Fix my DK DPS v2

[LenytheMage]

Thanks so much for the feedback

Regarding these topics
[*]Your losing out on a few PoF casts, with your first being 11 seconds into the fight, wasting a good part of a opening ring (you guys don't seem to be popping on the pull but same idea)

Noted, I have gotten into the habit now of popping it as soon as I do my pre-pot 2 seconds before the tank pulls, seems to be working well
[*]Also missing a lot of plague leech casts, your fist one being two minute into the fight.

To be 100% honest here, I am only using it once I am 100% rune starved and cannot cast another Frost Strike or howling blast, any tips here on exactly when to cast?
[*]Defile is going to be better than NP in any situation when you can get 90% of the ticks hitting, something that should be easily doable on Council.

I did actually switch to defile on one of the attemps (I think the second) but it did not seem to make a noticeable difference in my dps, so I switched back, would you say that it substantially increases the dps over the course of the fight when comparing it to NP?
[*]You cast plague strike a few times, should never do this when running NP as HB will stack it for you.

I only use this as a filler when no other runes are up, should I take it out completely?
[*]You missed a lot of soul reapers Gurtogg, always watch for 35% and be spamming it in whenever possible.[/LIST]

Indeed, I caught myself over committing on rotation close to 35%, then having no rune available once the boss hits 35%, definitely need to improve on that,

Going in order:

For pillar I like slightly closer to the pull or as you are running in (AotD range) but either should work

You want to be casting PL on CD allowing you to generate more runic power fill more globals while you wait to spend RP for KM procs, only using FS to stop from capping RP.

Checked through the logs, you have 0 defile casts across all fights that. If you link some when you did use it I could take a better look at it and see if you where missing casts or not getting the amount of ticks in you would want. From what I've seen for frost defile is better by far, at times doing the same damage as NP without having to lose the disease damage.

What I use it a WA to track the bosses health for each spec (45 UH 35 Frost/Blood) this may help you remember to spam it in.


One other thing I looked over and if a bit more personal preference is not using Purgatory. While AMS can be very powerful a cheat death mechanic is also very nice, might be worth switching to. It in combo with death pact and ams can get you out of a lot of play mistakes that would have otherwise killed you/wiped the raid.

[dmchellfire]

Going in order:

For pillar I like slightly closer to the pull or as you are running in (AotD range) but either should work

You want to be casting PL on CD allowing you to generate more runic power fill more globals while you wait to spend RP for KM procs, only using FS to stop from capping RP.

Checked through the logs, you have 0 defile casts across all fights that. If you link some when you did use it I could take a better look at it and see if you where missing casts or not getting the amount of ticks in you would want. From what I've seen for frost defile is better by far, at times doing the same damage as NP without having to lose the disease damage.

What I use it a WA to track the bosses health for each spec (45 UH 35 Frost/Blood) this may help you remember to spam it in.


One other thing I looked over and if a bit more personal preference is not using Purgatory. While AMS can be very powerful a cheat death mechanic is also very nice, might be worth switching to. It in combo with death pact and ams can get you out of a lot of play mistakes that would have otherwise killed you/wiped the raid.

So after taking a lot of your comments into consideration, I tried out defile, with PL on CD last night

Please have a look at the latest logs and let me know what you think, starting from Iron Reaver, since I carry ammunition on Assault, so stats are terrible there.

warcraftlogs. com/reports/1tH8AyVxp7dQrv2M#view=rankings

[LenytheMage]

So after taking a lot of your comments into consideration, I tried out defile, with PL on CD last night

Please have a look at the latest logs and let me know what you think, starting from Iron Reaver, since I carry ammunition on Assault, so stats are terrible there.

warcraftlogs. com/reports/1tH8AyVxp7dQrv2M#view=rankings

You did decent with it, biggest things where missing a lot of ticks (reaver is a prime example, practice with it in pugs or just run NP on it) or missing casts from random delays, commonly you would miss 1-2 defile casts from random 15sec+ delays. Use it as close to on cool down unless a AoE phase is coming up (air phase on iskar, hands on korm)

Also, while using defile you have to remember about your blood plague, commonly you where at a 50% uptime. Use a combo of plague strike and outbreak to keep it up. (you had 0 outbreak casts)

Something else I noticed is your AMS casts were extremely lacking. This is free RP, keeps you alive, and can also negate some mechanics. For example on Xhul if you cast AMS when he casts fel surge you can make sure you never get it. Plus, when he's in his purple phase you can AMS and possible explosions for RP or catch imp fireballs to stop fire from spreading as rapidly.

[Gabenka]

Hello. I feel that my dps is worse, that it can be, but I don't exactly see where is main problem. Help if you can.
Armory eu.battle.net/wow/en/character/deepholm/Габенка/simple

Logs w.warcraftlogs.com/rankings/character/12964714/latest/#boss=0

I have got ring only on this cd. Tries with ring w.warcraftlogs.com/reports/ZbJDqWLgyPvfj6QM#fight=26
Add ww before url, it was the only way to post it for me because I've just registered)
P.s. Sorry for my english

[LenytheMage]

Hello. I feel that my dps is worse, that it can be, but I don't exactly see where is main problem. Help if you can.
Armory eu.battle.net/wow/en/character/deepholm/Габенка/simple

Logs w.warcraftlogs.com/rankings/character/12964714/latest/#boss=0

I have got ring only on this cd. Tries with ring w.warcraftlogs.com/reports/ZbJDqWLgyPvfj6QM#fight=26
Add ww before url, it was the only way to post it for me because I've just registered)
P.s. Sorry for my english

The biggest problem I'm seeing are of those logs you live through the whole fight, you don't have the ring and that alone would be boosting your dps massively. The other thing is you die early in most of your logs. A lot of the kills seem to be farm so make sure your using your CDs correctly to stay alive.

The other things are:

• Not having EDH (you have one now)
• Not using defile. Defile is better on NP on every boss if you can get most of the ticks in. With a bit of practice and once your tanks get used to the fight, this should be every boss. If you find the boss is still moving too much, use NP.
• It's hard to tell but I think you may be capping your runes as your casts just seem a bit low. Make sure your filling your globals.
• Minimal to no AMS casts, find any point you can soak for RP and take advantage of it. It will give you way more RP and can fuel massive KM proc chains.

It's mostly just lacking the gear you have now and being dead that's hurting your dps.

[Deleted]

Hi again.

This time i have questions about trinkets for UH DK.

I have 4, heroic pebble, heroic warforged DC, heroic warforged EDH and heroic EH...don't have class one or Vial.

Question is what combination i use on single boss fights and what on adds..i have seen so many opposite information that is driving me berserk.

Everyone agree that EH is always on but what of other trinket? On icy veins EDH is on the top but here is see that EDH is not worth as UH dk at all..

So which one to use?

Im 727 itlvl and in our heroic raids adds die very fast. I'm playing necroblight on most fights for now till i get Vial..is Breath of Sindragosa spec worth even if i don't have Vial? Best dps i managed to pull off so far was 100k on heroic Kormok..

This is my armory eu.battle.net/wow/en/character/tarren-mill/Bhallspawn/advanced

Ps..my items are enchanted and socketed with mastery cause i played frost dw..should i swap to multistrike?

[LenytheMage]

Hi again.

This time i have questions about trinkets for UH DK.

I have 4, heroic pebble, heroic warforged DC, heroic warforged EDH and heroic EH...don't have class one or Vial.

Question is what combination i use on single boss fights and what on adds..i have seen so many opposite information that is driving me berserk.

Everyone agree that EH is always on but what of other trinket? On icy veins EDH is on the top but here is see that EDH is not worth as UH dk at all..

So which one to use?

Im 727 itlvl and in our heroic raids adds die very fast. I'm playing necroblight on most fights for now till i get Vial..is Breath of Sindragosa spec worth even if i don't have Vial? Best dps i managed to pull off so far was 100k on heroic Kormok..

This is my armory eu.battle.net/wow/en/character/tarren-mill/Bhallspawn/advanced

Ps..my items are enchanted and socketed with mastery cause i played frost dw..should i swap to multistrike?

Overall for trinkets I find this to work best FOR MYTHIC:

• Iron Reaver: BoS, UeH/Vial
• Kormrok: BoS, UeH/Vial
• Council: NP, UeH/DC, or BoS, UeH/Vial
• Killrog: BoS, UeH/Vial
• Gorefiend: NP, UeH/Class, or BoS, UeH/Vial
• Iskar: NP, UeH/DC
• Socrathar: BoS, UeH/Vial
• Tyrant: BoS, UeH/Vial, I've seen good results with Grontooth also.
• Zakuun: BoS, UeH/Vial, same as Tyrant about Grontooth.
• Xhul: NP, UeH/DC
• Manno: NP, UeH/Grontooth, DC can also work but I've found it to be a bit worse. BoS, UeH/Vial, depends on AoE/Kill Speed.
• Archie: NP, UeH/Grontooth, or BoS, UeH/Vial

As for what you should use, you may want to pick up a 6/6 Skull of War if you have the gold. None of your trinkets besides UeH (guessing that's what you mean by EH?) are that good for unholy so the crafted should beat them out. As for what you should be using (IF YOU DON'T GET THE SKULL OF WAR OR VIAL/WHATNOT) I think it would be something like this:

• Iron Reaver: UeH/EDH
• Kormrok: UeH/EDH
• Council: UeH/Pebble
• Killrog: UeH/EDH
• Gorefiend: UeH/EDH (GRON IF YOU HAVE IT)
• Iskar: UeH/DC
• Socrathar: UeH/EDH
• Tyrant: UeH/EDH (GRON IF YOU HAVE IT)
• Zakuun: UeH/EDH (GRON IF YOU HAVE IT)
• Xhul: UeH/DC
• Manno: UeH/Pebble (GRON IF YOU HAVE IT)
• Archie: UeH/Pebble (GRON IF YOU HAVE IT)

I will note this is mostly guessing for your particular list vs actual testing/sims. Also, even a heroic vial will be a HUGE upgrade for ST.

As for breath without vial/controlling the ring, it will still be worth it if played correctly. If your not running BoS for ST (or not very good at it, it's a harder rotation and needs practice) you would be better off as frost if you play that properly.

If you continue to keep playing unholy (that means learning breath), it would 1000000% be worth swapping over gems/enchants to multi.

[Saiyendra]

If you continue to keep playing unholy (that means learning breath), it would 1000000% be worth swapping over gems/enchants to multi.

I feel like you're overstating the difference a bit; sure multistrike is a better stat but it's not a large difference at all. You can definitely play BoS unholy with mastery enchants, especially so if you're doing speedkills.

[Noxina]

I feel like you're overstating the difference a bit; sure multistrike is a better stat but it's not a large difference at all. You can definitely play BoS unholy with mastery enchants, especially so if you're doing speedkills.

Wouldn't that depend on how much multistrike he got? I am no pro or anything, but pretty sure I read somewhere you need some number of Multistrike before BoS actually becomes good. So you can keep it up close to 20 seconds or something. (Less if you aren't Belf)

[nephzor]

I feel like you're overstating the difference a bit; sure multistrike is a better stat but it's not a large difference at all. You can definitely play BoS unholy with mastery enchants, especially so if you're doing speedkills.

Multistrike is still better, unless you kill a boss very very fast, multistrike is the way to go, and i really doubt the guy he responded to is doing speed kills.

[Khiyone]

Wouldn't that depend on how much multistrike he got? I am no pro or anything, but pretty sure I read somewhere you need some number of Multistrike before BoS actually becomes good. So you can keep it up close to 20 seconds or something. (Less if you aren't Belf)

This is only somewhat true for Blood. For Unholy, BoS is always worth it on 1-2 targets, no matter what gear.

[LenytheMage]

I feel like you're overstating the difference a bit; sure multistrike is a better stat but it's not a large difference at all. You can definitely play BoS unholy with mastery enchants, especially so if you're doing speedkills.

I guess you can, but would you want to? Multistrike is a much stronger stat for unholy and pulls even further ahead on ST.

Multistrike is still better, unless you kill a boss very very fast, multistrike is the way to go, and i really doubt the guy he responded to is doing speed kills.

While true BoS scales better with mastery, all the other abilities you would use during the ring besides one or two (Gargoyle/Necrosis if I remember correctly) scale better with multi compared to mastery. The only time (in my mind at least, feel free to disagree) that switching to mastery for ST would be worth it is if kills that last the duration of the ring/vial AND your hitting 100% multi with vial up, and I'd say that's a bit more than very very fast kill, it's ungodly fast.

[nephzor]

I guess you can, but would you want to? Multistrike is a much stronger stat for unholy and pulls even further ahead on ST.



While true BoS scales better with mastery, all the other abilities you would use during the ring besides one or two (Gargoyle/Necrosis if I remember correctly) scale better with multi compared to mastery. The only time (in my mind at least, feel free to disagree) that switching to mastery for ST would be worth it is if kills that last the duration of the ring/vial AND your hitting 100% multi with vial up, and I'd say that's a bit more than very very fast kill, it's ungodly fast.

I do agree, hence why i replied that multistrike is better. And also yeah the only time mastery will be "better" is if you kill a boss in like 20secs, but useless for any other bosses other than reaver and maybe fel lord. Also i dont think anyone is hitting 100% ms as UH unless they have full BiS wf and socket gear.

[Deleted]

Ok, ty for input.

Question about Bos pull...how do you guys do it? I mean what is priority with runic power...do i empower ghoul first then collect runic power or start BOS and then empower ghoul...

Cause it looks like if i first empower ghoul, then collect some runic power for BOS i would lose like 50% time on leg ring duration...cant expect raid to w8 with ring till i get empowered ghoul and 75 runic power..

What to do first and in what order?

[UNHEILVOLL]

It's clarified in the dps guides, you have to pool 70-80 runic power first, use BoS, and then as soon as you stack 5 buffs on your ghouls, press dark transformation, and then keep doing your BoS rotation

[Deleted]

Ok, ty for input.

Question about Bos pull...how do you guys do it? I mean what is priority with runic power...do i empower ghoul first then collect runic power or start BOS and then empower ghoul...

Cause it looks like if i first empower ghoul, then collect some runic power for BOS i would lose like 50% time on leg ring duration...cant expect raid to w8 with ring till i get empowered ghoul and 75 runic power..

What to do first and in what order?

Depends on boss.

Iron Reaver you can pre soak off the burning cannons from the previous encounter.
Kormrok you can pre soak from the pools.
Archimonde you can pre soak in the pools.

[DeusX]

Depends on boss.

Iron Reaver you can pre soak off the burning cannons from the previous encounter.
Kormrok you can pre soak from the pools.
Archimonde you can pre soak in the pools.

Also, if you are a top guild, you can pull bosses right after trash. This is how guilds at high raiting, doing 1-1.5 hours full clears I think do it. I have seen DK's start Tyrant with 70-75 rp... nothing to soak there unless you finish last adds before boss with 100rp and you only decay 30 rp while everyone positions for the boss pull. Or you stay behind and soak some pool and get teleported at the boss just before the pull. But this is cheesing at it's best and nobody has the same possibility withing their guild.

I pull 30rp with Army, then open up with 2xFeS 2xSS, PLeech, PlageStrike, BoS, 3xSS, ERW and go on from there.
When I evaluate myself for the 1st BoS, I consider it like this:
- if my BoS runs out before the ring explosion, I consider it a total fail. For sure I have pressed some wrong button, brain freeze, w/e.
- if BoS expires together with the ring or just after, I consider it a... /meh
- if I get to 20+ seconds, I am content.
Part of the skill of micromanagement for playing good BoS is managing a 2nd and 3rd BoS with high uptime. This is where you have the advantage of being able to pull RP to 100 before you start, but you have no more ERW. You have to do it without gimping your dps by just sitting on RP and runes for a too long time before BoS. Also, being able to time an efficent AMS soak is important and is part of skillful play.

I am not constant at all these points... sometimes I get to put in practice all the theory, sometimes I push the damn wrong button and the whole BoS goes to hell.
It took me a lot of time to even drop the instinct of using Death Coils during BoS... I was panicking for whatever reason and pressing a DC... and there goes BoS to the drain...

[Deleted]

Also, if you are a top guild, you can pull bosses right after trash. This is how guilds at high raiting, doing 1-1.5 hours full clears I think do it. I have seen DK's start Tyrant with 70-75 rp... nothing to soak there unless you finish last adds before boss with 100rp and you only decay 30 rp while everyone positions for the boss pull. Or you stay behind and soak some pool and get teleported at the boss just before the pull. But this is cheesing at it's best and nobody has the same possibility withing their guild.

I pull 30rp with Army, then open up with 2xFeS 2xSS, PLeech, PlageStrike, BoS, 3xSS, ERW and go on from there.
When I evaluate myself for the 1st BoS, I consider it like this:
- if my BoS runs out before the ring explosion, I consider it a total fail. For sure I have pressed some wrong button, brain freeze, w/e.
- if BoS expires together with the ring or just after, I consider it a... /meh
- if I get to 20+ seconds, I am content.
Part of the skill of micromanagement for playing good BoS is managing a 2nd and 3rd BoS with high uptime. This is where you have the advantage of being able to pull RP to 100 before you start, but you have no more ERW. You have to do it without gimping your dps by just sitting on RP and runes for a too long time before BoS. Also, being able to time an efficent AMS soak is important and is part of skillful play.

I am not constant at all these points... sometimes I get to put in practice all the theory, sometimes I push the damn wrong button and the whole BoS goes to hell.
It took me a lot of time to even drop the instinct of using Death Coils during BoS... I was panicking for whatever reason and pressing a DC... and there goes BoS to the drain...

I'm content with 20+ as well.

Best I've ever pulled off as Unholy was 34 on reaver.

[Runstarr]

Armory: ht tp : // eu.battle. net/wow/en/character/twisting-nether/Runpwnu/advanced
Spec: Frost dual 1h
World of Logs: ht tps: // ww w. warcraftlogs. com/reports/bQn4prhxBz3WNXGd/
Question (BE VERY SPECIFIC): Is my DPS ok for this ILVL/gear? If not, what can I do to improve it, where are my mistakes? Been playing DK for 2 weeks now and I love it <3. Thanks in advance.


//Had to write like this because I can't post links.

[Deleted]

Antenora you mention how important 2nd and 3rd bos uses are to DPS. I couldn't agree more with this.

Manno is a interesting example being able to pre soak but 2nd use comes as we move out so I sit on it. Wait for wrath. Sit on bos a little longer. When hellfire is near pop bos pop ams and take a hellfire or two. 3rd use sit on it for hero pop everything then nuke.

For each fight you need to judge and adapt a bit during progress. What your team needs might not always be best for your DPS. A bit more burst to help avoid a mechanic or two but sacrificing overall DPS can be a very good thing.