[LEGION] Mistweaving Discussion

[xdmemes]

The Animation:
http://webmshare.com/play/qDyaq

Odd that it doesn't mention the frontal cone in the tooltip. In love this this trait though!

[Karmak]

Odd that it doesn't mention the frontal cone in the tooltip. In love this this trait though!

I assume that's just the graphic, and it's not really a frontal cone ability. If it is, I hope they make it trigger AFTER you finish drinking so it doesn't spray on the wrong people, even if its just a visual issue.

[Deleted]

I assume that's just the graphic, and it's not really a frontal cone ability. If it is, I hope they make it trigger AFTER you finish drinking so it doesn't spray on the wrong people, even if its just a visual issue.

It is as was posted earlier a 45 degrees frontal cone with 12 yards range. The visual follows the direction of your face atm, kinda sucks .

[MrCool]

Haste reduces the cooldown on RSK.

So theoretically with 50% haste, you would be able to lower the cooldown to 8 seconds.

I'm confused, wowhead lists RSK cooldown as 8 sec.
Can someone else confirm the actual cooldown of RSK on alpha? (and BOK too, if possible)

Also, the latest buff to CJL makes ranged DPS almost as strong as melee rotation DPS (only 10 to 20% weaker, depending how well you perform the melee rotation and your haste), which IHMO is the sweet spot for balancing the two against each other.

[Floopa]

I'm confused, wowhead lists RSK cooldown as 8 sec.

Can someone else confirm the actual cooldown of RSK on alpha? (and BOK too, if possible)

RSK is 12, BoK is 3 (i think)

[Geodew]

See Effect#8 on http://legion.wowhead.com/spell=137024/mistweaver-monk

Apply Aura: Modifies Cooldown (11)
Value: 4 seconds
Affected Spells:
Rising Sun Kick

I *have* Alpha. It's 12 sec for RSK and 3 for BOK, both cds reduced by Haste, so the rotation flows nicely for RSK->BOK->TP->BOK->TP->BOK->TP->BOK->RSK->BOK-> etc. If I sounded unsure, it's because I know they could change the cooldowns basically whenever they want, and I might not notice.

[MrCool]

See Effect#8 on http://legion.wowhead.com/spell=137024/mistweaver-monk



I *have* Alpha. It's 12 sec for RSK and 3 for BOK, both cds reduced by Haste, so the rotation flows nicely for RSK->BOK->TP->BOK->TP->BOK->TP->BOK->RSK->BOK-> etc. If I sounded unsure, it's because I know they could change the cooldowns basically whenever they want, and I might not notice.

Thanks!
I totally failed to notice this passive.

[Geodew]

Looking at a starter Lv100 MW right now. With 21.60% Haste, BOK cd is 2.47s and RSK cd is 9.86s, which means the base cooldowns are 3s and 12s and scale down with Haste.

- - - Updated - - -

Thanks!
I totally failed to notice this passive.

Hinalover pointed it out to me, actually, so you can thank him. :P He noticed it when he was doing the WW SimulationCraft stuff.

[MrCool]

Now that I know MW RSK/BOK cooldowns scale with haste, I'm confident that the best melee dps rotation is a priority list with RSK > BOK > TP and if the monk has to spam CJL from range, it will be consistently 20% weaker than melee rotation regardless of haste (as long as haste is not something ridiculous like over 100%, where CJL begins to overpower melee abilities due to the 1 sec GCD hard floor).

EDIT: if the boss doesn't move, a priority list RSK > BOK > CJL(2ticks) could also work if you can time CJL ticks precisely (it's hugely gimmicky tho, good luck with such a rotation :P).

[Deleted]

CJL probably does equal DPS when you take into account boss armor.

[Geodew]

CJL probably does equal DPS when you take into account boss armor.

Felt like FWing was doing more DPS out in the world. They may have tweaked the SP coefficients since then though.

- - - Updated - - -

Now that I know MW RSK/BOK cooldowns scale with haste, I'm confident that the best melee dps rotation is a priority list with RSK > BOK > TP and if the monk has to spam CJL from range, it will be consistently 20% weaker than melee rotation regardless of haste (as long as haste is not something ridiculous like over 100%, where CJL begins to overpower melee abilities due to the 1 sec GCD hard floor).

EDIT: if the boss doesn't move, a priority list RSK > BOK > CJL(2ticks) could also work if you can time CJL ticks precisely (it's hugely gimmicky tho, good luck with such a rotation :P).

Are you taking into account autoattacks and the passives? i.e. http://legion.wowhead.com/spell=2020...-the-monastery, I think that may be the only one now (?)

Maybe Antoine or Hina could get FWing and CJL working pretty easily, and then you could use sims to guess a few APLs and see which one does the most DPS. There aren't many abilities, so it's probably straightforward. My guess is that you'd want to TP before RSK at least, but maybe not.

[xdmemes]

Would be nice if TFT had some FW-enhancing option as well.

[Deleted]

Felt like FWing was doing more DPS out in the world. They may have tweaked the SP coefficients since then though.

I think boss armor > mob armor because of the higher level

[MrCool]

Felt like FWing was doing more DPS out in the world. They may have tweaked the SP coefficients since then though.

- - - Updated - - -



Are you taking into account autoattacks and the passives? i.e. http://legion.wowhead.com/spell=2020...-the-monastery, I think that may be the only one now (?)

Maybe Antoine or Hina could get FWing and CJL working pretty easily, and then you could use sims to guess a few APLs and see which one does the most DPS. There aren't many abilities, so it's probably straightforward. My guess is that you'd want to TP before RSK at least, but maybe not.

My simulator does take in account Teachings of the Monastery passive and autoattacks.
The only issue was with RSK cooldown of 12 sec and Haste interaction with RSK/BOK I wasn't aware of, this has been corrected.

I'm fairly sure that it is better to use RSK when available, then BOK when available, then TP as filler. Using TP intentionally before a RSK to get the damage boost buff yields worse DPS overall if my simulation is correct, but I should double check that. My simulation also suggests that replacing TP filler by 2 ticks of CJL may yield marginally better DPS. But it's tricky to juuust channel CJL for 2 ticks.

@Reglitch : my simulation was against a 30% armor target, against which melee rotation deals 25% more damage than CJL spam. On the other hand, CJL is probably better in PVP as targets can have over 50% armor (i.e: plate classes or mages that kite you forever).

[Deleted]

My simulator does take in account Teachings of the Monastery passive and autoattacks.
The only issue was with RSK cooldown of 12 sec and Haste interaction with RSK/BOK I wasn't aware of, this has been corrected.

I'm fairly sure that it is better to use RSK when available, then BOK when available, then TP as filler. Using TP intentionally before a RSK to get the damage boost buff yields worse DPS overall if my simulation is correct, but I should double check that. My simulation also suggests that replacing TP filler by 2 ticks of CJL may yield marginally better DPS. But it's tricky to juuust channel CJL for 2 ticks.

@Reglitch : my simulation was against a 30% armor target, against which melee rotation deals 25% more damage than CJL spam. On the other hand, CJL is probably better in PVP as targets can have over 50% armor (i.e: plate classes or mages that kite you forever).

Is your simulator OSS? Is there any way I could run a PL with it to see if it matches up with my own?

[MrCool]

Is your simulator OSS? Is there any way I could run a PL with it to see if it matches up with my own?

My simulator is too simplistic, so I won't release its code. It's something I wrote quickly to exclusively simulate MW DPS, thus it's a mess of hardcoded values and interactions

That being said, if you tell me what PL you'd like to test with what parameters (armor, ...), I can run it for you.
My simulator uses the following parameters: autoattackSpeed, autoattackEquivalentAttackPowerCoefficient, haste, armor, magicResistance, simulationDuration

[Deleted]

My simulator is too simplistic, so I won't release its code. It's something I wrote quickly to exclusively simulate MW DPS, thus it's a mess of hardcoded values and interactions

That being said, if you tell me what PL you'd like to test with what parameters (armor, ...), I can run it for you.
My simulator uses the following parameters: autoattackSpeed, autoattackEquivalentAttackPowerCoefficient, haste, armor, magicResistance, simulationDuration

Mine is made in javascript, that's about as simple as you get mate

26 sec rem [50% haste]:
https://plot.ly/~rp4rk/12.embed

32 sec rem [50% haste]:
https://plot.ly/~rp4rk/14.embed

32 sec rem [25% haste]:
https://plot.ly/~rp4rk/16.embed

[Geodew]

My simulator is too simplistic, so I won't release its code. It's something I wrote quickly to exclusively simulate MW DPS, thus it's a mess of hardcoded values and interactions

That's kinda why I was suggesting SimC. They have exact armor values for level 100-113 targets already, high-fidelity sims and procs, etc.

And when I say FWing was doing more damage than CJL, I mean way more damage. Like maybe 2x. I think they might have buffed CJL since that build though.

And FYI Windwalker was doing at least like 2-4x my FWing damage as MW, so it seems underpowered still (?). Talents, Tigereye Brew, Touch of Death, Artifact stuff, etc. puts FWing kinda far behind, it seems for now.

[Supliftz]

http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/20742354476#1

hey guys post here so we can actually get a blue post

[cqwrteur]

http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/20742354476#1

hey guys post here so we can actually get a blue post

Why not tell them removing the dispel of Revival?

Why is RJW nerfed to 8 yards? This is my favorite spell, for I have made a RJW addon.