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  1. #1
    Deleted

    Clean UH rotation amidst chaos

    Playing my DK for some weeks now I still struggle.

    Yesterday after many many tries on Krogath I realized that I mess up my rotation quite a bit if unforseen things happen.
    With death runes switching on and off depending on what abilities I've been using it felt mandatory to install an addon to keep track of them, that works great but I still have to focus my attention away from the fight sometimes to check my runes which sometimes leads to bad things happening or if I totally focus on the fight itself I sometimes end up hitting my buttons but nothing happens as I'm sitting on two frost runes.

    I really like the DK it has so much flavor but sometimes I question if I should not just roll a hunter for more laid back raiding experience and consistency.

    How do guys feel about it, does it get easier (not saying its hard but not really ituitive or automated for me)?

  2. #2
    Are you using a mod to either show your character panel or a runebar closer to the middle of your screen? Default UI frames could be pretty hard to keep up with in the top left corner.

  3. #3
    High Overlord Grakey's Avatar
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    I used to have that problem all the time. Just keep practicing, after a while you end getting better at following rune regen times. However, I would still highly recommend getting some sort of rune CD tracker, the one I use is DKIRunes, however, I've been thinking about switching to something else recently. Just play around with a few and see what you like.

  4. #4
    I feel exactly the same. Since 6.0 having to take Plague Leech to keep competitive has made me anything but competitive.

    The rotation feels clunky as hell. Instead of looking for the next thing to do, I'm constantly misjudging what to do next. And then missing things because of it. Nothing feels like a flow, like 5.4 unholy. I try to keep it so I PL+PS+SS, and go back to my rotation, but the loss of 2 GCD's to gain 1 SS seems akward. while im trying to keep track of that I lose track of my Death Coils, and spend them when I should be holding them. Or I use a FS when I should SSx2. Or I get totally out of snyc, and have a stray frost or blood rune, and lose an entire cycle. Often the new 45% Soul Reaper gets missed, I find switching targets I lose track of my diseases and when I come back to PL and start back up, often I dont have diseases, losing seconds on my dps, then I go back to something normal like a PS... but then should I mmediately PL and PS again for that extra SS (at the loss of two GCDs? )

    I feel like im spending all my time just trying to get ahold of what the hell is going on with my rune state, and the second other shit comes up like movement or using a cooldown on the raid (AMZ), paying attention to anything else breaks everything. It feels like way too much to keep track of now. Do I PL twice, and let Outbreak sit for a while, ... or do I PL+PS and then hold PL until Outbreak is off cooldown? Outbreak and PL dont really line up at all. 25s is so out of sync with everything else. But everyone in my top ranking guild is saying well its an extra 5% you really have to have it to be up with everyone else. ... Now I'm being sat because of it. Without PL, im never up with everyone else, but they tell me with my gear I should be top DPS. I see parses where unholy is 1st or 2nd. I just cannot emulate what they are doing. My confidence is totally shot.

    So far, WoD feels like TBC... its painful. Every part of it.
    Last edited by Concequence; 2014-12-10 at 06:13 PM.
    We think we climb so high, Upon the backs we've condemned ...We face our Conϛequence.

  5. #5
    High Overlord Grakey's Avatar
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    You should be using PL+Outbreak at least once every minute (when outbreak comes off CD). PL+PS+SS/Defile/SR is less important and should only be done when it wont completely screw with your rotation, you have a 10 second window after PL comes off CD to use it before it screws your rotation up, so its a fair amount of time, just need to practice doing it

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Grakey View Post
    You should be using PL+Outbreak at least once every minute (when outbreak comes off CD). PL+PS+SS/Defile/SR is less important and should only be done when it wont completely screw with your rotation, you have a 10 second window after PL comes off CD to use it before it screws your rotation up, so its a fair amount of time, just need to practice doing it
    Perhaps that's my problem. I am really trying to optimize PL too much. Over complicating things, I will try a rotation with only PL+Outbreak and see how it pans out. Two runes for two CGD's seems less like a frustrating almost break even situation.
    We think we climb so high, Upon the backs we've condemned ...We face our Conϛequence.

  7. #7
    Personally I just hit Plague Leech whenever all my runes are on CD and runic power below a certain threshhold, fills a gap in your rotation and gives you a rune or two to keep pounding away on the keyboard. It is awkward at first but really it's just practice. I felt the same as you a week ago when I first started raiding (first time raiding in 5 years) but coming into this second week I'm a lot more comfortable.

    Just taking a look at my logs I can see I only did two plague leeches on our guilds heroic Butcher kill last week vs 6 this week (and my DPS has increased steadily with every raid). It's just about wanting to improve and practice, you obviously want to improve so just keep practicing.

    Using an addon such as CompactRunes to display runes (also helps display other useful info that can be turned on or off) and something like TellMeWhen to clearly show your cooldowns, helps a lot to smooth things out.

  8. #8
    Im in the same boat, unfortunately I have nothing but parroting what everyone else said. It takes practice.

    Week 1 of normal I was in 636 and was only doing 13k, now I'm up around 19k on butcher heroic in 643 gear (sim at 21k). I know I'm not doing things perfectly yet, and even though we killed brackenspore heroic, my dps could still be much better. I just need to get comfortable on what to do with non-standard rune combos and I'm sure I'll get better. I've played a pally for the last 5 years and I've really been wanting to switch to a DK, and now that I have, it's a little strange learning how to play again. I'm sure we'll be able to get over this with practice, and just keep on truckin.

  9. #9
    Deleted
    I'd really recommend using Docs Debug Runes or the default ones with Shadowed Unit Frames if you have your Character Panel near the center of your screen. It's fairly easy after you practice it a bit. One of the reasons why it's considered by many to be a Class that's incredibly easy to play but fairly difficult to master in every situation.

    http://i.imgur.com/LeS5Flu.png that's how I have my ui layed out atm, it's a fairly old SS but I haven't changed anything. very easy to glance and see your runes with character panel near the middle of your screen whilst trying to dodge fire etc.

  10. #10
    Call me a casual but this is why im playing frost. I use DKIrunes and it keeps track of my runes pretty well. I tried unholy and got the rotation down but I found I was staring at my runes way more than id like. Frost is simple, has a few things to watch out for to improve my performance, and I can focus on the raid going on around me.

  11. #11
    If you guys just configured your WeakAuras addon, all your troubles would be gone

  12. #12
    Deleted
    Here, you can have mine for WeakAuras:

    Code:
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Exiyvt9D1oZXyzqj5x2HJa1Ft7cs0YbL0fqaGOEA06HcsKnfbLKFzhoceRHEia8SMdXrnZhaiwqNAilGHEdRtn0Byn2rWbwdzbmpGuaptbUmtPtnpGuaptbUmtHf9aIJJen6EPwbYYXqmktjOXMqOuSgfyWPy1NUQwo6kvtJDz4z10crz2OMyXAilG9UqqNAKygutleLzJAIfR9UqqRcjoMY9AilGz9GcDQrCfGAAHOmButSynKfWkIHjCSo1SEqHAAwZJNb1tJwikZg1u)nDkwSyncGBIFZNhOzkIVMdXrLqZuQ1jItqaN)QLSPKPuF6QAUYsdBIVlJXedooqSQP(UQPXedooqutJ95bAw2XiRg6HaWZAoeh1qwaZ8baIf0PgeaEwJwXyUmM8hus(rI4eWAdkj618GCMERzrjGaWZ(rGAtWAZp)NAQAilGz9GCU3fc6uRaz5yigLPe0ytiuQHEdR5LD(aIgYcyO3W6uZIsabGNhQU2eSggTsznS1s5AtZ6b5CVleuFhDCOJdI1qptm44arnnRhKZ9Uqq9D0XHooiwS6VPMgtm44arnn2NhOzzhJSAilGrbUmtPtnlkbeaEEO6AtWAy0kL1WwlLRnnia8SwfaUmtPzrjGaWZ(rGAtWAZp)NAQAuGlZuAhoE84rnkWLzkSOhqCCKOrpAilGHEdRtn0dbGN1CioQHEdRXocoWI1qptm44arnn0Byn2rWbwSyXApkSrm44aXQEA0qptm44arnn0Byn2rWbwSwPX6LD(ODr81ODFZ)xVifA5)ksBA1z)QO1dYzSsWXubIegcwS672vnnFDwxBbwxu5HUPR2rx6S6TU0COJJ3pQ6ktFqJjgCCGOMgYcyHoUGckVIEqNAilGz(aaXc6u7DHGvn13vJ(oI)gusnI7T1rsOJnXxSgYc0kIEwNAei0zEZJRDtdzbm0ByDQz9GCU3fcQV7HB3QEuRaz5yigLPe0ytiuQverpRDqResGQRB(8aTkiLR(Zl8hPQHSagbcDM3846uJ95bAw2XiRgYcyuGlZukHgf4Ymfw0dioos0O7LAfr0ZD6behhjAxEPMhqkGNPaxMP0sFxdcapRrRymxgt(dkj)irCcyTbLe9AEqotV1qpeaEwZH4OgYcywpiN7DHGo1Ij)D(zF6ud9gwleLzJgYcyEaPaEMcCzMsNAEaPaEMcCzMcl6behhjA09snce6mV5XXIEaXXrIgDVuSgfyWPy1NUQwo6kvtJDz4z10SMhpdQ)2rTquMnQjwSM1dkutZAE8mOEA0crz2OM6VPtXI1qwaJDz4zDQHSa27cbDQrIzqnTquMnQjwS27cbTkK4yk3RHSaM1dk0PgXvaQPfIYSrnXI1qwaRigMWX6uSgbWnXV5Zd0mfXxR0yPdG(c2ea0PMdXrLql4oRRTaRlQm99Jvpqt6B3Rst670CVQQR8WrntPg9HAtg0s2uYuQpDvnxzPHnX3LXyIbhhiw1uFx10yIbhhiQPX(8anl7yKvd9qa4znhIJAei0zEZJJf9aIJJen6QbbGN1OvmMlJj)bLKFKiobS2GsIEnpiNP3Awucia8SFeO2eS28Z)PMQgYcywpiN7DHGo1iqOZ8Mhx7MgYcyei0zEZJRtn0BynVSZhq0qwad9gwNAwucia88q11MG1WOvkRHTwkxBAwpiN7DHG67E42TQhfRHEMyWXbIAAwpiN7DHG67E42TQhflwS2JcBedooqSQ)Mg6zIbhhiQPz9GCU3fcQV7HB3QEud9gwJDeCGfRvASEzNpAxeFnA)mqQDfqfPDr8TvCEqoJnkxzmzm6qCmfqgLRmMSvS67Etnn0Zedooqutd9gwJDeCGfRXedooqutJ95bAw2XiRgYcyuGlZukHgf4Ymfw0dioos0O7LAO3WASJGdSMhqkGNPaxMP0sFxdzbm0ByDQHEia8SMdXrnKfW8asb8mf4YmLo18asb8mf4Ymfw0dioos0O7LAfilhdXOmLGgBcHsXAuGbNIvF6QA5ORunn2LHNvtleLzJAIfRz9Gc10SMhpdQNgTquMnQP(B6uSynKfWExiOtnsmdQPfIYSrnXI1ExiOvHeht5EnKfWSEqHo1iUcqnTquMnQjwSgYcyfXWeowNI1iaUj(nFEGMPi(AfXyUmM8ReAoehvcntP2IOCqjDfCEarZvwAyt8DzmMyWXbIvn13vnnMyWXbIAASppqZYogz1SEqo37cb13LMJDqZDn0dbGN1CioQHSawOJlOGYROh0PgbcDM384yrpG44irJUAqa4znAfJ5YyYFqj5hjItaRnOKOxZdYz6TMfLacap7hbQnbRn)8FQPQHEdR5LD(aIgYcywpiN7DHGo1qwad9gwNAwucia88q11MG1WOvkRHTwkxBAilGrGqN5npUsOrGqN5npU2nnKfWmFaGybDQvGSCmeJYucASjekfRHEMyWXbIAAwpiN7DHG67sZXoO5UyXI1cUZ6AlW6IktF)y1d0K(29Q0K(on3RQ6kpCulztjtP(0v1EuyJyWXbIv93081zDTfyDrLh6MUAhDPZQ36sZHooE)OQRm9bTsJ1l78r7I4Rr7NbsTRaQiTlIVTIUeMSH9HvcoMYFFdofJzJOmbCEarSyTaQVB6Bhflb
    It does the following for the Plague Leech/Runic Corruption/Defile talent setup (and single target ONLY):
    • Plague Leech on cooldown (only when usable)
    • Applies diseases with Outbreak, or offers Plague Strike if Outbreak is on cooldown (> 3 seconds)
    • Defile on cooldown (ignores rune cooldown) note, weakauras doesn't have the actual Defile icon
    • Dark Transformation as soon as you have five stacks of Dark Infusion
    • Death Coil on Sudden Doom procs
    • Banks runic power up to 85 RP, if your pet is currently empowered by Dark Transformation and you can't gain Dark Infusion stacks
    • Saves an unholy rune or a death rune for Soul Reaper when the target is below 46% health
    • Festering Strike when you have both a blood rune and a frost rune ready (excluding death runes)
    • Scourge Strike when there is an unholy rune or a death rune available (unless reserved for Soul Reaper, or Defile is ready)
    • Death Strike on the rare Dark Succor procs (only when below 90% health)


    It's probably not perfect, but close enough. It doesn't play for you, just offers the ability you're supposed to use next. Follow the instructions and you should do fine - no icon displayed = wait. Remember this applies to single target rotation only, the aura does not know you've switched to AOE and will keep offering the single target options instead. There may or may not be a way to make it detect Blood Boil, but the fact that it doesn't isn't bothering me. Feel free to edit yourself, though.
    Last edited by mmoca2301102ea; 2014-12-12 at 12:43 PM.

  13. #13
    Very kind of you to share your WA settings with other people. I just have one thing to mention.

    Quote Originally Posted by Wrathan View Post
    [*] Waits on Death Coil if you already have a Runic Corruption buff to maximize rune regeneration
    Runic Corruption buff stacks. If you have 1 second remaining and it procs, you will be left with 4 seconds.

  14. #14
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Yopsi View Post
    Runic Corruption buff stacks. If you have 1 second remaining and it procs, you will be left with 4 seconds.
    Does it? Typically buffs in WoW refresh duration instead of adding to it. I'll check it out.

    Edit: Correct, could produce a 6 second Runic Corruption. Removed the unnecessary trigger from the WA string.
    Last edited by mmoca2301102ea; 2014-12-12 at 12:42 PM.

  15. #15
    Mine is exactly like yours without the Dark Succor proc. I will be adding that to mine. Also, now im doing the following. When I have a Sudden doom proc, but there is only 3 or 4 seconds left for dark transformation to expire, I will save it so i can do 4 DC - 2SS - 1DC - DT . In less then 4 seconds my pet is transformed again.
    Don't know if it's a dps loss tho, but I prefer this way since it gives me less focus on my pet, and more focus on my rotations.

  16. #16
    Anyone else feel if they just took either Plague Leech or Outbreak off GCD everything would feel 100x smoother?

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Warpwolf View Post
    Anyone else feel if they just took either Plague Leech or Outbreak off GCD everything would feel 100x smoother?
    Oh, that would be nice. I'd take PL of the GCD.
    Quote Originally Posted by kumduh View Post
    @Wingwraith: You can haz a point too, but only because you admit you're a tool!

  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by Mattzo View Post
    Playing my DK for some weeks now I still struggle.

    Yesterday after many many tries on Krogath I realized that I mess up my rotation quite a bit if unforseen things happen.
    With death runes switching on and off depending on what abilities I've been using it felt mandatory to install an addon to keep track of them, that works great but I still have to focus my attention away from the fight sometimes to check my runes which sometimes leads to bad things happening or if I totally focus on the fight itself I sometimes end up hitting my buttons but nothing happens as I'm sitting on two frost runes.

    I really like the DK it has so much flavor but sometimes I question if I should not just roll a hunter for more laid back raiding experience and consistency.

    How do guys feel about it, does it get easier (not saying its hard but not really ituitive or automated for me)?
    Two addons is all I need for this. Move Anything and Omni CC. I detach the runebar and put it right above my abilities bar and resize it. Omni CC puts a timer on the Rune CDs so I can easily glimpse down and see what is coming up.

    Remember:
    Blood and Frost Runes: Festering Strike
    Unholy Runes: Defile on CD and Scourge Strike
    Death Runes: Scourge Strike
    Prioritize Soul Reaper <= 45% (Unholy)

    That should do well for you. However, Krogath is kind of a crap fight for most melee so don't take that fight too hard.

  19. #19
    Is it worth it to bank RP during DT if you are in a dead zone? Meaning, if all runes are used up, and I have 75 RP but DT is going to drop in <10sec is it worth it to keep that RP saved, or use it in hopes of a RC proc?

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Vuhl View Post
    Is it worth it to bank RP during DT if you are in a dead zone? Meaning, if all runes are used up, and I have 75 RP but DT is going to drop in <10sec is it worth it to keep that RP saved, or use it in hopes of a RC proc?
    Everyone says something different. I don't personally as standing their auto-attacking only evens out whatever damage you might have from saving RP to get DT again. Not to mention the Rune Regen talents proc off RP spent. 50-60 RP is plenty when anticipating DT ending to get it back out. Some people say 90 but that is ludicrous.

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