SOTU Impressions

[bergmann620]

Did anyone see the dials on the speech last night? You expect there to be a huge gap between Democrat and Republican, but I was surprised by how close the Independents stuck to the Republicans, and maybe more so by how all the lines fell off a cliff when he mentioned the ACA.

[THE Bigzoman]

As a conserative myself, I actually feel sorry for the guy at this point.

You can clearly see this roller coaster ride has taken a toll on him physically. And a good chunk of the battles he had to fight were fucking stupid.

My academic adviser at my old Community College and best friend, Ruben, is a Bolivian immigrant and a vocal liberal socialist. He's essentially a Bolivian Endus.

Despite that, we have looked at the entirety of the Immigration reform bill by the Gang of Eight and were both perfectly ok with it's contents. But the House won't support it over monetary allocations to something that won't eliminate the incentive nor drive of people to enter the country illegally. Seriously? The handling of immigrants goes far beyond buying the shiniest defense systems. Enforcement has and will continue to stretch beyond that into domestic measures (Deportation, fining business etc.)

Then there was the government shutdown, which was fucking stupid on the Republican end politically. But from what I can see, Republicans are poised to establish a greater foothold in the House and possibly take the Senate this year despite this shenaggin.

Apart from Gun Control not passing, Obama puts up with a lot of shit. And rather then him being the Bugs Bunny outdoing the Elmer Fud on the political spectrum (Like he did from 2007-2012), he appears drained and defeated over partisan bullshit that shouldn't have even happened in the magnitude that it did.

[Naxere]

Didn't bother watching it. There was a rerun of Diners, Drive-Ins, and Dives on that was more interesting.

[bergmann620]

I just hope he acts like a President the rest of the term. I don't have a problem with him doing whatever he can without Congress, so long as it is in bounds with existing executive power. I just wish he would start leading, and stop blaming. He still has a higher rating than Congress, at least.

I will say that I thought it was stupid to mention gun control, that I wish he wouldn't have went with the 77-cents-on-the-dollar feminist talking point, and that he would have addressed the ACA rollout in a more realistic manner.

All in all, I miss the 2000's when I could pretend Jed Bartlett was the Democratic President

[Raeph]

Just watched the highlights and some commentary on it this morning.

The consensus seems to be: 1)We've heard this before, 2)He sounds tired, defeated and boring, 3)Government intervention in the economy isn't going well and it is at least good that he wants to pull the government out of housing, 4)He's go-it-alone-stance seems more one of desperation rather than actual toughness because his orders will effect very little of the economic activity of the country because it will only control department funds but congress still gets to tell those departments how much they can and can't spend and 5)He seems now relegated to campaigning for the larger Democrat party, and stirring the base with no real hope of much else legislatively that he can claim.

Republicans don't trust him and will not work with him. Host of answers why, and that maybe a good discussion later.
Moderate Democrats are laying low or are in open opposition because of the terrible ACA rollout.
Party Faithful Democrats are with him, but disillusioned because he has made many promises in the last 5 years on furthering core Democrat ideals but has not been able to deliver on them. (High taxes on the wealthy, Affordable College, Single-payer Healthcare, Expansion of middle class, Immigration Reform, DREAM act, Jobs in general etc).

[OneSent]

I caught about an hour of it. It was just more of the same. It's always the same, year after year after year.

The State of the Union is nothing more than a pep rally. President Obama was the valedictorian giving the speech about how we're going to win the big game and beat all the other teams (ie: countries). There was a lot of smoke being blown up our asses, a lot of telling us what we want to hear and playing on people's personal sob stories from the audience to appeal to the average student's needs (ie: average American).

It even had the same spirit of a pep rally. People standing up and cheering every time he finished a statement and then during the applause he would speak louder and start pointing into the crowd chanting "We can do it! It's time!". Meanwhile, I'm just sitting at home, rolling my eyes. Are we really so gullible?

Anyways, it's always rather difficult to take any of it seriously. When you can see through the bullshit, these State of the Union addresses become almost comical in their theatrics. He could have given the entire speech from his desk in the Oval Office, it wouldn't have changed the message. Let's see just how much of it we actually see happen this year.

[Wikiy]

My impression? My impression is that Americans should really not be surprised there are quite a lot of people out there in other countries (not me among them) who hate/dislike/stereotype your country/nation when you have your president arrogantly and smugly say America is the greatest country on Earth several times and have him get nothing but praise for it. Even if that is true, even if America is the greatest country on Earth, saying something like that is arrogant and sort of makes your entire country look like a little kid. Which, you know, actively contributes to it not being as great as it could be.

This doesn't happen literally anywhere else. Not a single place on Earth. Even in places that actually probably are the greatest on Earth (by the measure of quality of life), like Sweden or Norway.

[swineflu]

Obama came across relatively relaxed last night, basically because he knows two things: he isn’t getting anything substantive out of the GOP, but he’s achieved a lot, and his signature achievement is looking increasingly secure. The real theme of the SOTU was “Whatever.”

I think the fading of the deficit both in reality and as an issue is important here. A missive from Fix the Debt landed in my inbox:

We are disappointed that President Obama did not choose to place a greater focus on our nation’s long-term debt problems in tonight’s State of the Union address. The President should be actively working with Congress seeking solutions to our debt problem rather than relegating it to the political sidelines. The State of the Union was a chance for him to lead on this issue instead of leaving these tough choices to be made by the next President.

That’s the whine of people who have found themselves irrelevant. Obama isn’t afraid of the big bad deficit any more, and he knows that there won’t be a Grand Bargain, so there’s nothing he can or should do on the front that absorbed so much of his energy for three years.

Meanwhile, health reform. Substantively, there has been an impressive comeback from the two horrible first months. The workability of the law is now clear — in California, which never had the teething troubles, enrollments are running ahead of expectations, most insurers are pretty sanguine about the age and health mix, and the polling is slowly improving.

Republicans are meeting these developments with a mixture of denial and Benghazification — insistence that the law is collapsing, that people may be signing up but they won’t actually pay for their policies, etc., combined with the belief that if they just tell a few more dubious horror stories about rate shock or losing your favorite doctor, the public will rise up and demand repeal.

I’d be interested, by the way, to know the details about the constituent described in the official GOP response, who supposedly faced a $700 a month rise in premiums. What kind of plan did she have? Did that number include subsidies? The ACA is supposed to keep health costs to 8 percent of income, so the only way you could get numbers like that is if the individual (a) had a really bare-bones policy offering hardly any protection and (b) has an income well over $100,000.

We don’t know the particulars here, but many if not most stories of rate shock turn out to involve people who didn’t actually apply for a policy, and therefore never found out what it would really cost.

Anyway, the point is that despite his low poll numbers, time is on Obama’s side, and he knows it.

-from paul krugmans blog

[Tastyfish]

I am a little worried about the food stamp situation since the farm bill is going to cut even more out of it. Other then that, Biden is the winner from last night, just for the meme factor alone.

[Tailswipe]

My impression? My impression is that Americans should really not be surprised there are quite a lot of people out there in other countries (not me among them) who hate/dislike/stereotype your country/nation when you have your president arrogantly and smugly say America is the greatest country on Earth several times and have him get nothing but praise for it. Even if that is true, even if America is the greatest country on Earth, saying something like that is arrogant and sort of makes your entire country look like a little kid. Which, you know, actively contributes to it not being as great as it could be.

This doesn't happen literally anywhere else. Not a single place on Earth. Even in places that actually probably are the greatest on Earth (by the measure of quality of life), like Sweden or Norway.

To be fair the US is undoubtedly the greatest country on earth and I don't see any issue with them being proud of it. Having pride in your country seems like an almost a foreign concept to Europeans now days.

As for the speech I read it as "I didn't achieve all this stuff I wanted to in 2013 so I'll give it another go in 2014". It was just a rehash of the 2013 SOTU with different bits of fluff added in.

[Payday]

Other then that, Biden is the winner from last night, just for the meme factor alone.

Nah, the teary eyed thumbs up from Boner to Obama was way better.

Did anyone see the dials on the speech last night? You expect there to be a huge gap between Democrat and Republican, but I was surprised by how close the Independents stuck to the Republicans, and maybe more so by how all the lines fell off a cliff when he mentioned the ACA.

Who's lines? Luntz?

[Wikiy]

To be fair the US is undoubtedly the greatest country on earth and I don't see any issue with them being proud of it.

Yeah, that's really not a widely-held opinion. It might be by Americans, but again, even if it's true, it doesn't matter. It's arrogant. Being proud doesn't mean being superior. And talking about one's own country like that is exactly that. And honestly, the notion that one's own country is superior to others (which is honestly what "greatness" in this context comes across to me) is nothing but arrogance.

Having pride in your country seems like an almost a foreign concept to Europeans now days. \

Pride is okay. Patriotism is okay. Europeans do have those feelings. What we [generally] don't have is nationalism. That's because we learned through dozens of millions of dead and hundreds of cities burned to the ground what nationalism leads to. Arguably, America hasn't had these issues to teach it a lesson, partly due to its success as a country, but it could learn some things from others. Such as the fact that nationalism is idiotic.

Edit: Oh, and that bloody elimination of nationalism is what led to European integration. It's what's led to Europeans being capable of seeing other countries (specifically, other European countries) as partners with whom we can work together to achieve common prosperity. Obama doesn't aim at anything close to that. In fact, he does the exact opposite. He even specifically uses the words "beat other countries" which makes it apparent just how much he views other countries as rivals in a competition rather than partners in a teamwork task.

[bergmann620]

Who's lines? Luntz?

I'm honestly not sure. Both of my furnaces died yesterday, so I caught some of the replay on whatever channel my wife had it on when I went upstairs to pass out

- - - Updated - - -

Edit: Oh, and that bloody elimination of nationalism is what led to European integration. It's what's led to Europeans being capable of seeing other countries (specifically, other European countries) as partners with whom we can work together to achieve common prosperity. Obama doesn't aim at anything close to that. In fact, he does the exact opposite. He even specifically uses the words "beat other countries" which makes it apparent just how much he views other countries as rivals in a competition rather than partners in a teamwork task.

I don't know... Democratic politicians are in a weird spot, because they feel the need to show off their patriotism, but also maintain a global 'sophistication'. They need to be pro-immigrant (legal and otherwise) while also supporting unions that are often anti-immigrant. They need to seem somewhat protectionist, while still taking money from (the American arm of) international unions. It's gotta be pretty easier to look like you're trying too hard when you have so many masters to please.

[Wikiy]

I don't know... Democratic politicians are in a weird spot, because they feel the need to show off their patriotism, but also maintain a global 'sophistication'. They need to be pro-immigrant (legal and otherwise) while also supporting unions that are often anti-immigrant. They need to seem somewhat protectionist, while still taking money from (the American arm of) international unions. It's gotta be pretty easier to look like you're trying too hard when you have so many masters to please.

Yeah, well, to be honest, I don't actually believe that Obama himself believes all the "greatest nation on Earth" crap. It's a bit scary that things are actually so desperate that the president can't give a speech without glorifying the country in such a way and come off as having given a proper speech.

[Roxinius]

couldn't really watch more then a few minutes of it same bullshit different year

[Throne]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cJL46tSutWE