To the Discs that raided HC/Mythic by now

[Deleted]

How would you place yourself in terms of viability? Does the added damage you bring to the raid really make a difference?
is the healing output strong enough to justify bringing a disc?

[osmo]

How would you place yourself in terms of viability? Does the added damage you bring to the raid really make a difference?
is the healing output strong enough to justify bringing a disc?

yes/no

i do the around same as our holy overall (if we split in fights there are some i do more / less)
but the amount of dmg is neglectable in my opinion ... im a bit above our tanks...wich in my opinion isnt much dmg

bringing a disc to progress raids... yes/no...depends on how your rl values you, raids size, boss, raid composistion , overall dmg/healing of the group etc etc

i felt 1st boss was like trash fight
i felt like a joke at hentai vulva boss , too much constant dmg, but spike like crazy during hearth phase
i felt like i was carrying at yogi bear , attoning whole soakgroups and landing burst heals right after charge
i felt like lfr when doing khaleesies dragons , such a sweet fight for disc
i felt like spiderboss aoe dmg was still too unpredicatable (ATM) for me to react right, thus underpreforming
i felt like doing not enough at cenarius and going oom too quick (purge more trees!!!) do to the lenght of the fight
i felt that because of sleeper phase i was doing well at xavius but still was oom when he kieled over doing the last 30sec with litterly praying behind my pc while screaming for another innervate and massing buttons hoping i had the mana

but the truth is... altho im having mayor fun during raids etc... i do feel a undervalued and b being a hinderance for the group
our no1 healer doubled my overall output....and we all know its not because he's beter or more gear or working harder but fotm...cant wait till they retune healers...but legion is def not a priest xpack XD

[Deleted]

is the healing output strong enough to justify bringing a disc?

Disc heals the same amount as any other healer, albeit on a higher skillcap. Look at warcraftlogs and you'll see discs doing good healing, its also worth noting that there is very few disc logs compared to most other healers (even less than monks lol) which skews it a bit but disc is still in a good place.

[drtrann]

so currently 7/7 heroic, going into mythic tonight (we were in no hurry and decided to clear 7/7 normal+heroic last night for the extra item level bump/ mechanic practice).

damage contribution is minimal IMO, yes I do an extra tank's worth of damage, but as healing requirement goes up, damage goes down, so the harder the content, the worse our damage becomes. I'd almost say mastery might actually become far more valuable than crit in a lot of situations.

In general I feel like I can easily keep up/exceed with the other healers, as long as I get at least 1-2 good light's wraths in. you can get 3 20 atonement LW's with just a laytorrent potion, or 5 with innervate, which means you can really do some crazy healing when it's needed. the only problem is that for a majority of fights that burst healing doesn't happen often enough to really maximize properly, or you have a druid with 2 min traq who takes all your healing opportunities.

dargon is easy to heal, just call a volatile rot, cover raid in atonements and when it goes out, light's wrath -> easy 90% parse.

ily'gnothsomething: might as well get good as shadow or holy on heroic. damage is non-existant, and your group should be able to do the heart in 1 phase. don't have much experience after 1 phase, but you can do some very nice healing once shit starts getting real in between the 1st and 2nd heart phase. if you don't kill it in 2 phases, may god have mercy on your mana.

ursoc: currently my highest rank (95%) easy to get off many nice light's wraths, and there's plenty of healing to be done, wait for the roars that come right after a charge. and hold your mana for the last 40-30% where you will have heroism + everyone else is getting crushed, very little overhealing.

dragons: pretty basic fight, neither great nor bad for us. in mythic you can be the portal healer, in which case you're damage actually contributes quite a lot.

spiderbirdlady: maybe my worst fight because there is very little healing when everything is going right. I find it hard to outsnipe the other healers, and typically you are moving while aoe damage is going out, which leaves plea spam as the sole atonement generator.

cenarius: pretty good fight for us, lots of burst healing and conserve phases + lots of mana return from the tree, so we can go ham on the mana.

xavius: also a very good fight for us, our burst heals have several places they would be valuable in, and if you get dream phase 2nd, you can really go ham on the mana.


in short, at least in heroic we provide quite a good toolkit, even at my worst, I'm still 90-95% the healing of the other healers + I do close to 100-120k dps. now I need experience the mythic damage patterns to really give any sort of judgement, but I get the feeling that we will see moderate usage on most fights (ily'gnoth and spider are the only ones I expect to either be asked to play holy, or sit for).

[PeopleReady]

Disc heals the same amount as any other healer, albeit on a higher skillcap. Look at warcraftlogs and you'll see discs doing good healing, its also worth noting that there is very few disc logs compared to most other healers (even less than monks lol) which skews it a bit but disc is still in a good place.

Unsure what you're looking at or experiencing, but disc does not heal as much as other healers.

[Pearl1717]

Unsure what you're looking at or experiencing, but disc does not heal as much as other healers.

Lul. That's cute that you think so.

[dialectiq]

Unsure what you're looking at or experiencing, but disc does not heal as much as other healers.

Unsure what you're looking at too..

wwwdotyoutubedotcom/channel/UCpDwlSsHTjB7E-TU3rUYMsg

[Djriff]

Unsure what you're looking at or experiencing, but disc does not heal as much as other healers.

I'm not seeing that at all. Maybe you saw some bad discs?

[PeopleReady]

Lul. That's cute that you think so.

Disc puts out the same amount of healing as other healing specs? Is this borne out in the log rankings? Because I have seen just the opposite, where disc is ranking last.*

*not to be taken as last in effectiveness, simply last in healing done which was the statement.

[Deleted]

Disc puts out the same amount of healing as other healing specs? Is this borne out in the log rankings?

Did you even look at top rankings before making this post?



This is on mythics. Its also worth noting that there is FIVE times as many of the others healers (except mw) than disc logs. So the results are highly skewed, you'd get similar numbers looking at hc aswell.

[Grapemask]

Why on earth would you say the TOP rankings are indicative of a class's performance? Have you taken any kind of statistics class? These are the definition of outliers. You have to look at the average. Warcraftlogs, fortunately, has such a feature available, where the average of discipline priests is listed at the very bottom. By a large margin.

[Deleted]

Why on earth would you say the TOP rankings are indicative of a class's performance? Have you taken any kind of statistics class? These are the definition of outliers. You have to look at the average. Warcraftlogs, fortunately, has such a feature available, where the average of discipline priests is listed at the very bottom. By a large margin.

He said their rankings weren't good, which is disproved, i never claimed that it was indicative of anything.

Warcraftlogs statistics skew things because disc is BY FAR the most complicated healer (possibly even specc) to play in a raid scenario, most people do not play it to full effect (i don't think anybody does) and it has a significantly less parses than all other healing speccs. Another thing to consider is that while discs overall hps might be the lowest they heal where it is need the most, and they are the best at doing it. No other healer can come close to the burst healing of a properly prepared disc burst.

[PeopleReady]

He said their rankings weren't good, which is disproved, i never claimed that it was indicative of anything.

Warcraftlogs statistics skew things because disc is BY FAR the most complicated healer (possibly even specc) to play in a raid scenario, most people do not play it to full effect (i don't think anybody does) and it has a significantly less parses than all other healing speccs. Another thing to consider is that while discs overall hps might be the lowest they heal where it is need the most, and they are the best at doing it. No other healer can come close to the burst healing of a properly prepared disc burst.

That appears to be only ursoc, sir. You take a liberal view of "disprove", especially since I was only asking, not "proving."

[Pearl1717]

Why on earth would you say the TOP rankings are indicative of a class's performance? Have you taken any kind of statistics class? These are the definition of outliers. You have to look at the average. Warcraftlogs, fortunately, has such a feature available, where the average of discipline priests is listed at the very bottom. By a large margin.

And the average disc player is shit, which highly skews this.

[Deleted]

That appears to be only ursoc, sir. You take a liberal view of "disprove", especially since I was only asking, not "proving."

"Disc doesnt heal as much as other healers" and then i show logs of disc doing exactly that, isnt that the definition of disproving it? I can print screen all the other bosses too if you'd like, but you can also go and check it for youself.

[PeopleReady]

"Disc doesnt heal as much as other healers" and then i show logs of disc doing exactly that, isnt that the definition of disproving it? I can print screen all the other bosses too if you'd like, but you can also go and check it for youself.

I mean, yeah, on what could be the most disc friendly fight ever created. I'll look at others. I'm not seeking ammo for myself, but rather to convince my raid leader that conforming our healing strategies around a disc priest will be worth it. I think it is, almost everyone else on my server (A52) vehemently disagrees.

[Pearl1717]

I mean, yeah, on what could be the most disc friendly fight ever created. I'll look at others. I'm not seeking ammo for myself, but rather to convince my raid leader that conforming our healing strategies around a disc priest will be worth it. I think it is, almost everyone else on my server (A52) vehemently disagrees.

If you go look at top 200 logs, you also need to realize that there are 5x as many of each other healer as there are disc priests. So if you only see 10/200 as disc priests, if disc was equally represented that would be closer to 50. That's why people who only look at top 200 and only look at absolute numbers claim disc isn't competitive. You literally have 6 times more rdruids than disc priests, and surprise you see 6x as many rdruids on top 200.

[Goshko]

If you go look at top 200 logs, you also need to realize that there are 5x as many of each other healer as there are disc priests. So if you only see 10/200 as disc priests, if disc was equally represented that would be closer to 50. That's why people who only look at top 200 and only look at absolute numbers claim disc isn't competitive. You literally have 6 times more rdruids than disc priests, and surprise you see 6x as many rdruids on top 200.

There are exactly as many mistweaver monks as disc logs on mythic Ursoc actually, correct otherwise.

People should be looking at averages, not top parses. According to them disc is best by a long shot on Dragons and pretty amazing on Nythendra (also a dragon. Coincidence? I think not.) It's, on average, the worst healer for spiderbird and Ursoc. There's not enough logs for the other 3 bosses to have a decent picture (technically too few for all except nythendra, but I'll allow it). This is for mythic, so people bad at disc are unlikely.

All this is only going by raw HPS, so kind of meaningless. Fun to look at colorful graphs though.

[Pearl1717]

I made those statements referring to heroic logs cause there really aren't enough mythic logs to get a good picture out of anything atm.

[Djriff]

I made those statements referring to heroic logs cause there really aren't enough mythic logs to get a good picture out of anything atm.

Yeah just took a peruse through top logs last night and saw a few disc logs scattered throughout bosses. Not looking at top logs is a silly notion, outlier or not the argument is that disc isn't a real healer, disc can't heal as much as a healer can, when those top parses clearly demonstrate otherwise.