; he's got a really interesting historical perspective on the USA's bipolar personality when it comes to these sort of things and the conflicts that arise in the public mind because of it. I can't really do it justice in a post though, I recommend just downloading some Hardcore History and burning time on it!

oh another Dan Carlin fan! I like listening to his Rome and Civil War stuff. Probably the only good thing that came out of a fling i had.

[Spectral]

oh another Dan Carlin fan! I like listening to his Rome and Civil War stuff. Probably the only good thing that came out of a fling i had.

Yeah, it's just so good. When I first moved from shorter runs to longer ones, listening to those podcasts was the only thing that settled me down enough that I could just relax and enjoy being out there for a couple hours. They're just so damned thoughtful.

[derpkitteh]

i'm pretty extreme in my values and ideals. no nation on the planet would be in line with me.

[Sky High]

the people of my country are more in line with what I want out of my government. the actual government? fuck no.

[TheWerebison]

I live in America. We're a melting pot. I'm not even entirely sure what our nation's values and ideals are anymore. I just be me.

[wowaccounttom]

nope, i hate my birth nation, i avoid saying im from there, i hate the language, the people, the way they act.. basically i hate anything related to it.. even hate my own name.

[lokinrond713]

a nation is a human construct without thought or feeling; to consider one's own nation to have such is to impose your own vague biased ignorant view on it.

[Nakura Chambers]

I am strongly opposed to my countries political views. STRONGLY OPPOSED. This is because a new government has taken power. The leader; Tony Abbot, is just fucking awful. He's homophobic, doesn't believe in climate change, talks shit about asylum seekers, misogynist etc...

He's just fucking awful. I can't believe Australia even voted this idiot in.

He couldn't possibly be any worse than John Howard, could he?

[Klingers]

I am proud as hell to be an Australian.

We embody the fair go, expect people to have at least some thick skin, and have a firm cultural understanding of "Bring the best bits of your culture and a great attitude and make our country your own! Welcome! ...But if you want to try and impose any unshared backwards/mysogonistic cultural/religious beliefs on our mainstream society, fuck off home."

[Biske]

No. Almost everyone here in Puerto Rico is way too religious (catholic mostly). And since this is a US territory, I can expand to the US and say that almost everyone in the US is far too conservative (even the Democratic party), especially when it comes to sexuality, and the liberals aren't real liberals for the most part.

[Nakura Chambers]

Mixed bag. I think I probably line up more with somewhere like Singapore, but I mostly can't complain.

I too find myself most aligned with Singapore.

When was the US counter-imperialism? We were against us being imperialized, but pretty well in favor of conquering new lands.

Look at Thomas Jefferson's idea of building an empire of liberty that would fight against colonial powers and promote freedom, self-determination and republicanism around the world. There's also the Monroe Doctrine, the Good Neighbor Policy and the Fourteen Points.

[DEATHETERNAL]

True American values and ideals? Strongly in line.

What most people today espouse to be American values and ideals? Strongly Disconnected.