[GUIDE] Drunken Savagery: Brewmaster Tanking in [6.2]

[Gothmog]

I was just going over my brewmaster today, figuring out how much of damage intake I actually stagger. Happily stumbled across selfsame fresh discussion here.

20% Stance of the Bovine
10% Shuffle
11.2% Mastery from gear (obviously unique to each drunken master)
3.125% from 550 Mastery rating raid buff

Amounts to 44.325% Stagger.

You're at 55% passively..?

That's nearly 2k Mastery rating difference, even if you've better itemization.... I must be missing a source?

- - - Updated - - -

On a separate note, I've been considering which lvl75 talent to run with for Butcher, Dampen Harm or Healing Elixirs.

I went with HE on heroic tonight, 3.46 duration, 441k healed.
Source log
It was the first time I played with it, so it could likely be optimized a bit... but not terribly much, Serenity, purifying a lot kept it at reasonable uptime of 88%. 20% Overheal would most likely be reduced in Mythic

Dampen Harm on the other hand, would halve 3 attacks per 1.5min. Not any more complicated.
On heroic, largest hits were for ~90k.
Assuming precasting it, it would be used 4 times for a total of 540k damage prevented. Extending the fight toward 5 minutes enrage lowers its headstart, but doesn't fall behind HE.


On Mythic, I'm fairly sure the difference would only increase in favour of DH.
Our health would be higher, resulting in higher healing from HE, but respectively to it, damage intake increases drastically more.


Not quite sure where else I'd consider using HE over DH in Highmaul

[keqe]

I was just going over my brewmaster today, figuring out how much of damage intake I actually stagger. Happily stumbled across selfsame fresh discussion here.

20% Stance of the Bovine
10% Shuffle
11.2% Mastery from gear (obviously unique to each drunken master)
3.125% from 550 Mastery rating raid buff

Amounts to 44.325% Stagger.

You're at 55% passively..?

That's nearly 2k Mastery rating difference, even if you've better itemization.... I must be missing a source?

- - - Updated - - -

On a separate note, I've been considering which lvl75 talent to run with for Butcher, Dampen Harm or Healing Elixirs.

I went with HE on heroic tonight, 3.46 duration, 441k healed.
Source log
It was the first time I played with it, so it could likely be optimized a bit... but not terribly much, Serenity, purifying a lot kept it at reasonable uptime of 88%. 20% Overheal would most likely be reduced in Mythic

Dampen Harm on the other hand, would halve 3 attacks per 1.5min. Not any more complicated.
On heroic, largest hits were for ~90k.
Assuming precasting it, it would be used 4 times for a total of 540k damage prevented. Extending the fight toward 5 minutes enrage lowers its headstart, but doesn't fall behind HE.


On Mythic, I'm fairly sure the difference would only increase in favour of DH.
Our health would be higher, resulting in higher healing from HE, but respectively to it, damage intake increases drastically more.


Not quite sure where else I'd consider using HE over DH in Highmaul

We got 10% stagger to the stance in a hotfix some time ago. So we get 30%+10%+5% naked with shuffle up.

[Totaltotemic]

We got 10% stagger to the stance in a hotfix some time ago. So we get 30%+10%+5% naked with shuffle up.

Yes, this. So 55% Stagger is only actually 10% from mastery rating on gear/buffs. That's only 1760 rating, with 550 from raid buff and 100 from food we're only actually talking about 1110 Mastery on gear, which is very achievable without even perfectly itemized gear or sockets.

[Deleted]

are some guys stacking haste for chi exp gamestyle ?

[Leblue]

Haste is still poop pretty much regardless. Now a more mathy person will probably give you exact reasoning why with hard numbers, but keep in mind that we can always fill our extra globals with a damaging ability (Tiger Palm) regardless of how much energy we have so we're never actually waiting to do something. You'll get more for dps by having basically any of the other stats than haste (and also gaining a bigger defensive bonus). I remember it being said that even with ascension haste still doesn't quite catch up to the other stats and that's considering that ascension is worse off than Power Strikes right now.

You probably know, but its worth mentioning that you take ChiEx for extra damage while not being as concerned for your damage intake as well (~")~

[Totaltotemic]

Haste is bad mostly because 1 chi per 35 or 40 energy is an awful rate when you get so much chi baseline from PS/CB and KS. Because there's a drop off in the conversion rate from using KS to using Jab, 1% more energy isn't even close to 1% more chi, whereas 1% more Crit, attack power, 1.66% Multistrike, or even the 0.8% Versatility is much more useful than the pittance of chi extra haste gives.

I know CE is very slow and the first reaction to using it is "if this went faster it would be so much better", but in reality even 50% haste is only another 5 energy/sec, or one Jab every 8 seconds, which is dwarfed by just doing 50% more damage with the CEs you already have.

[Ampere]

Is it intended that we are getting non bonus armor rings etc on bonus rolls and such. I just had a highmaul mission come back with the crit/mas ring from kargath. And while yes those are our best stats no bonus armor just makes me scream 'why are we getting dps shit.'

It's terrible and it needs to change. Same problem happens with Spirit and healers.

I made a thread about it on the WoW forums, if you guys have a chance you can post in it to increase visibility. http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/15690899052#1

[Sunnydee]

Find it funny tho. first time entering HM normal yesterday. @ 638 ilvl. shit felt smoother than 5man heroics, was a little bit sceptic before due to only doing 5mans and world bosses but seeing some normal mode in average gear to go in with, i must say i've never felt BRM gameplay so smooth, and holy shit serenity makes it even smoother. if they ever remove serenity i swear to god i will shove carrot top up everybodys butt @ blizz HQ!

[Leblue]

Interestingly I wouldn't mind Serenity being removed from the BrM spec since I feel like it trivializes a lot of what makes a player who's good at BrM mitigation good since you no longer need to weigh "Do I purify, should I spend this chi on guard, or am I cutting it close with shuffle and need to hold off". Its cool for WW because its simply a dps cooldown, its kinda bland for us because it basically removes a lot of the interesting parts of BrM AM (imo anyway).

That said you could probably say the same about ChiEx (locks you into a sort of rotation) since I feel like it takes away a lot of me actually playing the class since its very defined what I'm going to do. In fact the "hard part" about ChiEx is getting to where a guard won't drop shuffle off, but that's trivialized if you pop bloodlust at the start of a fight. This is my own opinion on the matter anyway.

[Deleted]

No need to stack haste for Brewmaster ChiEx build. Power Strikes gives you more than enough Chi for it.

At this point, I have yet to swap out of Power Strikes for any fight.

[Deleted]

quick question on brewmaster healing/absorbd.

looking at skada i seem to be owning healers on healing. mainly due to stance of the sturdy ox. Are these the orbs that spawn or is it the damage that i stagger off from the initial hit?

[Deleted]

quick question on brewmaster healing/absorbd.

looking at skada i seem to be owning healers on healing. mainly due to stance of the sturdy ox. Are these the orbs that spawn or is it the damage that i stagger off from the initial hit?

just a skada bug. not actually effective healing but yes, it's the amount staggered from the initial hit

[ScharfAsATack]

Interestingly I wouldn't mind Serenity being removed from the BrM spec since I feel like it trivializes a lot of what makes a player who's good at BrM mitigation good since you no longer need to weigh "Do I purify, should I spend this chi on guard, or am I cutting it close with shuffle and need to hold off". Its cool for WW because its simply a dps cooldown, its kinda bland for us because it basically removes a lot of the interesting parts of BrM AM (imo anyway).

I agree. I'm enjoying BrM tanking almost twice as much since I swapped ChiX for Serenity.

[Deleted]

I agree. I'm enjoying BrM tanking almost twice as much since I swapped ChiX for Serenity.

Your healers probably aren't.

[Totaltotemic]

I think Serenity would be a lot more interesting if Breath of Fire took the idea of burning chi for zero defensive benefit for the sole purpose of doing damage and ran with it a little more. Currently BoF is just bad, which means there's no release valve for extra chi if you don't feel like using it defensively. If BoF actually did useful amounts of damage (even on single target, perhaps just basically being the same mechanic as 4x CE with a DoT without the 2 and 3 chi defensive bonuses) then Serenity would make BrM into a game of trying to decide what to do with all of your chi instead of spamming BoK until Shuffle is irrelevant and then Purifying all of the time even when it's not necessary.

Once that occurs, Chi Explosion can have its Shuffle amount increased a bit so that it truly becomes that "mindlessly press 1 button" thing that people think it currently is (which, spoilers, it isn't) and Serenity/CE would become a dynamic of giving the player more choices to min/max harder with skill or taking away choices to get a general performance increase.

[Deleted]

I think Serenity would be a lot more interesting if Breath of Fire took the idea of burning chi for zero defensive benefit for the sole purpose of doing damage and ran with it a little more. Currently BoF is just bad, which means there's no release valve for extra chi if you don't feel like using it defensively. If BoF actually did useful amounts of damage (even on single target, perhaps just basically being the same mechanic as 4x CE with a DoT without the 2 and 3 chi defensive bonuses) then Serenity would make BrM into a game of trying to decide what to do with all of your chi instead of spamming BoK until Shuffle is irrelevant and then Purifying all of the time even when it's not necessary.

Once that occurs, Chi Explosion can have its Shuffle amount increased a bit so that it truly becomes that "mindlessly press 1 button" thing that people think it currently is (which, spoilers, it isn't) and Serenity/CE would become a dynamic of giving the player more choices to min/max harder with skill or taking away choices to get a general performance increase.

I always thought it'd be more interesting if Chi Explosion gave say, Elusive Brew stacks (like Windwalker Chi Explosion) as opposed to just being a mindless purify at 3 chi or above.

Although with the 4 piece bonus, that's basically what we're going to get.

[Leblue]

In all my simming noobness (was reading TTT's blog and decided to have a crack at it myself finally >_>) my sims are coming back with Multistrike being ahead of even mastery for me interestingly enough (I'm not a super mathy person so I'm sure this is pretty obvious to anyone who does any modicum of theorycrafting). 90% sure this has to do with me only having 1.55% Multistrike on my character although I could be wrong.

Tank Dummy (Mythic)


TMI Standard Boss (Mythic)


This is after me running 10,000 iterations of both as well (left it on while I slept this morning \o/)

[Quotey]

the sim assumes you collect all orbs with no overheal. this is extremely unlikely on pretty much all fights (and impossible on some) which pans the stat.

[Totaltotemic]

Yeah, multistrike has always simmed high. It's just one of those mechanics that is very difficult to create a one-size-fits-all case for. The value of GotO self-healing on, say, The Butcher is pretty close to ideal, but for a fight like Mar'gok where you're moving around all over the place it's not even close to ideal. It could be made more obvious by cutting the heal amount in half or something just to make it appear more realistic, but then the sim wouldn't be trying to optimize Patchwerk anymore and would be misleading if someone did actually consider that but the estimation had already been done for them.

That's why in the past I've considered it about equal with Versatility. MS's ideal case is a lot higher than Vers, but its worst case is a lot lower, and neither stat is as good as Mastery or Crit for both consistency and average usefulness. You have to run each stat through your own little absurdity test to imagine what would happen if you stacked that stat above all others, and in MS's case you'd get pancaked on every movement fight.

[Deleted]

Hey guys I don't really know where to post this so I thought I'd do it here. I rerolled from warrior tank to monk as it's more fun and better IMO. And was wondering if you guys could go through some of my logs and let me know where to improve. This was my first heroic run with the monk + we killed Kargath mythic. One of the main things I can tell from looking over them is my shuffle uptime on a lot of the bosses sucks.

So anyway here is the link: https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/VkxN1CfFnDRJcYzd please be as brutal as possible