Putin puts troops in western Russia on alert in drill 1.1

[Deleted]

Hey, Hillary confirmed it too. It is not deflection its reality. You talked bs when your own nation's money went to that terrorist group you just tried to say it should be funded by Russia.

Just that Iam not american -,-

[Kellhound]

Because their ship yards, all of them, ARE IN CAPACITY, for Gods sake..

In fact, the military is taking over civilian yards for their needs, since they don't have enough to produce fast enough.

That are "at capacity" because they are taking FOREVER to build simple ships. They are just small ships, even by Russian standards, 4500 tons max is the largest they are building. Put it this way, it took the US just over two years from keel being laid to commissioning on the last Burke class DDG (9200 tons), in contrast the Admiral Gorskov (4500 tons) was laid down in 2006 and it is hoped he will be commissioned by the end of this year. And before you say "lead ships always have issues", the Burke herself was built in 2 1/2 years (keel to commissioning).

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If China is to clash with the US, they should be arming them non stop. Good for economy (weapon sales) and good for geopolitics

Infact since US is so eager to sanction Russia, Russia owns it to their citizens to sell weapons to w/e country they want to buy them, including N. Korea, Iran etc.

I am not sure why they are not arming them already. They need to offset the sanctions somehow.

Perhaps you do not understand, but China does not actually buy much anymore, they get a few and then reverse engineer them and build them without Russia's permission. Selling to China harms Russia's arms industry long term, they understand this. That is why Russia refused to sell the naval version of the Flanker to China.

[Deleted]

The right thing?

Deflection, trolling and derailing is the only reason this thread got to 2000+ pages.
"I think Russia did the right thing." vs "I think they something wrong." would have killed it quite quickly.

If Russia would stop doing it the thread would be dead too.

Remember it started with Russia put troops on ukrainian border then it invaded.

[Ulmita]

If Russia would stop doing it the thread would be dead too.

Remember it started with Russia put troops on ukrainian border then it invaded.

No matter how hard you try to alter history, you cant so i suggest you stop trying.

Remember it started with legally elected Ukrainian government getting couped overnight. Thats how it started.

[Marcellus1986]

No matter how hard you try to alter history, you cant so i suggest you stop trying.

Remember it started with legally elected Ukrainian government getting couped overnight. Thats how it started.

No the current conflict started because Putin wanted to Czechoslovakia the Crimean Peninsula from Ukraine, under the guise of "protecting ethnic Russians".

[Ulmita]

No the current conflict started because Putin wanted to Czechoslovakia the Crimean Peninsula from Ukraine, under the guise of "protecting ethnic Russians".

No the current conflict started because eastern Ukrainians didn't recognized the after-coup government and thus why the whole ordeal started.

[Kellhound]

No the current conflict started because eastern Ukrainians didn't recognized the after-coup government and thus why the whole ordeal started.

It started because the Ukrainian government was more concerned about kissing Russia's bum than doing what the Ukrainian people wanted.

[Megraam]

No the current conflict started because Putin wanted to Czechoslovakia the Crimean Peninsula from Ukraine, under the guise of "protecting ethnic Russians".

I enjoy the fact you handwave entire armed coup called maidan thing.

[Ausr]

I enjoy the fact you handwave entire armed coup called maidan thing.

Because of that one statement, you can totally tell he handwaved (you use this word a lot, I don't think it means what you think it means) the Maiden thing.

[Deleted]

It started because the Ukrainian government was more concerned about kissing Russia's bum than doing what the Ukrainian people wanted.

It started because Ukraine had no nukes.

[Megraam]

Because of that one statement, you can totally tell he handwaved (you use this word a lot, I don't think it means what you think it means) the Maiden thing.

The more you maidanites handwave the facts, the more you make me use this word.


On the other news, according to the next NATO military commitee head, Russia would be able to occupy the Baltic countries in two days and Kyiv in two days as well.
http://www.praguepost.com/eu-news/48...-take-two-days

Keep it constructive & civil

[Kellhound]

The more you maidanites handwave the facts, the more you make me use this word.


On the other news, according to the next NATO military commitee head, Russia would be able to occupy the Baltic countries in two days and Kyiv in two days as well.
http://www.praguepost.com/eu-news/48...-take-two-days

Actually, he only discussed the Baltics, it was an ambassador that mentioned Kiev, and pointed out that it is questionable if Russia has the logistics to hold it.
The issue with the Baltics also requires zero heads up that Russia was going to act. Even 2 days allows the NATO Rapid Reaction Force to be deployed, as well as at least one brigade of the US 82nd Airborne and sizable air assets. At that point the cost to Russia would be too high.

[Megraam]

Actually, he only discussed the Baltics, it was an ambassador that mentioned Kiev, and pointed out that it is questionable if Russia has the logistics to hold it.
The issue with the Baltics also requires zero heads up that Russia was going to act. Even 2 days allows the NATO Rapid Reaction Force to be deployed, as well as at least one brigade of the US 82nd Airborne and sizable air assets. At that point the cost to Russia would be too high.

This was posted as hilarious example of russophobia most of you share. Russia obviously doesn't have any intent to occupy anything, neither Baltics nor ukraine.

[Kellhound]

This was posted as hilarious example of russophobia most of you share. Russia obviously doesn't have any intent to occupy anything, neither Baltics nor ukraine.

Given Russia's history with "supporting" ethnic Russian's abroad, the Baltics have good reason to fear Russia.

[Deleted]

This was posted as hilarious example of russophobia most of you share. Russia obviously doesn't have any intent to occupy anything, neither Baltics nor ukraine.

No it just randomly happens, right?

[Megraam]

No it just randomly happens, right?

What "it"? Western-backed armed coups to oust current democratically elected government which born the reason for oppressed regions to separate from the new guys who seized the power? Well, you tell me.

[Haven]

Still not buying your 'US puppet President' story tale, but I'm not surprised that the US get's blamed, you also completely forget that Europe is far more interested in keeping Russia away from dreams of expansion, rather than getting yet another country on the welfare list, but it is quite entertainig, from a 1st world country pov, to watch you Russians point out Ukraine as a country is crisis, atleast they have a pretty solid reason with the foreign invasion and all, whats your excuse? "murica did it!11" ?

And Europe in Crisis lives waaaay better than Russians, or are invaded countries your new benchmark for how well you're doing?

Still not buying your "Russian army all over Ukraine" story, mate. Proof or bust.

noone ever said or expected Ukraine to be in a great condition at this point, I'm not quite sure what made you think that reforming and rebuilding a country takes a year, but their future is alot more bright under western guidance.

No one? You should've payed attention to what Poroshenko has been saying for the last year And yeah, "bright future under Western guidance" lol, like former Yugoslavia? Albania? Iraq? This "bright future" is whiskey deals. Maybe Greece? Italy? UK, that is seriously considering seceding from EU in 2017? West can't even guide itself.

Not sure why you made a shift from blaming NATO for bombing small countries, to Iraq etc. I doubt you realise the small amount of actual wars NATO have been involved in, I personally think that finding Bin Laden was worth it, and I hope your country would do the same if he had killed 3000 people in Moscow, or do you think Putin would have let that one slide? He's alot weaker than I thought if he did not act on a 9/11 in Moscow.

And I'm not going to defend the Iraq war at all, you're seeing it in black and white, either you agree with everything the US/Russia does or you disagree with all of it, I think the Afghanistan war was justified, Iraq was not.

Russia doesn't need to invade small countries on another side of planet, that's why such things don't happen in Russia. There' is a simple truth about wars: they're never fought because of "revenge" or "God" or populistic bullshit like that. Wars require money to prepare, wars result in redistribution of material wealth that leads to money. It's been true since before even Crusades, when knights went to fight for God's Coffin (while also diminishing Caliphate's control over Mediterranian trade routes that led to quick enrichment of Western monarchs).

[Deleted]

Still not buying your "Russian army all over Ukraine" story, mate. Proof or bust.

I don't know mate, you seem to have no problem believing in US foreign intervention into Ukraine without any proof either.
Perhaps it has more to do with your incapability to view Russia's actions in a negative light.

And yeah, "bright future under Western guidance" lol,

Brighter than a future under russian boots. Living standards and PPP have gone up through most of Central and Eastern Europe since the Soviet Union fell.

Maybe Greece? Italy? UK, that is seriously considering seceding from EU in 2017? West can't even guide itself.

Puling facts out of our asses again I see... out of those three countries only the UK will hold a referendum on continued EU membership, which can go both ways. The Italians don't want to leave the EU, as for the Greeks, it is highly unlikely that they will leave the eurozone (single currency union), leaving the EU is not on their agenda.
And don't you worry your little head over the West's ability to govern itself, considering everyone wants to emigrate here or become like us.
We must be doing something right, unlike Russia who's getting brain drained with each passing year.

Russia doesn't need to invade small countries on another side of planet,

Of course it doesn't need to. Russia invades countries much closer to itself.

[Haven]

I don't know mate, you seem to have no problem believing in US foreign intervention into Ukraine without any proof either.
Perhaps it has more to do with your incapability to view Russia's actions in a negative light.

No one made a secret out of Nuland, Biden and Brennan in Ukraine during Maidan. It was on TV, it was in the Internet, it was made obvious. Meanwhile, thousands of Russian troops miraculously avoid detection by cameras and satellites - only the trained eye of maidanites, Stoltenberg and Kerry can see them. Not even mentioning how they escape being captured and delivered to Hague. Or how American senators have been caught posting fakes at least twice.

Brighter than a future under russian boots. Living standards and PPP have gone up through most of Central and Eastern Europe since the Soviet Union fell.

No shit, those went up in the whole world during the last three decades, it's called "technological progress". Well, counting out the regions that were bombed by America. At least under Russian boots Ukrainians could afford to pay rent AND buy food That explains why millions of Ukrainians have fled to Russia, of all countries. Must be a wondrous boot to be under, lol

Puling facts out of our asses again I see... out of those three countries only the UK will hold a referendum on continued EU membership, which can go both ways. The Italians don't want to leave the EU, as for the Greeks, it is highly unlikely that they will leave the eurozone (single currency union), leaving the EU is not on their agenda.

I wasn't talking about them leaving, I was referring to their financial problems under EU's guidance.

And don't you worry your little head over the West's ability to govern itself, considering everyone wants to emigrate here or become like us.
We must be doing something right, unlike Russia who's getting brain drained with each passing year.

"Brain drain" has long since become an obsolete stereotype. It's 2015, not 1995. And of course people from colonies want to live like masters, that's why there's so much Arabs and Africans in statistically Muslim France. It's safer to live closer to where the bombs come from rather than where they are meant to drop.

Of course it doesn't need to. Russia invades countries much closer to itself.

Proof or bust, lol It's so simple, finding several thousand troops and tank batallions, yet no one can do this. It's a miracle of God!

[GennGreymane]

Exclusive: Russia masses heavy firepower on border with Ukraine - witness
http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/...edName=topNews

Russia's army is massing troops and hundreds of pieces of weaponry including mobile rocket launchers, tanks and artillery at a makeshift base near the border with Ukraine, a Reuters reporter saw this week.

Many of the vehicles have number plates and identifying marks removed while many of the servicemen had taken insignia off their fatigues. As such, they match the appearance of some of the forces spotted in eastern Ukraine, which Kiev and its Western allies allege are covert Russian detachments.

The scene at the base on the Kuzminsky firing range, around 50 km (30 miles) from the border, offers some of the clearest evidence to date of what appeared to be a concerted Russian military build-up in the area.

Earlier this month, NATO military commander General Philip Breedlove said he believed the separatists were taking advantage of a ceasefire that came into force in February to re-arm and prepare for a new offensive. However, he gave no specifics.

Russia denies that its military is involved in the conflict in Ukraine's east, where Moscow-backed separatists have been fighting forces loyal to the pro-Western government in Kiev.

Russia's defense ministry said it had no immediate comment about the build-up. Several soldiers said they had been sent to the base for simple military exercises, suggesting their presence was unconnected to the situation in Ukraine.

Asked by Reuters if large numbers of unmarked weaponry and troops without insignia at the border indicated that Russia planned to invade Ukraine, Kremlin spokesman Dmitry Peskov said during a conference call with reporters:

"I find the wording of this question, 'if an invasion is being prepared', inappropriate as such."

The weapons being delivered there included Uragan multiple rocket launchers, tanks and self-propelled howitzers -- all weapon types that have been used in the conflict in eastern Ukraine between Kiev's forces and separatists.

The amount of military hardware at the base was about three times greater than in March this year, when Reuters journalists were previously in the area. At that time, only a few dozen pieces of equipment were in view.

Over the course of fours days starting on Saturday, Reuters saw four goods trains with military vehicles and troops arriving at a rail station in the Rostov region of southern Russia, with at least two trainloads traveling on by road to the base.

A large section of dirt road leading across the steppe from the Kuzminsky range to the Ukrainian border had been freshly repaired, making it more passable for heavy vehicles.

The road leads to a quiet border crossing typically only used by local residents. On the other side is Ukraine's Luhansk region, which is controlled by separatists and has been the scene of intense fighting.

MARCHING ORDERS

Valentina Melnikova, a human rights campaigner who works closely with families of Russian servicemen, said she had information that Rostov region was being used as a staging post for troops on their way to Ukraine.

She said the information came from the mother of a serviceman stationed in the town of Totskoye, in the Orenburg region near Russia's border with Kazakhstan.

Melnikova said the serviceman heard from commanders that "they are going to be transferred to Rostov region after May 20 and then to Ukraine. They signed papers about non-disclosure of information and about acting voluntarily.

"Of course it was an order. How could it be voluntarily? They are servicemen," said Melnikova, who runs the Moscow-based Alliance of Soldiers' Mothers Committees.

Her account could not be independently verified by Reuters.

In some cases where Russian citizens have been captured in Ukraine by forces loyal to Kiev, Russian officials have said they were there of their own accord and were either on leave from the armed forces or had quit the military.

More military hardware trundles into the Matveev Kurgan railway station on goods trains every day.

A train that pulled in on Tuesday was carrying 16 T-72 tanks, and a number of military trucks.

A local woman who was at the station with a pre-school age girl looked at the tanks on flat-bed rail cars, sighed, and said: "Nothing surprises me any more."

Over the four days, trains arrived delivering a total of at least 26 tanks, about 30 Uragan launchers, dozens of trucks as well as several armored personnel carriers and self-propelled howitzers.

On two occasions, after the trains had been unloaded, reporters followed the column of vehicles to the firing range -- a location that has already been linked indirectly to the fighting in Ukraine.

Bellingcat, a British-based group of volunteers who use social media to investigate conflicts, analyzed postings by Russian soldiers on social network accounts, including geo-location tags on photos, and concluded that some of those in Ukraine had earlier been at the Kuzminsky range.

A former Russian soldier said last year, when he was on active military service, that he underwent training at the range and was later sent up to the Ukrainian border. Once at the border he was ordered to fire Grad rockets, although he said he could not be certain they were fired into Ukraine. He also said some members of his unit had crossed into Ukraine.

"That's a very big firing range. We studied for two weeks, we had a quick course. After that we got the order and went to the border," said the former soldier, who did not want to be identified because the operation has not been made public.