Petless Hunter talent

[Quirin]

Hey yo!


I remember reading about this talent. You have no pet and you get 20% increased damage because of the no pet. Does this talent still exist or was I seeing things? Also, if it does exist. Do you guys think that it would be viable for raiding/heroics etc? Or will it get thrown under the bus as an idea that won't be executed properly? I want to consider playing my Hunter next expansion if this talent is true and viable.

[Queen of Hamsters]

I sure hope they'll scrap it, or make DAMNED SURE you don't become stronger with it than a hunter using a pet.

FFS, I began playing this class specifically for the pet and I have spent TONS of time camping for rares, I have no interest in being forced to not use them.

[Denarius]

They tried this with warlocks early in this expansion. If i remember correctly, they nerfed it in 5.2(?) and now that's the talent almost no one chooses. That being said, i play both a warlock and a hunter, both chars 530+ ilvl and i prefer pets to no pets. If playing a class that normally has a pet, it feels weird not having one, IMO.

[7seti]

We don't know yet. Personally I have my doubts that it will make it through beta in its current form. There's just too much stuff about the class that relies on having a pet with you for a single "hey look, no pet" talent to work properly.

[ComputerNerd]

They tried this with warlocks early in this expansion. If i remember correctly, they nerfed it in 5.2(?) and now that's the talent almost no one chooses. That being said, i play both a warlock and a hunter, both chars 530+ ilvl and i prefer pets to no pets. If playing a class that normally has a pet, it feels weird not having one, IMO.

Actually it is used, it is just situational.
The very reason for the talent is that the pet suffers downtime due to travel during target switches.
Fights with lots of target switching will benefit from that talent.

It was adjusted to be more in-line with the other choices.
Initially it was simply superior in terms of dps.

[Rainsorrow]

They tried this with warlocks early in this expansion. If i remember correctly, they nerfed it in 5.2(?) and now that's the talent almost no one chooses. That being said, i play both a warlock and a hunter, both chars 530+ ilvl and i prefer pets to no pets. If playing a class that normally has a pet, it feels weird not having one, IMO.

as destro lock, I like sacrifice more than supremacy (like the dot effect of chaos bolt), but I didn't compared petless and pet dps, so I can't tell the difference

on topic - i wondered about that talent from the first time i played petless wwarlock and though how it could be implemented, in way like grimoire of sacrifice works (you get your pet special ability[without sacrificing your pet ;D] and got some aditional effects), but then, having to handle about 30 pet abilities? It wouldn't work, I guess

[Quirin]

I sure hope they'll scrap it, or make DAMNED SURE you don't become stronger with it than a hunter using a pet.

FFS, I began playing this class specifically for the pet and I have spent TONS of time camping for rares, I have no interest in being forced to not use them.

I understand your concern but at the same time you have to look at the perspective of people who want no pets. To play the role as an Archer or Ranger as such without the need to have a pet.

[Neotokyo]

I understand your concern but at the same time you have to look at the perspective of people who want no pets. To play the role as an Archer or Ranger as such without the need to have a pet.

So we should look at it from the perspective of propel that want to play a roll that doesn't exist in game? Hey I want a talent that makes my warrior viable as ranged, because I could be a ranged barbarian thing. Hunters are all about the pets. Talents like this are stupid.

[Quirin]

So we should look at it from the perspective of propel that want to play a roll that doesn't exist in game? Hey I want a talent that makes my warrior viable as ranged, because I could be a ranged barbarian thing. Hunters are all about the pets. Talents like this are stupid.

The whole idea of a warrior is to be melee and up close. If you were to become ranged you would not be considered a Warrior, so you can't really compare the two. Hunter can have two meanings, one of them being pets and the other "hunting" someone down as an Archer or Ranger. WoW's ranged physical damage class doesn't have to be totally devoid of the idea of being an Archer or Ranger. I think it would be amazing and it is technically going back to the roots of Warcraft since in Warcraft 1-3 archers were a thing, ya know.

[Deleted]

So we should look at it from the perspective of propel that want to play a roll that doesn't exist in game? Hey I want a talent that makes my warrior viable as ranged, because I could be a ranged barbarian thing. Hunters are all about the pets. Talents like this are stupid.

i dont think so. pets are useful in soloing, but pretty wayne in raids, need to be healed and such. so this talent would make sense, but i would not overdo it. more like the warlocks talent that kills the pet and gives you 20% dmg and a constant health regen or so.

the problem would be that this talent would be nice for markman but pretty stupid to choose for BM hunters. thats a major problem with the trees anyway: theres always one talent per line that is clearly for a specific specc. (some classes, not all, but paladins, druids, deathknights,monks clearly dont hace a telent tree ...)

[cuafpr]

I wish they would just make marksman a pet less tree :/

[Deleted]

So we should look at it from the perspective of propel that want to play a roll that doesn't exist in game? Hey I want a talent that makes my warrior viable as ranged, because I could be a ranged barbarian thing. Hunters are all about the pets. Talents like this are stupid.

Well, think you throw the ball a bit off tbh. There is a vast difference with a Hunter that wanna DPS without pet, then a Warrior wanna be a Hunter. Survival and MM are both spec that can work without pet (sure it a bit of dps loss), while BM truly is all about the pet. And options isn't stupid imo. As long they make it valid with and without pet.

i dont think so. pets are useful in soloing, but pretty wayne in raids, need to be healed and such. so this talent would make sense, but i would not overdo it. more like the warlocks talent that kills the pet and gives you 20% dmg and a constant health regen or so.

the problem would be that this talent would be nice for markman but pretty stupid to choose for BM hunters. thats a major problem with the trees anyway: theres always one talent per line that is clearly for a specific specc. (some classes, not all, but paladins, druids, deathknights,monks clearly dont hace a telent tree ...)

Although it isn't stupid for BM, as BM will have their pets, but just stronger. What is worry some is how it will work in PvP, that boost of damage will do insane with burst for MM and Surv etc. As well the lose of pet abilities and buffs.

[Tojara]

One talent being useless for one specialization isn't that bad of design, I believe they said they are more or less fine with their being at least two attractive options.

The talent is a preview and I hope it stays. If it's done right it will offer a choice. The warlock talent currently interacts with numerous other talents and has ping ponged between being the best DPS talent, to the worst, to now situational. It should ideally have some functionality with previous talents that include pets (losing some utility, from the pets themselves) and probably be in most cases a DPS loss, at least for BM hunters. For MM and some extent survival it should be a slight DPS loss or situational DPS gain depending on encounter.

Will it stay? I have no idea, but it obviously can be balanced correctly, they just shouldn't attempt to make it balanced for all three specializations, especially when one of them is completely centered around having a pet. If you go into balancing it with 2/3 specializations in mind you will probably have much more success.

For me I'd probably actually enjoy my hunter more. I don't like BM and I generally don't like pets, though I do play UH DK in PvP and play warlock frequently. Options however, are always nice. A hunter void of pets is interesting choice if done properly.

Honestly the best option would be to just make MM a spec that is balanced around not having a pet at all.

[Deleted]

With or without you.
Cons:
- no spirit bond
- no bad manner/lulaby/snatch/web
- no passive buff
- no master's call
- no roar of sacrifice
- no keeping stealthers in combat
- no keeping drinkers from drinking

Pros:
+ 20% extra damage

Verdict. Dragon slaying talent, useless for pvp, badtards will still do pvp with it.

[Kifimbo]

I know i am not the only hunter that wants to see it hit live. I think its a great idea. I mean yes, you dont bring any biffs to the group, but in a 20 man the hunter shouldnt have to bring any buffs.

[webwierdo]

the problem would be that this talent would be nice for markman but pretty stupid to choose for BM hunters. thats a major problem with the trees anyway: theres always one talent per line that is clearly for a specific specc. (some classes, not all, but paladins, druids, deathknights,monks clearly dont hace a telent tree ...)

If you take the talent as BM your pet gets 70% damage buff and all the abilities from all 3 pet specs

[Deleted]

I wish they would just make marksman a pet less tree :/

why you want make mm completly useless in pvp? we need petless talent for fights with pet pathing issues, we don't need petless spec.

[Goretex]

Personally I like having a pet as a "hunter" because we're not "rangers". But they should just make MM the petless spec. And it would shutup alot of people that want a petless hunter. So far the talent will still be available for WoD, but alot of changes could happen between now and then.

Also it's not really hard if they just make MM the petless spec, they would just have to put alot of the pet abilities on passive for the MM spec. Which if you think about it shouldn't be that hard. As long as they don't make the talent or a petless spec more powerful than the other specs I really don't mind the idea. We had rangers in the RTS warcrafts, just make MM the petless spec. Ever since cata I hated the MM spec anyways lol.

[Chrysia]

I sure hope they'll scrap it, or make DAMNED SURE you don't become stronger with it than a hunter using a pet.

FFS, I began playing this class specifically for the pet and I have spent TONS of time camping for rares, I have no interest in being forced to not use them.

If you're BM, this talent is completely different. It's a pet buff with access to all 3 talent trees essentially on your pet.

BM has been viable for the last three tiers as I recall, so hopefully they'll keep that up.

[Spl4sh3r]

People shouldn't worry about balancing yet. It's hardly in beta yet so numbers will be way off much like they are at the start of a new PTR. Numbers are the last thing to get adjusted, maybe they get early adjustment if they put out ridiculous numbers

As for the actual talent, seeing as the other two talents replaces something you have I feel it is the only choice to pick without drastically changing the way you play. Though it sucks because it does nothing if you have your pet out. So what I am saying is they need to add something for when you have your pet out and you aren't Beast Mastery.