Why didn't you serve?

[enragedgorilla]

Yeah, if you spend your whole career there and are sent on missions abroad... then the money is good. However, as a noob in the Slovenian army you get the minimum wage.

Fair enough...I only speak as to my experience in the U.S. military.

[Xires]

PTSD is a thing. Id like to avoid it. Our country does a lot of stupid things, sacrificing a lot of lives for nothing, or ultimately to make the world worse. Also I would die in basic training, id very likely end up like Gomer Pyle. I really don't want to be trained to be a murderer for the government.

I feel like in some ways my father really got lucky in Vietnam and did not have to do anything terrible. But he saw a lot of people who did, flew through gunfire... only to have a lot of them die on the way back to base, and for what? Like many wars, nothing good came out of Vietnam. I really don't know a war that has happened in my generation that I honestly felt did any good for the world. Is it better that Saddam is no longer in power, I am really not so sure. We allowed one evil to be replaced by another less organized evil. And to be honest I don't think almost anyone in America really knows whats going on over there. We just know the catch all.... Muslim ... and ISIS. Allah the great devil of the middle east. Honestly how many American's spouting this hate have even read the Koran?

Going off track... either way I really would like to avoid service in the military, its not my thing, and I would not be suited for it. I will leave it to people who have less problem killing human beings.

FACT, MOST people in the military will NEVER kill anyone or be involved in combat in any shape or form. Less then 10% of the military is combat arms. Your ignorance is showing. Typical civilian. Know literally nothing about the military yet makes hipster comments about it.

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Military in the USA is just another form of government welfare.

No it isn't because you EARN your pay in the military, fool.

[Ellesarr]

I would rather go to prison.

[Bigbazz]

You're asking why I didnt sign up to trek half way around the world and put my life on the line to kill some afghans for my government? Because I'm not stupid, I'm not one for murder, nor getting myself killed.

[Xires]

I'm sitting here scratching my head as to why everyone seems to think that enlisting = getting shot at. The ignorance is thick in this thread.

That is what happens when you ask a bunch of Cod players as to why they never joined.

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You're asking why I didnt sign up to trek half way around the world and put my life on the line to kill some afghans for my government? Because I'm not stupid, I'm not one for murder, nor getting myself killed.

Actually you are stupid if you think everyone in the military does that. MOST people in the military NEVER see any action. Why? Because they didn't enlist into a COMBAT MOS (military occupational specialty) i.e your JOB.

[Quibble]

I serve my country by being a productive, tax paying, member of society...

I'm a student, so I am very useless to my country atm, lots of free cash for me, + the free education.

I don't serve my country, because, well first, there are so many peoeple who volunteer, so why should I.
Plus, I can't because of ADHD.

[Bigbazz]

That is what happens when you ask a bunch of Cod players as to why they never joined.

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Actually you are stupid if you think everyone in the military does that. MOST people in the military NEVER see any action. Why? Because they didn't enlist into a COMBAT MOS (military occupational specialty) i.e your JOB.

My brother was in the 29 Commando, one of my closest friends was in the Welsh Guards and just left this year, another 2 friends from school also joined the Royal Marines. 3/4 of them got shot at and killed people, 1 of them got shot in the shoulder, went back to afghan again after that, my best friend lost multiple close friends and had a few close calls himself. My brother is 10 years older and was out of the army before the 2003 conflict began.

If you want to do a speciality then you need to have a speciality skill. The military is a war machine first and foremost and I have no interest in any part of that, I'd never waste my time with that shit regardless of the presense or lack of being shot at or shooting at people. Of all the people I know who did go in the military, none of them are better off from it.

[AeneasBK]

My brother was in the 29 Commando, one of my closest friends was in the Welsh Guards and just left this year, another 2 friends from school also joined the Royal Marines. 3/4 of them got shot at and killed people, 1 of them got shot in the shoulder, went back to afghan again after that, my best friend lost multiple close friends and had a few close calls himself. My brother is 10 years older and was out of the army before the 2003 conflict began.

If you want to do a speciality then you need to have a speciality skill. The military is a war machine first and foremost and I have no interest in any part of that, I'd never waste my time with that shit regardless of the presense or lack of being shot at or shooting at people. Of all the people I know who did go in the military, none of them are better off from it.

The only way to be non-complicit is to be actively mooching off the government instead of paying taxes. Or at least that's my justification for not getting a job Damn tax money going to bomb Syria, nope.

[Xires]

My brother was in the 29 Commando, one of my closest friends was in the Welsh Guards and just left this year, another 2 friends from school also joined the Royal Marines. 3/4 of them got shot at and killed people, 1 of them got shot in the shoulder, went back to afghan again after that, my best friend lost multiple close friends and had a few close calls himself. My brother is 10 years older and was out of the army before the 2003 conflict began.

If you want to do a speciality then you need to have a speciality skill. The military is a war machine first and foremost and I have no interest in any part of that, I'd never waste my time with that shit regardless of the presense or lack of being shot at or shooting at people. Of all the people I know who did go in the military, none of them are better off from it.

Hundreds of jobs in the military that are HUGE in the civilian world. Some jobs in the military can easily land you a 6 figure job civilian side. Maybe THEY weren't better off but while other students around me bitch about school payments I don't pay a dime and in fact the VA PAYS me to go to school. Your friends were wounded and or never took advantage of education benefits. I am better off today financially and as a person because of the military.

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The only way to be non-complicit is to be actively mooching off the government instead of paying taxes. Or at least that's my justification for not getting a job Damn tax money going to bomb Syria, nope.

People bitched that we needed to bomb ISIS. Now they bitch that it costs money to do it. lol

[AeneasBK]

People bitched that we needed to bomb ISIS. Now they bitch that it costs money to do it. lol

I don't know that they are the same people

[Fugus]

Enlisted to serve, got injured in Basic training only to have the treating doctor misdiagnose a popped disc hitting a nerve as a pulled muscle and lied on his paperwork.

Ended up washing out due to the injury and coming home to heal only to find out the doctor had lied after it continued to get worse instead of heal and the doctors refused to look at me because he lied on his paperwork to cover his ass. They finally found out the truth after my leg started getting hard to move and going limp.

Now I am on my 4th year of fighting them over disability while their doctors are on my side and telling me to fight them and that I will probably never hold down a real job again while the ones pushing papers are trying to leave me for dead and ignoring their doctors and medical records.

So honestly never got the chance to.

[Xires]

My brother was in the 29 Commando, one of my closest friends was in the Welsh Guards and just left this year, another 2 friends from school also joined the Royal Marines. 3/4 of them got shot at and killed people, 1 of them got shot in the shoulder, went back to afghan again after that, my best friend lost multiple close friends and had a few close calls himself. My brother is 10 years older and was out of the army before the 2003 conflict began.

If you want to do a speciality then you need to have a speciality skill. The military is a war machine first and foremost and I have no interest in any part of that, I'd never waste my time with that shit regardless of the presense or lack of being shot at or shooting at people. Of all the people I know who did go in the military, none of them are better off from it.

Specialty? Less then 10% of the military is combat arms. You have MOS's in the military that designates your job. All you need to qualify for "specialtys" is to score high enough on your asvab BEFORE you even enlist. It isn't hard to NOT be infantry in fact 9 out of 10 peeps in the military NEVER see combat. Contrary to popular belief with you cod players the military does a LOT more then combat and offers hundreds of skills that transfer into the civilian sector.

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I never wanted to kill people, seemed like a good enough reason.

Then don't join the infantry and you won't have to worry about it you nutbar.

[Bigbazz]

Specialty? Less then 10% of the military is combat arms. You have MOS's in the military that designates your job. All you need to qualify for "specialtys" is to score high enough on your asvab BEFORE you even enlist. It isn't hard to NOT be infantry in fact 9 out of 10 peeps in the military NEVER see combat. Contrary to popular belief with you cod players the military does a LOT more then combat and offers hundreds of skills that transfer into the civilian sector.

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Then don't join the infantry and you won't have to worry about it you nutbar.

When I was on Job Seekers a few years back we had a shitload of military jobs on the system, they did a lot of recruitment push through there. All of the speciality jobs required a Degree or similar level of education, that's not including officer positions which required a Degree + specific school level qualifications (maybe English A level?). Those being often being positions for welders/electricians/engineers/technicians, lots of chef jobs and even plentiful work for musicians.

But the only jobs I saw advertised that didn't require pre qualifications were infantry type positions. But like I said I have no interest in being part of the military in any guise. All my buddies ended up as infantry at various levels, and all of them getting shot at. Welsh Guards main duty is to sit around in London with a beavers on their heads, until they get shipped out on tour to Afghan that is.

The thing is most of those skill positions you can do better for yourself out in the real world, my brother joined the Army as a thick headed 17 year old lacking direction, he just wanted to be a Commando and that's what he did.. He came out of the Army a nervous wreck and a drug addict who could not hold a job for a week... Eventually he re-trained as a carpenter and he still does that. My buddy who just left the Welsh Guards had no skills to speak of and was getting himself into trouble, if anything he joined the Army because he had no other option.. After seeing some of his buddies die infront of him now he's a fitness trainer at a gym.

My biggest issue is that I feel like the military is not a worthy cause, regardless of position you're the cog in a wheel of a war machine that serves the government and its whims, with a lot of blood on your hands.

[Babzidu]

Risks far outweigh the benefits and I would refuse any order to kill unless I had a personal, good reason to do so.

[negawonka]

They do not serve because of various reasons I suppose. Most are probably just cowards and fortunately for them (and probably for all of us) we live in a society where cowardice is somewhat acceptable.

I served because I turned 18 a few years after 9/11 and I felt it was my duty to help out. Practically no one serves for ignoble reasons (better ways to get college paid for) but a lot of people don't serve for some very ignoble reasons .

[Babzidu]

They do not serve because of various reasons I suppose. Most are probably just cowards and fortunately for them (and probably for all of us) we live in a society where cowardice is somewhat acceptable.

I served because I turned 18 a few years after 9/11 and I felt it was my duty to help out. Practically no one serves for ignoble reasons (better ways to get college paid for) but a lot of people don't serve for some very ignoble reasons .

There is nothing inherently brave about military service, nor is there anything inherently cowardly about refusing to serve in the military.

Nor is there anything inherently noble about the service or your reasons to enter it. Your post smacks of 'all military members are heroes' and that outlook is garbage. I come from a family of veterans. I know what usually awaits you after you come home and I know the smell and taste of self-important, self-serving military pomposity when I sense it. Its the same stink dependapotami give off.

The military is a fantastic opportunity to learn the values of discipline and teamwork while getting to expand your worldview, but not wanting to join it doesn't make one a coward any more than it makes someone who joins a hero.

[negawonka]

There is nothing inherently brave about military service, nor is there anything inherently cowardly about refusing to serve in the military.

Nor is there anything inherently noble about the service or your reasons to enter it. Your post smacks of 'all military members are heroes' and that outlook is garbage. I come from a family of veterans. I know what usually awaits you after you come home and I know the smell and taste of self-important, self-serving military pomposity when I sense it. Its the same stink dependapotami give off.

The military is a fantastic opportunity to learn the values of discipline and teamwork while getting to expand your worldview, but not wanting to join it doesn't make one a coward any more than it makes someone who joins a hero.

There is something inherently brave about voluntary military service - especially during time of war. Just because Iraq/Afghanistan weren't meat grinders doesn't mean that volunteering to serve isn't necessarily brave. How terrible of a war does it need to be before volunteering to put your life on the line is considered brave?

Or is your viewpoint that there are no true heroes? That smells of mental gymnastics used to not dwell on a person's own inadequacies. It is fine if a person lacked the stones to do their duty, but you don't need to dismiss the merits of other people's actions because others lack those merits.

Don't worry, we don't live in biblical times so cowardice isn't necessarily an unattractive trait in a person. No more than having a limp wrist, fear of spiders, or being "sickly" are necessarily unattractive traits. Some people like limp wristed, spider fearing, sickly cowards .

[Babzidu]

There is something inherently brave about voluntary military service - especially during time of war. Just because Iraq/Afghanistan weren't meat grinders doesn't mean that volunteering to serve isn't necessarily brave. How terrible of a war does it need to be before volunteering to put your life on the line is considered brave? .

Putting yourself in the line of fire is not brave on its own. Its the reasons you put yourself in the line that matters. The man who charged an armed gunman to save a woman's life and gave his own a few months ago was brave. Going to Iraq because you were told to and you're getting payed for it is not inherently brave. Heroism isn't measured in body count, its measured by your actions and the reasons behind them. And the reasons behind the Iraq War were outright fabrications, made to undermine this Country's freedom (Lookin' at you, Patriot Act.)

Or is your viewpoint that there are no true heroes? That smells of mental gymnastics used to not dwell on a person's own inadequacies. It is fine if a person lacked the stones to do their duty, but you don't need to dismiss the merits of other people's actions because others lack those merits.

That is a fantastic strawman you're burning down based on words I never said. Some real dependa reasoning there. What's next? Gonna get angry because I don't respect your rank? Following orders doesn't require 'stones', it requires, at best, discipline.

Don't worry, we don't live in biblical times so cowardice isn't necessarily an unattractive trait in a person

No, but unwarranted arrogance definitely is. You don't become a hero by putting on a uniform and shaving your head, and a sincere fuck you for perpetuating the myth that you do. I lost my cousin to bullshit peddlers like you.

[negawonka]

Putting yourself in the line of fire is not brave on its own. Its the reasons you put yourself in the line that matters. The man who charged an armed gunman to save a woman's life and gave his own a few months ago was brave. Going to Iraq because you were told to and you're getting payed for it is not inherently brave. Heroism isn't measured in body count, its measured by your actions and the reasons behind them. And the reasons behind the Iraq War were outright fabrications, made to undermine this Country's freedom (Lookin' at you, Patriot Act.)

That is a fantastic strawman you're burning down based on words I never said. Some real dependa reasoning there. What's next? Gonna get angry because I don't respect your rank? Following orders doesn't require 'stones', it requires, at best, discipline.

No, but unwarranted arrogance definitely is. You don't become a hero by putting on a uniform and shaving your head, and a sincere fuck you for perpetuating the myth that you do. I lost my cousin to bullshit peddlers like you.

I am sorry for your loss, but I doubt your cousin would like you putting down the selfless service of our many service men and women.

[Babzidu]

I am sorry for your loss, but I doubt your cousin would like you putting down the selfless service of our many service men and women.

My cousin isn't in a position to like anything because people like you who are so puffed up on their self-importance for wearing camo that they can't help but try and brainwash more people into throwing their lives away. You don't get to call yourself a hero because you joined an organization. That's not how heroism fucking works.

You know what is true? People who join the military are in a better POSITION to be heroes, just like cops or anyone else required to put themselves in life or death situations. And the ones who've been in the position where they have to defend someone else don't go around telling everyone how heroic every member of their organization is because they know that's bullshit.

If not fellating dependas and deskjob vets for wearing camo is 'putting down selfless service' then I do it proudly.