Moonkin patchnotes

[Aboubacar]

One thing to keep in mind: At 0% haste, Hurricane generates 200 eclipse power in 15 seconds(unless you have equinox, then it's 20 seconds). We can actually perpetually AoE at 100 and permanently keep up NG while doing so.
We might not do the most damage, but damn it, we are going to sit here and keep doing it till everythings turned to fine dust.*rotate arms above head*

As for the shroom perk, i think it's supposed to be for tactical gameplay, not so much for improved AE. Set them up when you need a big burst at a specific time, but damage before that doesn't matter as much. Also remember that talking about numbers is pointless right now, the mechanics are what matters.



It wasn't 400% increased DoT damage, it was 400% increased tick rate. It was also channeled, so you couldn't do anything else during it. I'm not surprised to see it gone.


IS is supposed to do crazy high damage, too. I wouldn't get to hung up on the cast time for now.

This is a tweet about IS last night:

@Celestalon Why is starfall hitting more targets? stars are capped at 20? why ever use insect swarm? does it a insane amount of dmg?
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Celestalon ‏@Celestalon 11h
@Dmanneck Stars are capped at 30 with that. Insect Swarm accelerates your rotation, and does a lot of damage.

Not understanding what u mean w/ improved storms. Wouldn't you just tab dot IS? guess thats only 5 energy, but you're going to be hurricaning a lot w/ no eclipse buff. Why would equinox make it take 5 more sec? wouldn't it be faster?

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The thing with AOE is it almost always has to burst. Otherwise you'd just multi dot it. I can't think of any scenario where I'd want to aoe casually, then burst shrooms later. If you want to hit many things hard a fast - you must hit many things slowly with wet noodles first. Just doesn't seem right to me.

Either let them charge from other sources, be it DOTs, or single target dps. Or let them be placed with a slow auto charge, capping at 15seconds etc, the longer they been down the harder they hit when you explode them.

As things stand now, mechanic wise - by the time you'd done enough hurricaning to charge them, your targets will surely die before you detonate.

Yeah but there's usually waves of adds, right? So lets pretend this is a DPS version of the resto mushroom. First wave people have some cooldowns or something and you're just hurricaning, maybe around the low end of the aoe in your raid. Next wave comes and you detonate this thing on it and chunk them for 10 maybe 20% HP? Or maybe its less burst but charges faster.

I don't think you can speculate on it's strength, just whether or not you like the gameplay mechanic. Basically you do actually like weaving in a shroom placement and detonate instead of just using hurricaning (and ofc multidotting if they spawn edge of the room then clump later etc). I feel like you're speculating that it will be bad a bit too soon idk.

[Milkyz]

I like the overall changes. I do share the feeling of "where dafuq I'll put IS in my bars...", but I'll work it out :P

Think we could use a Glyph that made we spawn only one Shroom that deals the same damage as if it were three; but removing the Slowing Area.

[Aboubacar]

I like the overall changes. I do share the feeling of "where dafuq I'll put IS in my bars...", but I'll work it out :P

Think we could use a Glyph that made we spawn only one Shroom that deals the same damage as if it were three; but removing the Slowing Area.

In place of innervate XD.

Why wouldn't they make it an exact copy of resto shroom instead of making this cost 3gcds? that would suck

[xtramuscle]

Yeah but there's usually waves of adds, right? So lets pretend this is a DPS version of the resto mushroom. First wave people have some cooldowns or something and you're just hurricaning, maybe around the low end of the aoe in your raid. Next wave comes and you detonate this thing on it and chunk them for 10 maybe 20% HP? Or maybe its less burst but charges faster.

I don't think you can speculate on it's strength, just whether or not you like the gameplay mechanic. Basically you do actually like weaving in a shroom placement and detonate instead of just using hurricaning (and ofc multidotting if they spawn edge of the room then clump later etc). I feel like you're speculating that it will be bad a bit too soon idk.

I get what you're saying. I don't know, I just think the lose of 3 globals placing an aoe preemtively, in a static position ahead of time should be enough of a cost to trade with hard burst when you want it. Like in firelands. I don't think you should need to AOE on top of AOE to ...AOE.
Certain fights come to mind when you suggest certain mechanics. When you said waves of adds, I thought of Beth'tilac. But the adds you were assigned to aoe, had to die asap. Galakras in our guild might be a little different to in yours, even the packs of 7-8 get RIPPED APART in a matter of seconds until there is 3 or so left, and then it isn't worth AOEing. Should it take 4 or so packs of weak aoe just to top the last pack? I mean that detonate would have to do INSANE damage to balance out (unless they increase hurricane damage significantly compared to other classes similar spells not just via 'perks' that every class is gaining. The last example I thought of was your idea of mobs starting at edges and then grouping up, and it reminded me of HC Sha, a fight boomkins were great on. But if as you said, you dotted the outside adds, and you executed the fight properly.. you'd never really get to hurricane, so again the mushrooms wouldn't be charged and would be next to useless.

This is my concern. Ideally we'd like mushrooms to be a viable option INSTEAD of hurricane. Clever use of time, pre-placing shrooms during movement (which would otherwise be a lull in dps) for a gain in dps later when the expected adds move over that exact spot. That in my eyes is boxing clever. I just don't think placing mushrooms in a certain spot, and expecting 3 packs of adds to die there before a 4th can be NUKED is clever. And there arn't many, if any fights with 8+_ targets up for THAT long to make it usual on only 1 set of adds. All I can think of is halfus and maybe hc 4th boss in HOF who's name escapes me.

I want the class to be better, I've always liked the idea of charging the shrooms up, I just don't think via other AOE is the way to go about it.

[Aboubacar]

-snip-

I like your idea of just using shrooms to aoe and charging it with DoTs, but if they made it just one big shroom (also movable and holds the charge) this would remove a ton of hassle, making it heaps easier to setup and keep "depth" with our aoe rather than just one spell.

the shrooms gain charges every time hurricane does damage - so I'd assume they charge rather quickly (5% each time it deals damage up to 300%). Sounds like it could work well, but not being able to move it/them would make it very difficult to pull off on most encounters. The mobs would have to be dragged over them by the tanks.

[Cerus]

Equinox is still there.
http://www.wowdb.com/talent-calculator-wod#GAAt
Make sure you choose Balance on the right.

For bears, thrash has no CD now, not sure about enrage. But there are a lot more ways to get rage now, so maybe there won't be a need?

Ah - guess I missed it in the patch notes. Regardless - eclipse is a crap mechanic and should have a 100% uptime by default. We shouldn't have to choose whether to have our DPS constantly going up or down or not. No other class has to pre-buff themselves like boomers. Far as the rage goes - it seems they reduced all the rage gains from abilities. I also didn't see if warriors lost their enrage or not.

[Aboubacar]

Ah - guess I missed it in the patch notes. Regardless - eclipse is a crap mechanic and should have a 100% uptime by default. We shouldn't have to choose whether to have our DPS constantly going up or down or not. No other class has to pre-buff themselves like boomers. Far as the rage goes - it seems they reduced all the rage gains from abilities. I also didn't see if warriors lost their enrage or not.

berserker rage specifically is just a fear/sap/etc break. Idk if there's another spell or not,

[Stommped]

Also they better allow us to use SI in Moonkin form, preferably without having to use a glyph like Roar.

[Aboubacar]

Also they better allow us to use SI in Moonkin form, preferably without having to use a glyph like Roar.

Well one of the feral leveling perks is allowing rejuv to be cast in bear and cat form. Seems more likely that even the roar glyph would end up baseline, especially 40 yard range.

This also makes the currentSI glyph and entirely viable option - I already use ursoc glyph a lot just because lol big heal. Probably waiting to share glyph changes. I can't wait for more info, I've already read every class lol

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also a leveling perk makes owlkin frenzy proc make next healing/damage spell cast in next 10secs instant. sounds really nice, It chain procs on a ton of fights like thok for example. Hopefully they dont pull an ultraxion with it though, where nothing procced it.

[huth]

The thing with AOE is it almost always has to burst. Otherwise you'd just multi dot it. I can't think of any scenario where I'd want to aoe casually, then burst shrooms later. If you want to hit many things hard a fast - you must hit many things slowly with wet noodles first. Just doesn't seem right to me.

Multidotting or AoE is a question of number of targets, not time. Also, you're applying current content to future mechanics, that's not going to get you useful results.

As the perk currently reads, at 60 targets the shrooms would be fully charged after a single hurricane tick. Starting at 6 targets, it can be fully charged with a single cast. Also, everything is supposed to live longer in WoD.

[land]

Suddenly I don't feel like playing my Boomkin anymore, I don't really like the changes at all. I hate doing AoE packs at the moment. I can't imagine what it will be like in the future. I think that I am going to switch specs to see if something else might be fun. If not, then I think it's time to shelve my druid for a while.

I've already done that, got completely sick out of my boomie while progressing on H-Garrosh and decided I had enough with him. I've literally jumped off a cliff on my druid and logged off, won't be getting back on him till WoD. I'm currently testing out my lock and gotta tell you, so far the diff is amazing. Not only damage-wise but playability/QoL oh yeah and the retarded AoE destro have. It really feels like theres a lot of love for locks and almost none for boomies. Not surprised with these patch notes, very little done to some of the major issues we have.

[voxTree]

Keep in mind we have no idea how glyphs will affect us, either. We could potentially have a glyph that condenses our three Mushrooms into one Mushroom, but removes the slow or increases the CD by 1-2 seconds or something. We really don't know at this point.

I was watching Celestalon on twitter last night, and he said windwalker monks are getting a Fists of Fury glyph that removes the stun and allows them to channel while moving. That's a pretty substantial change for them, so I would expect them to give other classes quality of life changes as well.

It's fun to speculate on this stuff, but until we see a full set of glyphs and use the spec in beta it's a bit silly to make broad judgement calls at this point. At face value, I'm pretty happy with the perks/talents (though I admit the 90 tier is lacking...). Sure, it's not perfect, but it's more love than we've ever received in other expansions.

[Tarm]

Some Moonkin love in the mined Druid glyphs.

Glyph of Astral Communion - Your Astral Communion ability can be used while moving.
Glyph of Imbued Bark - While Barkskin is active, when you are interrupted the resulting school lock has $s1% reduced duration.
Glyph of Celestial Alignment - Celestial Alignment now lasts $s1 sec, or until $160373n spells have been cast with it active, whichever occurs first.
Glyph of Sudden Eclipse - While not in an Eclipse state critical attacks done to you restore $s1 Solar or Lunar energy whichever is more beneficial to you. This effect can only occur once every $159449s2 sec.
Glyph of Moonwarding - Moonkin Form no longer grants bonus armor, but instead grants $s1% increased maximum health.

Glyph of Travel - Travel Form grants an additional $s1% movement speed, but can no longer be used while in combat. This effect is disabled in battlegrounds and arenas and cannot be combined with other temporary speed bonuses.
Glyph of the Shapemender - Each time you activate a shapeshift form, you are healed for $159454s1% of your maximum health.



Some thoughts from a PvE perspective:

• Glyph of Astral Communion will be situationally useful if there are fights where we need to move when we don't have anything to dot or Starsurge.
• Glyph of Moonwarding looks like it could be an interesting choice that we swap back and forth. Allows us to have more health for magic damage heavy fights or more armor for physical damage heavy fights.
• Glyph of Celestial Alignment is curious. Not quite sure what to make of it. Interested to see the numbers. Right now CA lasts 15 seconds, so at the GCD cap we can cast 15 instant spells max (or much fewer spells if we are casting a mix of instants and hard casts). Maybe this glyph will make it last longer (say 30 seconds?) to enable more hard casting while introducing a cap on number of spells cast (15 casts?)? Could be an effort to improve CA's usefulness against a single target without improving it's multidotting ability. Sitting in CA forever in a single target fight would be counterproductive though: lower NG uptime and no synergy with any of the level 100 talents... Not sure what they're going for here. Need more info to figure this one out.
• Glyph of Travel will be fun. I bet that it will increase Travel Form's speed up to that of a normal ground mount.

[Deleted]

Glyph of Astral Communion - Your Astral Communion ability can be used while moving.

They must be removing the PvP bonuses, but this is great because I've been wanting this in PvE for ages. Imagine it in Challenge Modes for example, or Proving Grounds.

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Glyph of Moonwarding - Moonkin Form no longer grants bonus armor, but instead grants $s1% increased maximum health.[LIST]

I would imagine the health would be about equal to the health we are losing from HOTW no longer giving stamina. SO great news there too

[Glurp]

With some of those glyphs, the change to owlkin frenzy and insect swarm I can see good things in the future for Boomkin PvP.

[crunk]

what glurp said. we might be entering the age of the viable arena moonkin w/ these new glyphs + insect swarm. i might start playing again afterall.

[Tarm]

Besides their benefits for PvP, some of the recent changes could also give Moonkins more incentive to off-tank adds for a DPS boost.

We already have:

• +100% armor
• A base 70% pushback reduction from Celestial Focus
• A 15% chance on being attacking of getting Owlkin Frenzy which gives us immunity to pushback and +10% damage for 10 seconds

And we'll be getting:

• An additional 100% bonus armor (+200% armor total now)
• Triggering Owlkin Frenzy makes our next spell instant

So, we'll have additional ability to absorb some physical damage and doing so will give us a nice dps bonus.

Consider a fight in which we are able to tank a few adds that are hitting us with melee attacks. If we're getting hit enough, we could have a very high uptime on Owlkin Frenzy, giving us an almost permanent 10% damage boost, immunity to pushback, and a whole bunch of instant Starfire/Wrath casts.

For example:
If we are being hit once per second, we would get a proc every 6.7 seconds on average, and the overall uptime of Owlkin Frenzy would be 80%.
If we are being hit twice per second, we would get a proc every 3.3 seconds on average, and the overall uptime of Owlkin Frenzy would be 96%.

This could be a pretty sizeable dps boost. There would be some dps loss from pushback during the time that Owlkin Frenzy is down, but I think the 10% buff and the instant casts helping us cycle eclipse quicker and maintain a higher NG uptime would more than compensate for it.

Could be kind of cool if Blizzard designs a few fight mechanics to make this a desirable thing to do.

[huth]

• Glyph of Travel will be fun. I bet that it will increase Travel Form's speed up to that of a normal ground mount.

Turns out you're wrong. It increases it to an epic ground mount(i.e. 100%)

Moonwarding seems to be useful when you get hit almost exclusively by armor-ignoring damage. Not so great for solo or PvP, though, at a measly 10%.

All the changes seem to be aimed at making Moonkins extremely tough against physical attack(er)s.

[Deleted]

Conclusion?
NOT a single druid will ever choose a talent other than EQUINOX:
- 100% uptime eclipse benefit the new Hurricane because you can't be moved by it outside eclipse nerfing your own damage
- SuF/MF passive damage increase doesn't benefit the talent Insect Swarm
- Incarnation 100% uptime with the talent
- Choosing another talent means that while not in eclipse 2 Starsurge (50 energy each) brings you into eclipse giving you no time to cast Insect Swarm, or wasting SS procs to cast it.

Just a notification. I don't see Equinox amongst the newly datamined information. Might be that they changed their mind on that one. Also, be aware that the game isn't even out yet. Things are subject to change, and I predict they'll change their mind on Equinox because it kind of nullifies the idea of our gameplay.

[Gothmog]

At cutting edge raiding, when not overgearing encounters, +10% maximum health is amazing. It's not quite as good as the old +15% damage reduction + HotW, but it's still a noticable leeway.
I don't see myself trading +10% max hp for +100% armor on nearly any encounter.

Also, I don't see us "tanking" adds in any halfway normal raid encounter for damage increase. Various untargeted damage will slowly whittle them down, not in the least our our Star(sun)fall. Possibility of a daze and consistent damage taken.. unlikely. And if it does start happening with frequency, you can be sure blizz will nerf it until it's not worth doing anymore.

Glyph of Celestial Alignment sounds weird to me. I can't think of a scenario where I'd want to use it. If anything, it smells of the typical oversight by blizzard in a sense that we're not interested in just Eclipse, NG has a darn significant impact.