Thoughts on Tanking and Blood going into Legion (LONG)

[bogate]

I still don't get why i should stack crit? Because parry? No thx scaling is awful. Skeletal Shattering? Nah RNG 8% more DR is not serious. Versa? Yea if it would gives same DR as bonus damage.

the only reason to stack crit is for damage. if you want dr go for vers. but really, are you really defending mastery over vers for surviability? i cant even

[Highwhale]

the only reason to stack crit is for damage

Lolz. Why u stack something for damage if you survival is not on good in first place?

[bogate]

Lolz. Why u stack something for damage if you survival is not on good in first place?

coz i know how to play and dont need a full survival build in order to do mythic content? like the same thing went on with BoS and multistrike in draenor. if you wont die you can at least focus on dmg rofl

[Deleted]

coz i know how to play and dont need a full survival build in order to do mythic content? like the same thing went on with BoS and multistrike in draenor. if you wont die you can at least focus on dmg rofl

You can never be too tanky when there are also mythic+ dungeons to take in consideration.

The more beat downs you can take, the more you can pull in certain dungeons. The main DPS is the damage dealers job, you are just there for the good'ish aoe damage and positioning of mobs.

[Deleted]

I still don't get why i should stack crit? Because parry? No thx scaling is awful. Skeletal Shattering? Nah RNG 8% more DR is not serious. Versa? Yea if it would gives same DR as bonus damage.

Because unless you want to go full turtle mode with versatility, crit offer the best benefit providing increased damage while also increasing your tankyness slightly.

[Deleted]

If you're trolling, hah, you got me, I'm an idiot for falling for your bait. Now please cut it out, because eventually someone will see this shit you're spewing and believe you.

I've already told you all, he is what known as a shitbrewer.
Someone who's good enough to get on a forum but retarded enough to still play like dogshit and retarded enough to think he's always right even when presented with overwhelming evidence he's not.


When they get older they become politicians.

[Grishnok]

Seriously i dont get your logic. You all whine what BS stacks eaten by aoe/dots and at same time recommend crit for Skeletal Shattering. You recommend people use damage stat when they complain about survival. At same time Mastery gives absorb shield and increase attack power.

God damn you see things in black and white. You mouse over mastery and see that it says it increases your bloodshield and AP and you instantly "herpy derpy, wow that r teh best".. You are wrong. Stop misleading any newbie that has the misfortune of reading your brain dead advice. Mastery scales LIKE SHIT. Cause guess what? You go all out mastery and yeah your blood shield will be 150-300kish MAYBE, and thats if you have mastery on every piece of gear. But guess what? You lose more skeletal shattering procs, you lose a TON of DPS (in an xpac where tank dps actually matters), you lose Parry (which last time I checked is a 100% damage avoidance when you proc it) and you STILL lose your entire blood shield from a single boss melee attack. And lets not forget that your next DS AFTER your 200kish bloodshield goes away will now be weaker because you took slightly less damage in the last 5 seconds.

This thread has pointed out for months how BDK is broken at a mechanical level right now. Stop spreading shit all over this thread when 100s of players that are clearly smarter and better than you are at this class have proven that Haste>crit are the best stats in the game for us right now with MATH and actual play. Just accept that you are wrong and read through the reasoning behind why Haste>crit is better than anything else and the talent setup is the way it is and who knows.. you may one day not be a complete shitter.

[bogate]

You can never be too tanky when there are also mythic+ dungeons to take in consideration.

The more beat downs you can take, the more you can pull in certain dungeons. The main DPS is the damage dealers job, you are just there for the good'ish aoe damage and positioning of mobs.

well having a second set for mythics+ is a must. my comment was more raid oriented

[Deleted]

Is there any reason why Warcraftlogs is not giving me a KRSI rating on Il'gynoth. I've tanked it twice now and both time it just only gives the Warrior tank a KRSI rating. I start tanking both horrors first so I am tanking, depending on DPS, more or the same as him.

It seems that tank rankings have been removed completley for now.

[redfella]

Tank rankings have been broken since prepatch, and the functionality was pretty awful before that - the creator of the system has directly admitted this multiple times.

Finally he also removed it from his site.

[Resurgo]

You can never be too tanky when there are also mythic+ dungeons to take in consideration.

The more beat downs you can take, the more you can pull in certain dungeons. The main DPS is the damage dealers job, you are just there for the good'ish aoe damage and positioning of mobs.

I used to play Blood. Decided I had enough of the changes after the Legion prepatch and swapped to DH. That said, while my perspective is mostly on DH tanking these days, I think this still applies;

I think you are doing yourself and your group a disservice if you don't push for DPS in things like Mythic+ dungeons. The whole goal and point of them is to clear them faster and faster for your 2 and 3 chests. All stacking Survival does for you is draw out fights longer. Just because it's the DPS' job, doesn't mean you can't chip in and make their job easier. Because in the end, the faster that mob is dead, the less you actually need to worry about "tanking". Dead mobs do zero damage to you.

[Gimmicks]

The problem with the logic of pure survival gearing is that it is built on the conceit that taking your 3rd best survival stat over your 4th best survival stat is somehow going to meaningfully impact your ability to tank content, throwing aside any real consideration for overall value. Mastery can be better than crit as a survival stat without actually being any good for it. Most of your secondary stats should be in haste; after that point, it's hard to believe that the difference the lesser secondaries is so great that you should forgo damage.

[tilsnf]

Some content doesn't allow building for optimal RP generation and huge death strikes.

Any DK who's done multiple 10 or higher dungeons with tyrannical, where the bosses are hitting harder than mythic EN (looking at you Smashspite) will understand this. SD/RT/Blood mirror is absolutely viable for many fights to smooth out damage. You'll be death striking less frequently, for a fraction of the healing. The math shows this isn't optimal, even viable, but you can't account for healer reaction and throughput. Getting hit for 75% of your health and expecting to death strike your way back to safety is not realistic - that damage can't happen. A healer will panic, blowing cooldowns, likely sniping your self-healing potential. Say goodbye to heart strike while doing this (which sucks).

[Khiyone]

Some content doesn't allow building for optimal RP generation and huge death strikes.

Any DK who's done multiple 10 or higher dungeons with tyrannical, where the bosses are hitting harder than mythic EN (looking at you Smashspite) will understand this. SD/RT/Blood mirror is absolutely viable for many fights to smooth out damage. You'll be death striking less frequently, for a fraction of the healing. The math shows this isn't optimal, even viable, but you can't account for healer reaction and throughput. Getting hit for 75% of your health and expecting to death strike your way back to safety is not realistic - that damage can't happen. A healer will panic, blowing cooldowns, likely sniping your self-healing potential. Say goodbye to heart strike while doing this (which sucks).

Rune Tap is horrendous for smoothing damage; Foul Bulwark is just way more average EH.

[Deleted]

I used to play Blood. Decided I had enough of the changes after the Legion prepatch and swapped to DH. That said, while my perspective is mostly on DH tanking these days, I think this still applies;

I think you are doing yourself and your group a disservice if you don't push for DPS in things like Mythic+ dungeons. The whole goal and point of them is to clear them faster and faster for your 2 and 3 chests. All stacking Survival does for you is draw out fights longer. Just because it's the DPS' job, doesn't mean you can't chip in and make their job easier. Because in the end, the faster that mob is dead, the less you actually need to worry about "tanking". Dead mobs do zero damage to you.

By that account you might aswell go 5 DPS.

But you dont because of control and reduction

[redfella]

By that account you might aswell go 5 DPS.

But you dont because of control and reduction

You are taking his argument and trying to make it black and white. Please don't continue, your line of thought will only draw more ridicule.

To explain it like to a 5 year old: you go for the stat that helps you survive the best. The next best survival stat is kind of 10x worse, so the next best thing is to increase damage output so that the fights do not last as long. At the same time, our best damage stat is not meaningless for mitigation, but it's still close to the 2nd best.

For progress raids, Haste/Vers is probably the best combo as tanks dps playes a much smaller part in a raid setting. For dungeons, it actually matters a lot.

[Tehr]

Rune Tap is horrendous for smoothing damage; Foul Bulwark is just way more average EH.

Rune Tap should only be taken if it's required for binary mitigation purposes like Cenarius and for periods of very high damage like on Il'gynoth. High sustained damage, like on Smashspite, makes Foul Bulwark better in virtually all circumstances.

Blood Mirror is probably the only viable choice out of the three @tilsnf mentioned since Bonestorm is worse than useless on Tyrannical bosses (it heals less per RP than Death Strike as it is, exaggerated because of the bonus healing you're going to get from damage taken), and trash shouldn't be a big issue. That being said, the DPS (and healing to a certain extent) that Bonestorm brings is pretty damn useful on trash, so unless a certain boss is going to wipe your ass without Blood Mirror, I would still take Bonestorm.

[Highwhale]

For progress raids, Haste/Vers is probably the best combo as tanks dps playes a much smaller part in a raid setting. For dungeons, it actually matters a lot.

Do versatility increase any DS heal (20% of damage or flat 10% HP)?

[Deleted]

Icebound Fortitude has returned, reducing damage taken by the Death Knight by 30% (remains at 20% for Frost Death Knights).

Dear God ^.^

[Tojara]

Wonder what the CD is on it? 2 or 3 minutes?

It's not bad. I still hope they fix some of the mechanical flaws with how boneshield functions though.