6.0 Warrior changes discussion thread

[Murlocbait]

If you refresh Rend before the last tick occurs, the burst will occur when it would have normally happened while still doing the normal ticks.

I thought that's only if you do it within 5 seconds of it ending. So you don't have to let it drop off, but you have to use it again when Rend has <5sec remaining.

[Taeyon]

I still love the fact they added rend back solely for manual application and refreshing and removed Blood and Thunder which was made precisely because multi-rending is fucking aids.

[Trubo]

I thought that's only if you do it within 5 seconds of it ending. So you don't have to let it drop off, but you have to use it again when Rend has <5sec remaining.

Couldn't remember the specific number of seconds, just that refreshing before the last tick works similarly to how DoT clipping worked before the patch.

[Khorm]

I still love the fact they added rend back solely for manual application and refreshing and removed Blood and Thunder which was made precisely because multi-rending is fucking aids.

I also found it funny when people whined about losing rend and no one set them straight and now that it is back all you hear is whine.

[Kapadons]

Frustrated as I knew I would be with this patch.

Arms just feels horrible. Too much has changed for the worse:

CS-interaction is boring. Rend final burst feels bad (because it HAS to drop off). MS costing rage AND having a CD is stupid. WW as a ST filler doesn't fit the kit and feels jerky. It's just a horrible spec to play. The designers on WoW at the moment are HORRIFIC!

I just don't get how you can go from CS-reset gameplay, blood and thunder, Slam+SS and Heroic Strike decisions to the utter shite we have now and NOT SEE THAT IT'S A BAD IDEA.

WoD Arms is worse than MoP Arms IN EVERY WAY apart from the fact Sweeping Strikes now has a half-decent range (but still only hits for 25% when we Whirlwind despite it being an ST filler in WoD!)

The glyphs are stupid, too. Glyph of Die by the Sword: Just add 4-sec to the duration instead of over-complicating things, surely? Instead we have Wild Strike adding .25sec to the duration. What a pile of crap. Such petty, bothersome design. zzzzzz Glyph of Raging Blow. BOTH RB hits crit and you get +200% BT healing? WTF? NO-ONE who needs that healing (levelling warriors) are going to have the crit to get that lucky. What a stupid, stupid glyph from a stupid designer. Get a grip, lads. Think! Why not have +healing if neither crit (the fight will last longer, they'll take more damage, they'll NEED the healing!)

My main two characters were an Arms Warrior and a Holy Paladin and they've BOTH been ruined by the current Dev team. So frustrating.

The only saving grace seems to be Gladiator Spec which (although I can't try it) looks kind of engaging and fun.... even if it struggles with AoE.

I know Fury is okay... and if they up the SD proc rate to 20% or 15% then it might be better (but feels rare and distracting at the mo). But Arms is horrible. There's so much they could do with the spec to improve it... and unfortunately one of those things is to revert it back to 5.4.8. Such a bad design team. Really don't like any of their work.

Oh well... I guess people will vote with their wallets... perhaps there are enough Ret Paladins playing who like the patch/direction and will carry on playing.

I'm not playing while they leave Arms like this. Gameplay is crap, synergy is crap, procs are non-existent, AoE is boring, Rage is unreliable. Celestalon, Watcher and the team have messed up. Hope they realise it soon.

I can't really argue with anything you said.

I tested arms on a dummy for like 2 hours yesterday and at certain points it feels nearly impossible to bleed off rage. Spamming whirlwind 8 times in a row and still have rage to MS. And CS is fucking pointless now. CS> MS >Whirlwind. What's even the point to CS debuff when you can't really do shit with it.

Arms was decent in 5.4.8 but in 6.0 it's a mindless retard spec with too much downtime and no depth or interaction.

[cFortyfive]

I also found it funny when people whined about losing rend and no one set them straight and now that it is back all you hear is whine.

It's funny because cata rend is exactly like wod rend.

[Ferg]

I wonder what they're going to change about Arms, because it's obvious that they're going to have to do something.

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It's funny because cata rend is exactly like wod rend.

Not really, in Cataclysm MS refreshed your Rend so you didn't need to manually re-apply it.

[Secondwind]

Not really, in Cataclysm MS refreshed your Rend so you didn't need to manually re-apply it.

Not to mention Rend procced OP, and could be spread via Thunderclap. Note that at least a good chunk of the people complaining about rend complain because it is literally a button you hit every 18 seconds that has no interaction with anything. We are clearly being limited to a small number of buttons we are allowed to have for a core rotation, and Rend is eating into that space without providing anything really meaningful or interesting to the rotation to earn that place. If Rend interacted with something else (and especially if Rend was spread by TC again), it would go a long way towards placating people.

[Archimtiros]

I thought that's only if you do it within 5 seconds of it ending. So you don't have to let it drop off, but you have to use it again when Rend has <5sec remaining.

This is exactly how it works. If you refresh with <5s remaining the next ticks duration is added to the new debuff and it will still "explode" as intended. Exactly how mage bombs work. Funny, I'm pretty sure someone wrote a guide about this stickied at the top of the forums...

- - - Updated - - -

Looks like it. Also you have to consider that a FS build requires 100% uptime to do full dps, a SD on the other hand has empty GCDs and thus doesnt lose as much dps on movement/target switching etc...

So in the end I would always prefer a SD build when they are close, even more since its more fun to play.

That statement isn't exactly true. We still get a significant portion of our damage from auto attacks and just because SD has some more free GCDs doesn't mean that the class is effective with downtime. The free GCDs are situational and downtime hurts us because it either interrupts our resource spending between BT's or causes us to push back BTs. I don't think one loses any more or less than the other due to movement and neither lose any more than the other over target switching.

[cFortyfive]

Not really, in Cataclysm MS refreshed your Rend so you didn't need to manually re-apply it.

I knew I should have added a jk or something.

[Strafir]

The new super nerfs were definitely deployed during the 5AM EU maintenance. Killing garrosh over and over again just got that much slower :-(

So how are we feeling about the whole Sudden Death vs Furious Strikes debate now?

[Boyiee]

So a friend is telling me that the tuning and nerfing they are doing to us now is for level 100, not for level 90, but I just don't see that. Level 100 tuning looks like crap, its all out of whack, monks on top, mages and warriors midgrade. I feel like they haven't touched level 100 because of how bad 90 is right now, being able to zerg all of mythic SOO for example.

Some people have been saying warriors are 20% ahead on several encounters but I haven't seen that, anyone got logs?

[Strafir]

So a friend is telling me that the tuning and nerfing they are doing to us now is for level 100, not for level 90, but I just don't see that. Level 100 tuning looks like crap, its all out of whack, monks on top, mages and warriors midgrade. I feel like they haven't touched level 100 because of how bad 90 is right now, being able to zerg all of mythic SOO for example.

Some people have been saying warriors are 20% ahead on several encounters but I haven't seen that, anyone got logs?

Honestly, just don't worry about it. One day at a time.

[Kirbynator]

The balancing/class gameplay team has no idea what they're doing, at this point we wait and hope they blindfoldedly land the donkey's tail on its ass.

[Boyiee]

Honestly, just don't worry about it. One day at a time.

I'm not worried about anything, I just don't see how these recent nerfs have to do with level 100 and I wanted to see those logs that people are referring to about warriors doing 20% of the damage.

[Deleted]

New Sim-C gives me 300 dps more with FS vs. SD

[Ryxxi]

You are.



As everyone else pointed out, the hotfixes are clearly not the full picture intended for level 100 tuning. I didn't post them specifically for that reason.

I am pretty confident that these balance changes are going to stay for a while (even after we hit lv 100), am saying this because Blizzard nerfed Demonbolt 's damage, which isn't even available till lv 100.

[Deleted]

Is Execute still not worth using as Glad btw? My tooltip on beta is showing 30k damage on Execute and 5k on Heroic Strike. Heroic Strike is not on GCD which allows usage of other abilities and(refreshing CD of Shield Slam via Devastate. So is it worth spamming Devastate and hope for Shield Slam procs and continue to dump rage on Heroic Strike and during Execute?

Heroic Strike deals increased damage during Shield Charge, which increases Heroic Strike's damage by 25% but still, way less damage when compared to Execute.

[Trubo]

Is Execute still not worth using as Glad btw? My tooltip on beta is showing 30k damage on Execute and 5k on Heroic Strike. Heroic Strike is not on GCD which allows usage of other abilities and(refreshing CD of Shield Slam via Devastate. So is it worth spamming Devastate and hope for Shield Slam procs and continue to dump rage on Heroic Strike and during Execute?

Heroic Strike deals increased damage during Shield Charge, which increases Heroic Strike's damage by 25% but still, way less damage when compared to Execute.

It's worth using to bleed Rage when not during a Shield Charge. Otherwise you don't use it unless you specced Sudden Death, in which case why did you spec Sudden Death?

[Deleted]

It's worth using to bleed Rage when not during a Shield Charge. Otherwise you don't use it unless you specced Sudden Death, in which case why did you spec Sudden Death?

I did not spec it, just curious.