Possibly no flying throughout entire xpac.

[zEmini]

There are some things you can't pick and choose.

More rationalization and excuses. Get a clue guys. I don't even PvP and that rogue had more health than I did. It was PROOF of how it kills world WPvP. You can rationalize it all you want.

Yah you can choose to use ground mounts. Don't be a hypocrite. Maybe the best solution is to just make a new server type that has ZERO flying.

What about PvE servers? Since your precious wPvP is ruined as you say, they should not have to suffer. Lets keep balancing PvE because of PvP? Sounds like blizz logic.

Also rogues will be rogues. You can't get the jump on them ... ever.

[Deamon002]

More delusions. WPvP is shit-your opinion. It's WORLD of WARCRAFT. And you want to cut both of those words from the fucking game rofl.

The world is still there, I can even see far more of it than when I'm groundbound. Pvp Combat is still there, not removed at all; you just can't force it as easily. Talk about delusions.

[Dormie]

Yah you can choose to use ground mounts. Don't be a hypocrite. Maybe the best solution is to just make a new server type that has ZERO flying.

What about PvE servers? Since your precious wPvP is ruined as you say, they should not have to suffer. Lets keep balancing PvE because of PvP? Sounds like blizz logic.

Also rogues will be rogues. You can't get the jump on them ... ever.

First of all, I should remind that PvP is only a side aspect of this change. So no matter how valid or invalid you think no flight is relative to PvP, it's only a small part of this topic. So you're attacking the foot of a giant right now.

You CAN choose to be a ground mount but the point of wanting to use them is gone when flying is an option. Don't be naive. And sure, make a server type with no flying.

What about PvE servers? I don't even WPvP or PvP in general much, but that doesn't mean it's not a good thing. All being on a PvE server means is that you are not immediately flagged for PvP. So don't give me some made up number about how many people you think do and don't PvP.

And yea rogues can get away, but flying changes it completely. They don't even need to hide. It is hardly even the same situation. And in case you haven't noticed, anyone can do what the rogue did. All it takes is a stun and a distance maker and you're mounted into invincibility.

[Aberzombie]

It was PROOF of how it kills world WPvP.

Wrong. The only "proof" is that whoever/whatever was at the controls did not want to engage in wpvp, not that flight killed it. Instanced pvp killed wpvp; it has more incentive/reward. In more than one way. Besides, most players (roughly 60%) play on PvE realms. How did/does using their flying mounts there "kill" wpvp on your pvp server?

Talk about "rationalizations". You're worse that a flat-earther.

It's WORLD of WARCRAFT. And you want to cut both of those words from the fucking game rofl.

How so? Being out and about in the open world seems far better than locking one's self up in instance queues and flyers do the open world thing far, far more than the Content Locusts and Queue Hermits. And for "War"craft, the term is not specifically limited to pvp, fighting the mobs is "war" too, yuh know? How are either of those words being "cut" from the game? Don't be any more of a moron than absolutely necessary. It's so obvious you're baiting the issue it's nearly painful.

(edit)

[Dormie]

Tell me why flight should stay.

[zEmini]

Actually you need to tell us why it shouldn't with out it being some personal reason.

It has been a part of the core game for 7 years now?

[Drytoast]

Actually you need to tell us why it shouldn't with out it being some personal reason.

It has been a part of the core game for 7 years now?

It's so that he has a better chance at defending herb nodes from rogues...cause wpvp or something.

[-Superman-]

You do not need flight or outdoor world gathering to "stay competitive" as an elite raider and you know it as well as I do.

You only need X amount of food, potions and flasks from farming and even if somebody spends an hour per week more getting that amount of those things, they are not reduced in competitiveness. And let's not even pretend that guilds, guildies and the AH don't provide most of those things for exactly zero interaction with the world for a great many players.

If the only argument you people can come up with for not using your ground mounts by choice is because you lose a few herb or mining nodes that might somehow make you "less competitive", then you are really grasping at straws (and apparently strawmen or something)...

Of course I do. I am a pro-flier who uses ground mounts in Beta, and in old world RP.

[Arbs]

Tell me why flight should stay.

There reason is because they like it & it makes the game easier for them, With minimal time spent.

Ya it is so amazing -_-. Not saying that without flying makes the game hard, but atleast on a PvP server you may have to watch your back.

(It's a PvP server for a reason).

Honestly my opinion is Flying should be restricted on PvP / RP-PvP servers & PvE / RP servers gets flying with no restrictions honestly.
But still no flying while leveling.

[Drytoast]

How do you think he could continue to gather herbs around me on a ground mount?

It's interesting watching the rationalization and mental gymnastics people pull.

Rogues have more than enough class abilities to incapacitate you while they pick the very flower your standing on, vanish then mount at safe distance if at all...

Like my Druid in water...ain't nothin you can do to catch me at all. And not a flying mount would be used. Your beef to protect the pretty flowers is not a compelling enough reason to blame flying for your lack of understanding class mechanics

[-Superman-]

If you actually read full posts you wouldn't be asking me this.

Though to be honest I'm not super interested in another one of these dead end conversations with you... I just felt like calling out your bullshit. Mission accomplished.

So you agree that flight adds NO competitive edge for raiding, but a convenient edge to rush to rares and resources. Thank you for that perspective. Simply proves that without flight in Draenor, Raiders lose no competitive edge, and other people are just bitching and moaning cause they can't fly.

[Dormie]

Actually you need to tell us why it shouldn't with out it being some personal reason.

It has been a part of the core game for 7 years now?

So? You are the ones with the problem with the change. Tell us why it should stay.

Rogues have more than enough class abilities to incapacitate you while they pick the very flower your standing on, vanish then mount at safe distance if at all...

Like my Druid in water...ain't nothin you can do to catch me at all. And not a flying mount would be used. Your beef to protect the pretty flowers is not a compelling enough reason to blame flying for your lack of understanding class mechanics

What part of it's not just rogues do you understand? And you're actually wrong, if we're on the ground you actually have to think about getting away unseen.
Again, the whole PvP aspect of this is just a bonus.

[Drytoast]

There reason is because they like it & it makes the game easier for them, With minimal time spent.

Ya it is so amazing -_-. Not saying that without flying makes the game hard, but atleast on a PvP server you may have to watch your back.

(It's a PvP server for a reason).

Honestly my opinion is Flying should be restricted on PvP / RP-PvP servers & PvE / RP servers gets flying with no restrictions honestly.
But still no flying while leveling.

Ya....I'll try to remember to fear the 12 registered level capped horde on my server...1 might happen to be around that next tree. Intense shit man, totally worth flight removal...

[Dormie]

Ya....I'll try to remember to fear the 12 registered level capped horde on my server...1 might happen to be around that next tree. Intense shit man, totally worth flight removal...

Yea let's base game design decisions around broken servers.

[Drytoast]

So? You are the ones with the problem with the change. Tell us why it should stay.



What part of it's not just rogues do you understand? And you're actually wrong, if we're on the ground you actually have to think about getting away unseen.
Again, the whole PvP aspect of this is just a bonus.

Ooh boy are you in for a rude awakening...people will not have to think any more to get away from your lame ass with or with out flight.

It's going to be the same set of skills used and your gonna stand there dumb founded as to why on a ground mount, that same rogue can tell you more or less to fuck off without ever saying a word.

- - - Updated - - -

Yea let's base game design decisions around broken servers.

Base game design around what you see your gamers gravitating towards. I'll give ya a hint. It isn't wpvp.

[Deleted]

There reason is because they like it & it makes the game easier for them, With minimal time spent.

Ya it is so amazing -_-. Not saying that without flying makes the game hard (That is a lie), but atleast on a PvP server you may have to watch your back.

(It's a PvP server for a reason).

Honestly my opinion is Flying should be restricted on PvP / RP-PvP servers & PvE / RP servers gets flying with no restrictions honestly.

Minimal time spent? Really? Pretty much no matter what you do in this game, it is going to take quite a bit of time. Now, that is of course all relative compared to what your definition of quite a bit of time is, but WoW is not like Hearthstone or Dota 2/LoL, or other multiplayer games where you can log in for ~30 minutes and do stuff. I could imagine that most people who want flying just don't really feel that the reasons we have been given outweigh the loss of that time.

Better quests? Nope. More interesting mechanics, made possible purely because of no flying? Beyond jumping puzzles, nope. Dangerous world? Nope.

World PvP is almost never a fair situation. The only people who like world PvP are probably messed up in their heads, since it is pretty much the only type of gameplay in WoW where you literally ruin another player's fun in order to entertain yourself, whether they like it or not.

Either the guy getting jumped is outleveled, outgeared, outnumbered (NPC or multiple gankers), or AFK. What kind of a player would find it enjoyable to fight in those kinds of situations? It is not a challenge (At all, or you wouldn't go for it), you get 0 reward from it, and you are wasting both your own time and that person's time. I mean seriously. What in the world is wrong with people who like that.

[Arbs]

So you agree that flight adds NO competitive edge for raiding, but a convenient edge to rush to rares and resources. Thank you for that perspective. Simply proves that without flight in Draenor, Raiders lose no competitive edge, and other people are just bitching and moaning cause they can't fly.

Well that why I'm not so worried about flying being restricted for a patch or so, It gives me no edge inside a raid instance. I don't need flying to raid, If I want to get their fast I just get a lock to summon me really.

Really all those casual players get ported into the Raids with LFR. .

[Anzaman]

A lot of people like to say we're trying to force world PvP, or that we just really want people to look at the pretty trees we made, but those really aren't the reasons that drive this same decision we've made every expansion.

[Deleted]

Yea let's base game design decisions around broken servers.

Maybe it just shows that an overwhelmingly vast majority dislikes world PvP, because there has to be something fundamentally wrong with you to find it enjoyable. Did that ever occur to you?

[Anzaman]

World PvP is almost never a fair situation. The only people who like world PvP are probably messed up in their heads, since it is pretty much the only type of gameplay in WoW where you literally ruin another player's fun in order to entertain yourself, whether they like it or not.

Isn't that like the whole point of WPvP? To ambush other players in the world.

"In contrast to the ordered, structured experience of arena or battleground play, world PvP is unpredictable, unbalanced and usually unprovoked, and can offer some of the wildest and most unfair PvP to be found."

"World PvP has never been fair. World PvP can be the most amazing experience, but often it is is a dog eat dog eat situation where people will do anything for a kill... sportsmanship be damned."

"World PvP covers a wide range of potential activities, but primarily refers to spontaneous PvP combat between two or more players within the normal game world. World PvP is therefore far more common on PvP servers, where all players are automatically enabled for PvP combat in most zones. The free occurrence of world PvP is the defining difference between PvP and PvE servers.

World PvP tends to be the most unbalanced of all PvP, and frequently features players of far larger numbers or higher level on one side than the other. Characters may be set upon by a group of opposing players, or levelling players may be ganked repeatedly by a max level player. Gearing differences also impact world PvP far more than other forms of PvP, as many players who find themselves being engaged in world PvP will be wearing PvE gear.

As such, world PvP is also to some the most natural and most enjoyable of all forms of PvP. In contrast to the structured encounters of other forms, world PvP is entirely unrestricted, unbalanced and often unplanned. It features some the of most spontaneous PvP in the game, with players finding themselves up against unknown opponents of unpredictable strength and numbers. World PvP lacks the objectives of battlegrounds and PvP zones, and lacks the balance and fine-tuning of Arena compositions. It is the most simple and unfair of all PvP, into which the player may be thrust without warning, at any time.

World PvP is frequently non-consensual, with unwilling participants ganked by more combative players. A typical example of world PvP might see one player ambushing another as they go about other activities, such as questing or gathering resources. As such, the attacked party is frequently unprepared for combat, and may lack the gear, specialization, talents and glyphs, playing experience and/or simply the inclination to participate in PvP combat. Conversely, the attacker is usually a player who enjoys PvP combat, frequently engages in it, and likely has appropriate gear and customisations in place. Since initiating such combat is entirely optional, participation in world PvP tends to be skewed heavily toward PvP players, often those with substantial experience and powerful PvP gear.

A large factor in the enjoyment of world PvP is the thrill of attacking an unprepared opponent, or of spotting a nearby player stalking you, and wondering if they are about to attack. Many players choose to play on PvP servers for precisely this reason: the ever-present threat of attack, the need for constant vigilance in case of ambush, and the potential for unplanned mayhem at any time. This can add a whole extra level to the game when exploring the world and engaging in mundane tasks such as farming dailies, bringing a genuine sense of danger and surprise to the otherwise fairly safe and predictable world zones.

World PvP most often occurs either solo or in small pre-formed groups. Players may find themselves banding together with nearby allies, or suddenly assaulted by a passing player of the opposing faction, just when victory was within their grasp. Smaller instances of world PvP can spiral into wide-scale faction battles if friends and guild-mates are called upon to join the fray. However, the majority of spontaneous world PvP features only a few players.

Motivations for world PvP vary. While all honorable kills reward players with [Honor Points], these rewards are generally minuscule in comparison to those readily obtainable through means such as battlegrounds. Within special world PvP-oriented zones (see below), specific objectives are often the reason for engagement. However, outside of these situations, the most common motivation is simple enjoyment, at least from the perspective of the attacker."

http://wowpedia.org/World_PvP