[BREWMASTER] 7.X Discussion Thread

[Deleted]

This Is by far the best way to spent your first 11 points. I would probably not bother with the twelfth point if you want to continue the WW artifact afterwards.

This setup is obviously optimized for tanking, not dps

Looks solid. Thank you!

[Deleted]

If you have someone who plays a healer and is decently good at it on your friends list, maybe try running a few dungeons with him and having him tell you how healing in different situations feel to him to get a feeling for what you can do to appear as an easy to keep alive tank from the healer's PoV.

Thank you very much, your information is very helpful. The more I read on this subject the more I think that balancing this stagger is an art in itself and AM for paladin / druid seems very binary in comparison indeed (like the only 2 decisions for druid is if I overlap ironfur or when to use mark of ursol, and for paladin just how do I fill the empty spaces with no SotR up - mainly through divine steed -).

Fortunately my wife is a healer, unfortunatelly she is only ilvl 666 ( ) and us trying mythics while me trying to learn the class and her having that ilvl would probably be disastrous. What is more unfortunate is that timewalking will be gone for a while, and heroic dungeons are not a good benchmark at all, we don't raid, so we're a bit stuck until legion I guess, unless we pvp our way to ilvl 700 and experiment then

[Xiaojin]

Ilvl 660+ is enough for Mythic dungeons if you are fine with doing them properly (use CC, stuns, only pull one group at a time, let your healer regenerate mana in between pulls, etc.). You can also do Tanaan Dailies to earn tokens for baleful gear (random drops) and apexis crystals to buy the upgrades to empowered baleful gear (695). Today (if you're in the US)/tomorrow (EU) demon invasions will start (see the current front page of MMO-Champion). You will be able to get some upgrades that way as well.

As a sidenote, a healer who isn't bored but actually challenged by the content might be able to give you better feedback through being able to tell more quickly what strategy on your end makes you easier to heal.

[Deleted]

Ah yes, forgot about the event as well. Tanaan is a no no though since I hate it with a vengeance Thank you again for you answers

[stross01]

Remember to do the new Invasion things, as there are 700 ilvl armor pieces/weapons to buy.

[Deleted]

which legendary item seems the strongest right now for brewmaster?

the BoF reset seems pretty redundant with the blackout combo talent. So do we go for the 25% heals of purify or +3 sec stagger (which increases stagger by 30% on average and thus also the purified amount by 30%)?

[stross01]

which legendary item seems the strongest right now for brewmaster?

the BoF reset seems pretty redundant with the blackout combo talent. So do we go for the 25% heals of purify or +3 sec stagger (which increases stagger by 30% on average and thus also the purified amount by 30%)?

I'm craving the legendary chest for everything outside of raiding, but the stagger ring/belt for raiding.

[Hobbs]

which legendary item seems the strongest right now for brewmaster?

the BoF reset seems pretty redundant with the blackout combo talent. So do we go for the 25% heals of purify or +3 sec stagger (which increases stagger by 30% on average and thus also the purified amount by 30%)?

The BoF reset still seems pretty good to me. It lets you shift your BoC buffs to brews for damage reduction or TP's for damage. It essentially frees up a bunch of non-KS BoS. No idea if it's the best or even close to the best. But I'd argue that it's still quite strong.

[Leblue]

Its even stronger should you choose to use one of the other two talents (High Tolerance or Elusive Dance) as well. It'll definitely be between that, the ring, and the belt. That said the chest piece being a larger piece is pretty big stat wise as well relative to the other pieces.

[Deleted]

Just imagine unlocking the 2 legendaries. Then wearing the chest and the BoF reducing cd on fort brew ones :P . I felt really pushed into a solid rotation though with the chest and BoC. at 23% haste it was KS-BoF-BoS-TP-BOS and then either wait a bit for KS to hit it exactly off cd, or add in another TP (or RJW I guess if you talent into it). I didn't watch my energy too close, but I'm pretty sure it will make you cap energy, if you do it this way.

I really liked the heal-on-purify one, since you tend to only purify when you're not topped off, which means it's (almost) always useful.

[Lucrece]

Tried Brewmaster just today and....not fond compared to the previous incarnation ;/. They removed any shred of self sufficiency we had, while my vengeance demonhunter and DK can self-maintain rather well, and well guardian druid is just a wall.

[Deleted]

Tried Brewmaster just today and....not fond compared to the previous incarnation ;/. They removed any shred of self sufficiency we had, while my vengeance demonhunter and DK can self-maintain rather well, and well guardian druid is just a wall.

I think the consensus is that in both pre-patch and beta the BRM is one of the best tanks for mythic+ and likely raids too (being a punching bag). However for solo-projects, leveling and just general survival without external healing the BRM might be one of the worst. Obstinate Determination seemingly helps a bit but requires some juggling.

Overall, the concept are at the right place tanking-wise but having our self healing (outside effuse) being "passive" and out of our control doesn't make it make it much exciting for me anyways. I guess it just doesn't feel awesome from a solo standpoint to be the best punching bag in the game. On that note does anyone think they'll ever bother changing some of the golden traits?

[Leblue]

Until you have Obstinate Determination any "hardcore" soloing is probably going to be a nigh impossible effort (survival wise) even with Gift of the Mist. While the self sufficiency we lost was unfortunate, it doesn't kill the spec just changes around where the power of the spec is a bit (although lottery level orbs are lolz worthy). Should feel much better once you get your artifact and get Obstinate Determination and then it'll mostly go back to dps checks.

For world content it was never a problem even with a premade 680 geared monk for me, but ymmv. I'm actually a tad worried about freshly dinged 100 leveling through draenor without all the cool toys for those artifact quests but we'll see what is done there.

[arcuro]

Until you have Obstinate Determination any "hardcore" soloing is probably going to be a nigh impossible effort (survival wise) even with Gift of the Mist. While the self sufficiency we lost was unfortunate, it doesn't kill the spec just changes around where the power of the spec is a bit (although lottery level orbs are lolz worthy). Should feel much better once you get your artifact and get Obstinate Determination and then it'll mostly go back to dps checks.

For world content it was never a problem even with a premade 680 geared monk for me, but ymmv. I'm actually a tad worried about freshly dinged 100 leveling through draenor without all the cool toys for those artifact quests but we'll see what is done there.

i think brm is what it always was. you need a certin amount of determination to play it right. it isnt so streigt forward like other tanks where you direktly see what your AM and self healing does.

go and log in on a warror "oh i build rage that way and use this skill to protect me with the rage i build, checked" or paladin as lest complex: "oh i press that skill to protect and this skill lower my cd on my protect skill"

while on BRM you must consider your stacks, your stagger-level, what t100 you chosed, your healer stress level, what mob/boss you are tanking, what will happen in the next 10s

well it issnt quit as hrd if you get in the flow of BRM, but its deffnitly not the easiest tank to just log in and know everything. But it is fun as hell and defnitly not unplayable in any content

[redfella]

@fallenheaven Druid, Warrior and DK are definately ahead of us imho, can’t say about pally since I haven't tested it. At least DH is worse off [emoji14]

[Xiaojin]

Tried Brewmaster just today and....not fond compared to the previous incarnation ;/. They removed any shred of self sufficiency we had, while my vengeance demonhunter and DK can self-maintain rather well, and well guardian druid is just a wall.

That's my biggest issue with BrMs currently as well. Having lost self-sufficieny. Going from being able to solo most (if not all) Mythic dungeons, being able to solo Kazzak, being able to survive on your own for a while against a raid boss (if you're close to a wipe but the boss is also almost dead), etc. to needing healer for basically any group content feels really bad. Especially if you also tried playing a DK (or DH from what I hear) which is still far more self-sufficient. Felt quite bad when I did some Mythic dungeons recently with a guildie, switched from my Blood DK to my Brewmaster (more experienced as BrM, got better gear as well) and the guildie, who was the healer, told me that I need significantly more healing on my BrM.

I can see that things get better with the artifact, but I don't see things reaching DK/DH-levels of self-sufficiency. Which we previously had.

Well, at least GotO does not feel as bad as I feared with current levels of Haste combined with Expel Harm. And considering the changes to boss/mob movement. I'm still far from liking any kind of orb-mechanic, but it is not quite as bad as I imagined it to be.

BrMs are far from being bad tanks, being a BrM instead of another tank will not hinder your raid progression. It's just that Blizzard managed to turn my favorite tank spec into one of the worst ones in terms of my personal fun factor (maybe even THE worst, haven't tried all tank specs yet and don't intend to do so TBH) and that makes me sad. I went from feeling really strong as a BrM to feeling helpless. Yes, my DK also got a little weaker (tank survivability definitely needed a nerf across the board) but I don't feel helpless as Blood.

[Lucrece]

Yeah, I mean, I got the hang of it quickly. Clear stagger more often, usually use ironskin on pulls to lessen incoming burst and then cleanse.

It's just that if my healer dies because he's being dumb in a dungeon, I won't last any longer whereas before I had a LOT of self sufficiency.

[Deleted]

I think the consensus is that in both pre-patch and beta the BRM is one of the best tanks for mythic+ and likely raids too

Have you been playing druid and warrior in pre patch and beta?

[meob]

Have you been playing druid and warrior in pre patch and beta?

While prepatch guardian is terrible, prepatch warrior is so absurdly strong it makes even monks pale. Though monks make the other 4 pale, so you got two gaps the size of the twisting nether in any tanking hierarchy.

Luckily it's the prepatch and Guardian AW is *inappropriate word*.

[Deleted]

@fallenheaven Druid, Warrior and DK are definately ahead of us imho, can’t say about pally since I haven't tested it. At least DH is worse off [emoji14]

Gotta say I haven't tried out Guardian but didn't sense DK being that much ahead of us but thats not good news, imo BRM requires a lot of brew maintenance for apparently mediocre results. I figured DK would have it tough in mythic+ due to its reactive nature and having to rack up bone shields first etc compared to BRM pre-use of ISB.

Another concern I have with BRM is how the gear scaling works out. The other tanks have flat dmg reductions and AM that usually scales with their AP or stamina. Aren't BRM stuck in a rut? Isn't the damage intake going to be the same outside RNG mastery? Yeah I know that Gift of the Ox scales with AP but I hate that skill with a passion due to its pseudo-proactive nature, lack of control and the fact that you can "use" it by accident by moving the boss.

Have you been playing druid and warrior in pre patch and beta?

I've seen the massive "Ignore Pain" absorbs, I just figured they would be tuned before the official release which so far doesn't seem to be the case (-.-').