Is there less pressure to address content droughts because of the ingame store?

[Rekx]

Im gona stop you right there... This "content drought" has happened at the end of every expansion. And the bliz store wasnt around during all of that.

The lack of content sucks and is why i un-subbed for a while. But this is nothing new, and the store isnt to blame.

However, i feel those who spend money on mounts and pets etc are stupid.. But thats not relevant.

[Gwiez]

Don't tell me they used the money from my 50% off minipet to buy a foosball table, and now they spend all their time playing in foosball tournaments!

[TS26]

Blizzard hired new people over the course of MoP, so we probably won't see the benefit of this until Warlords. I do think that SoO will be the last content drought we'll get.

yeah im not gonna fall for that again. I will believe it when it actually happens.

[HeedmySpeed]

"Here you go guys, 100 recolored variations of the same Sky Serpent mount which not many of you give a shit about thus being an unattractive incentive for in game accomplishments and-ZOMG! DO YOU SEE THIS AWESOME CHIMERA MOUNT WE JUST PUT IN THE STOREZ!"

[Disconnected]

All the open plotpoints.

Like? Again, I'm genuinely curious because I thought I listed all of the major aspects of MOP's plot and they've all been closed.

The vast majority of losses being in the east is an assumption on your part that you have no way of backing up. Online subscriptions was reported as $912million last year contrasted to $1357million in 2011, $1230million in 2010, $1233 in 2009. The fact it has more subscribers than other games is completely irrelevant to my post that you quoted. When MOP launched in Q3' 12 it managed to attract 31% of the customers lost throughout Cata to return and by the end Q4 '12 losses were equal to 44% of the total of returning players by Q1 '13 not only had the subscriber gains been wiped out a further 800k were gone. It is likely that WOD will,also, not be able to make up for the losses in MOP and there is a chance that it will also not be able to hold onto any gains made.

Uhm...from Blizzard's own mouth:

As of June 30, 2014, Blizzard Entertainment’s World of Warcraft remains the #1 subscription-based MMORPG, with approximately 6.8 million subscribers.⁴ There was a decline in subscribers quarter over quarter, which was disproportionately concentrated in the East and was similar to the seasonal decline experienced during the second quarter of 2012, prior to the launch of the most recent expansion later that year.

You were saying?

To address the second half of your post: I never said that WOD was going to make up for all of the people that quit during MOP, just that we'd see an increase in subscribers, as usual. How many subscribers that's going to be is anyone's guess. However, the main point that I was making and that you seem to have disagreed with to this point is that World of Warcraft is far from dying. The amount of subscribers it currently has being more than the amount of other MMOs is relevant because those MMOs are surviving and making a profit with far fewer subscribers. So, it'd be foolish to think that an MMO with far more subscribers than other MMOs that are still doing fine is "dying." But hey, you're free to believe whatever you like.

You can't be so sure because it looks like you don't anything about it.

I can't be sure that your analysis of a limited amount of data is going to be only partially accurate? Really? I can definitely be 100% sure of that and for someone with your background (supposedly) to say that your analysis will be 100% accurate, or anything close to that, without knowing all of the information is just, well, stupid. But please, feel free to prove me wrong and show me, with supporting evidence, how the cash shop delayed WOD. I'll wait.

[Deleted]

Im gona stop you right there... This "content drought" has happened at the end of every expansion. And the bliz store wasnt around during all of that.

The lack of content sucks and is why i un-subbed for a while. But this is nothing new, and the store isnt to blame.

However, i feel those who spend money on mounts and pets etc are stupid.. But thats not relevant.

It has never been this long and it got longer and longer over time.

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So you're saying, that if they allocated the resources required to create less than a dozen new models (that most of the time share a skeleton with something else anyways) we would have more playable content? Genius, we need to tell someone at Blizzard right away, they could release the expansion tomorrow.

No I wasn't saying that.

[MoanaLisa]

The premise of the post is about as wrong as it's possible to be. Blizzard's revenues include sales from Hearthstone and Diablo III and all of their other games. It's not all about WoW and I'd love it if posters here would get informed and stop making posts like this that seem to believe that the only thing that Blizzard gets any money from is World of Warcraft. From all accounts Hearthstone has been extremely successful and of course there was an expansion that released right at the end of March and one would presume that all sales of that from April-June would be part of that too.

The next presumption is that the store is wildly successful and that Blizzard should just stop doing that so they'll feel more pressure to bring out content. Or something. I have no idea if the store is successful or not. I guess it is. But people that design store items are not the developers who are responsible for pulling together an entire expansion.

Anyway, yes. End of content issues that last this long and happen every expansion are bad planning on Blizzard's part and something they need to think about.

[Pann]

Uhm...from Blizzard's own mouth:


You were saying?

One quarter out of thirteen. There are another two or three, from memory, where they say exactly the same but that still does not prove your assumption that the vast majority of losses are from the east.

To address the second half of your post: I never said that WOD was going to make up for all of the people that quit during MOP, just that we'd see an increase in subscribers, as usual. How many subscribers that's going to be is anyone's guess. However, the main point that I was making and that you seem to have disagreed with to this point is that World of Warcraft is far from dying. The amount of subscribers it currently has being more than the amount of other MMOs is relevant because those MMOs are surviving and making a profit with far fewer subscribers. So, it'd be foolish to think that an MMO with far more subscribers than other MMOs that are still doing fine is "dying." But hey, you're free to believe whatever you like.

In the past four years WOW has lost almost half of its customers and its revenue is a third down from its peak not only that Blizzard have shown over the last four years they have absolutely no idea how to deal with this. I have shown you factual and empirical evidence that WOW is terminal decline whether you like it or not the only way is down from here. WOW is dying no matter how much you try to deny it it is only question of how much if any of it Blizzard are capable of saving.

[MoanaLisa]

I mean, there's the 6.0 expansion transition content. But outside of that there's nothing that can be put in without making it feel contrived.

If Blizzard had planned to do something to carry over a few new things during the time after the last raid I can think of things they could have done: some easy-to-make (by their own admission) scenarios tying up various loose ends and side stories from MoP or going into more detail about some lore that would bridge the time from the last raid to Garrosh's trial and the rest. Half a dozen of something like that, trivial as they may be and even disliked by a lot of people who think they've dropped the ball creatively on scenarios (that would be me), released one every two or three weeks starting a few months after the raid was out would be better than nothing at all. It's not a matter of not making sense, it's a matter of planning ahead for it. Which apparently they've never done. They should really think about that.

[Pann]

The premise of the post is about as wrong as it's possible to be. Blizzard's revenues include sales from Hearthstone and Diablo III and all of their other games. It's not all about WoW and I'd love it if posters here would get informed and stop making posts like this that seem to believe that the only thing that Blizzard gets any money from is World of Warcraft. From all accounts Hearthstone has been extremely successful and of course there was an expansion that released right at the end of March and one would presume that all sales of that from April-June would be part of that too.

The next presumption is that the store is wildly successful and that Blizzard should just stop doing that so they'll feel more pressure to bring out content. Or something. I have no idea if the store is successful or not. I guess it is. But people that design store items are not the developers who are responsible for pulling together an entire expansion.

Anyway, yes. End of content issues that last this long and happen every expansion are bad planning on Blizzard's part and something they need to think about.

The OP has admitted that his assumption is based on Blizzard's statement that WOW revenue is up year-over-year which is still reported on the front page of MMO-C is 100% correct which it is not. Perhaps before labelling the premise of the post "about as wrong as it's possible to be" as a moderator and staff of MMO-C you should check the validity of what is posted on the front page? Also if you had bothered to check the information the OP was referencing you would see that Blizzard clearly state it is WOW revenue not Diablo, Hearthstone or the combination of them plus any other franchise that is up.

[Deleted]

Like? Again, I'm genuinely curious because I thought I listed all of the major aspects of MOP's plot and they've all been closed.

I've never said MoP, but at the end of Siege of Orgrimmar Varian talks about the situation in Gilneas and what they should do about Sylvanas. One thing to do would be to follow up on that, show how the Alliance deals with her, give Sylvanas a bit of screentime, she didn't have that much recently. One thing people were wondering about was Ashenvale. They could've done something with Ashenvale and Gilneas to show that the Alliance is strong right now after the Siege and the Horde is trying to get it together. They are changing Orgrimmar to reflect the changes so they could've given us some quests there, maybe to deal with the remnants of Garrosh's supporters. They could've addressed some of the things in War Crimes, give us a more interesting lead in to the next expansion. We're gonna have a launch event, but it's likely going to be something small. They could've given us a filler patch where the Iron Horde already comes through the portal half a year before the release of the expansion and turn Blasted Lands into a phased max level zone like max level Barrens in 5.3 Could even have a filler raid with some Iron Horde bosses in a raid environment. Let them completely conquer Blasted Lands, then we launch the attack from the Swamps of Sorrow. That would then give us a reason to go after them through the portal and lead into Warlords of Draenor.

And there are tons of open plotpoints especially from Cataclysm that they could have done something with. Even if it's not related to MoP or WoD at all, it would be nice to go back to some places and resolve some things. Too much to mention all of the open plotpoints, or maybe call it "things that could see some development", but just a few that pop into my head:

- Gnomeregan
- Stromgarde
- Lilian Voss
- Darius and Lorna Crowley
- Koltira
- Argent Crusade and the Cenarion Circle vs. the Forsaken in the Plaguelands
- revamping old dungeons that are still the same as in Vanilla, as they seem to gradually do that every expansion
- give Silvermoon an overhaul and make it flyable (this isn't new content, but dammit just do it)
- Neptulon
- Kel'thuzad
- Maiev
- Illidan returning
- Alleria and Turalyon

I know some of these are lore characters they might have plans with for later, but would it hurt to give players a couple of quests, or a scenario, let's say, where Alliance players try to find out what Maiev is doing, or maybe hunt a figure somewhere in Felwood or Ashenvale that looks awfully similar to a demon, only for them to get away and give us an idea that maybe in the near future they want to do something with these characters?

There are actually some open plotpoints from MoP that could see some development. Dalaran is now part of the Alliance and they said it was "going somewhere". People speculated it could land somewhere like in the Theramore crater, that would bring things full circle quite nicely. Nothing happened so far. We also gathered some weapons on the Isle of Thunder, Jaina charged her staff and the Blood Elves got one of the golems if I remember correctly, never done anything with them, expected them to, but nothing happened. What's the situation in Ironforge, are the clans really united now? What are Moira's real intentions, is she planning something or will everything be harmony now? What about Ji and Aysa? What happens to the Mantid now that all the Paragons are gone and their queen is dead? What's the situation with the Forsaken now that the Kor'kron joined Garrosh and are defeated, will they retreat from the Undercity? Will the Forsaken plot something then, if they are rid of their watchmen? What is up with what Ra-den said, about the yawning chasm of darkness? What did Kairoz do to Soridormi and why? Was Lorewalker Cho an Infinite dragon that tried to kill us by sending us into dangerous situations? Point is, there is stuff that we didn't get an answer to.

The reason they are not giving us new content til the next expansion is not that there is no content they could give us that would make sense, it's simply a matter of resources.

[Disconnected]

One quarter out of thirteen. There are another two or three, from memory, where they say exactly the same but that still does not prove your assumption that the vast majority of losses are from the east.

I was specifically addressing this quarter so not really sure why you're bringing up the past 3 years. Either way, it's expected for a 10 year old game to lose subscribers over time. Hell, both Rift and SWTOR saw almost a 50% decrease in subscribers in the first year! In the case of World of Warcraft, it has been losing subscribers at an average rate of 200k-250k per quarter, with its largest decreases during quarters when a large portion of the lost subscribers was from the East.

In the past four years WOW has lost almost half of its customers and its revenue is a third down from its peak not only that Blizzard have shown over the last four years they have absolutely no idea how to deal with this. I have shown you factual and empirical evidence that WOW is terminal decline whether you like it or not the only way is down from here. WOW is dying no matter how much you try to deny it it is only question of how much if any of it Blizzard are capable of saving.

See above. World of Warcraft is a 10 year old game, it's expected for them to lose subscribers at some point. I'm not denying that World of Warcraft will "die" at some point, but it's far from that point and won't be there any time soon. Even when it gets to that point, it will still be able to survive in the same state as other MMOs with a lower number of subscribers. The only way that World of Warcraft will officially die is when Blizzard pulls the plug themselves. But you know what, you're totally right, Blizzard clearly has no idea what they're doing. They have no idea how to handle any of this. They've only created and run the most successful MMO since Everquest, and even exceeded it to some extent. How could I ever think that Blizzard has any idea what they're doing?

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The reason they are not giving us new content til the next expansion is not that there is no content they could give us that would make sense, it's simply a matter of resources.

Where do you expect those resources to come from? Do you really think the people behind the cash shop mounts would be able to do any of the things you mentioned?

Nobody is saying that Blizzard can't release new content, just that they can't release new content without delaying WOD and that the cash shop isn't responsible for the lack of new content.

[McNeil]

I don't care.
If WoD were to be released last June, people would find issues with that and claim it's because content is rushed to get more $$$.

But yeah, I'm pretty sure developers come to work and play Nerf-games all day long because an intern is making store-mounts and pets.
I fully agree with your analysis because the overwhelming amount of argumentation and evidence was simply mindblowing.

June was actually the most popular date for WoD to release back in the days, and Blizzard would've kept to their word to release expansions faster.

[Deleted]

Where do you expect those resources to come from? Do you really think the people behind the cash shop mounts would be able to do any of the things you mentioned?

Nobody is saying that Blizzard can't release new content, just that they can't release new content without delaying WOD and that the cash shop isn't responsible for the lack of new content.

You asked about open plotpoints. You made it sound as if, even if they had the resources, there would just be nothing they could possibly address in a patch.

All of the Shas have been defeated, Garrosh is imprisoned awaiting trial, the Horde are recouping after SOO, and the Alliance/Horde have a temporary truce for the time being. What new content could you really add without it feeling forced at this point? I'm actually genuinely curious.

You were curious, I told you.

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June was actually the most popular date for WoD to release back in the days, and Blizzard would've kept to their word to release expansions faster.

Actually June would have made the expansion last 1 year and 9 months, the same time as Cataclysm. Some people were arguing April or even earlier. Hell, I remember some people saying they might just release the expansion at Blizzcon 2014.

[Disconnected]

The OP has admitted that his assumption is based on Blizzard's statement that WOW revenue is up year-over-year which is still reported on the front page of MMO-C is 100% correct which it is not. Perhaps before labelling the premise of the post "about as wrong as it's possible to be" as a moderator
and staff of MMO-C you should check the validity of what is posted on the front page? Also if you had bothered to check the information the OP was referencing you would see that Blizzard clearly state it is WOW revenue not Diablo, Hearthstone or the combination of them plus any other franchise that is up.

Seeing as Blizzard has access to much more detailed financial statements than we will ever see, and they themselves were the ones who said that "WOW revenue is up year-over-year," and during their call with shareholders no less, I'm going to believe them over anyone else. So, I don't know why you're saying it's incorrect when you don't have access to the numbers that Blizzard has.

[Veyne]

The content drought that's about par for the course for every other final tier of an expansion?

[Pann]

I was specifically addressing this quarter so not really sure why you're bringing up the past 3 years. Either way, it's expected for a 10 year old game to lose subscribers over time. Hell, both Rift and SWTOR saw almost a 50% decrease in subscribers in the first year! In the case of World of Warcraft, it has been losing subscribers at an average rate of 200k-250k per quarter, with its largest decreases during quarters when a large portion of the lost subscribers was from the East.

Your post implied that the vast majority of losses were from the east and you certainly did not make it clear that you were referring to one quarter. Why is it expected? What have Rift and SWTOR got to do with WOW? But again this is more supposition on your part with no facts to support your claims. Whether or not this is true the fact remains that WOW is now earning a third less than it did at its peak.

See above. World of Warcraft is a 10 year old game, it's expected for them to lose subscribers at some point. I'm not denying that World of Warcraft will "die" at some point, but it's far from that point and won't be there any time soon. Even when it gets to that point, it will still be able to survive in the same state as other MMOs with a lower number of subscribers. The only thing way that World of Warcraft will officially die is when Blizzard pulls the plug themselves. But you know what, you're totally right, Blizzard clearly has no idea what they're doing. They have no idea how to handle any of this. They've only created and run the most successful MMO since Everquest, and even exceeded it to some extent. How could I ever think that Blizzard has any idea what they're doing?

Why is this expected? Why do you think that it will not be any time soon if current trends continue WOD will end with circa 3million players. But I did not say that Blizzard do not know what they are doing I said they have no idea how to deal with the decline in players.

[Disconnected]

You asked about open plotpoints. You made it sound as if, even if they had the resources, there would just be nothing they could possibly address in a patch.

You were curious, I told you.

My apologies if you think I disagree with your last post or was somehow insulting you. I honestly didn't even think about any of those open plots, which is why I asked, but I completely agree that there is plenty of content to be developed. However, the whole point of this thread is that the cash shop is preventing that content from being developed, which couldn't be further from the truth. Just because there's content besides WOD that can be developed doesn't mean that the cash shop is the reason that the other content isn't developed.

[Pann]

Seeing as Blizzard has access to much more detailed financial statements than we will ever see, and they themselves were the ones who said that "WOW revenue is up year-over-year," and during their call with shareholders no less, I'm going to believe them over anyone else. So, I don't know why you're saying it's incorrect when you don't have access to the numbers that Blizzard has.

It is Blizzard's own financial report which shows their claim that revenue is up year on year is not 100% accurate. But yeah Don't Stop Believing.

[Deleted]

My apologies if you think I disagree with your last post or was somehow insulting you. I honestly didn't even think about any of those open plots, which is why I asked, but I completely agree that there is plenty of content to be developed. However, the whole point of this thread is that the cash shop is preventing that content from being developed, which couldn't be further from the truth. Just because there's content besides WOD that can be developed doesn't mean that the cash shop is the reason that the other content isn't developed.

Like I said, I believe that getting so much money from the cashshop really helps out with sub drops. The damage would be much bigger if the cashshop wasn't there and it would pressure them into putting out more content. I don't believe the amount of content they are putting out now is the best they can do.