Prot being extremely spiky/squisy

[Veight]

http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte...odehsia/simple

Not exactly sure what I am doing wrong. Everyone seems to say I am extremely spiky/squishy. Is this normal for prot or am I missing something?

[OrcsRLame]

First off you need Hand of the Protector. You want to dip low, then HotP back up while applying your AM. You need to hit a cycle where you're dropping low, (Faith's Armor helps with not dying at this point) healing back up, and using mitigation to survive the downtime with HotP.

Secondly, you need to be able to see the future as a prot paladin. We have insane mitigation, but you need to use it BEFORE you take damage, not as a reaction to damage. Prot paladins are insanely good when played well.

[Veight]

First off you need Hand of the Protector. You want to dip low, then HotP back up while applying your AM. You need to hit a cycle where you're dropping low, (Faith's Armor helps with not dying at this point) healing back up, and using mitigation to survive the downtime with HotP.

Secondly, you need to be able to see the future as a prot paladin. We have insane mitigation, but you need to use it BEFORE you take damage, not as a reaction to damage. Prot paladins are insanely good when played well.

Okay, I was under the impression that Hand of the Protector was only healing someone else instead of me.

[Ashelorh]

I don't like this new type of prot tanking, to me a prot paladin should be really tanky, not drop down to heal itself. We wear full plate and have a shield, not sure how you get tankier than that.

[OrcsRLame]

I don't like this new type of prot tanking, to me a prot paladin should be really tanky, not drop down to heal itself. We wear full plate and have a shield, not sure how you get tankier than that.

We're the highest mitigation tank in the game. Our mitigation is just so powerful that to be balanced we have to be vulnerable outside of it. Our raw physical mitigation will get totally insane at 54 traits with good relics doh. Just imagine 29% extra armor passively and 60% increased armor under 40% health. Immortality against physical damage.

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Okay, I was under the impression that Hand of the Protector was only healing someone else instead of me.

Yeah, it lets you heal other people, but it also reduces the CD by a lot. It can be cast on yourself and it replaces Light of the Protector.

[Bobby1291]

I don't like this new type of prot tanking, to me a prot paladin should be really tanky, not drop down to heal itself. We wear full plate and have a shield, not sure how you get tankier than that.

While I do get what your saying, but my view on it is, think of prot warriors. Low self heals, plate armor and a shield, and take damage and get mad and generate rage. Prot pallies on the other hand have quite a bit of self healing, with plate armor and a shield, and think of their description, paraphrasing of course, "defender who used holy magic to protect himself and allies". So to me, although I do like the feeling of complete tankiness, it makes sense of what we're supposed to do.

[anon5123]

Paladin might just be the squishiest tank in general, regardless of skill. As a healer, I find Paladins always take the most damage. Not impossible to heal, just much harder than other tanks.

In my experience,

Less damage taken <-------> More damage taken

Warrior > Druid > Brewmaster = DK = DH > Paladin

Either that or I'm just running into lots of undergeared Paladin tanks and lots of overgeared Warrior/Druid tanks.

[szandos]

Paladins have turned into the old type of blood dk's nowadays, lots of self healing and cd's to ensure they survive. A paladin that doesn't use the tools available will be squishy, just like an old school dk used to be.

If you have a decently played paladin, I doubt the net result is more damage needing to be healed compared to a warrior, but as a healer I MUCH prefer the smoother hp loss of a warrior. Specially considering the rather small hp-pool of paladins, it's easy to get really scared when they dip low within seconds of a pull.

[tuesday the paladin]

Paladin might just be the squishiest tank in general, regardless of skill. As a healer, I find Paladins always take the most damage. Not impossible to heal, just much harder than other tanks.

In my experience,

Less damage taken <-------> More damage taken

Warrior > Druid > Brewmaster = DK = DH > Paladin

Either that or I'm just running into lots of undergeared Paladin tanks and lots of overgeared Warrior/Druid tanks.

I don't know if it's the case for everyone else, but I've been seeing TONS of crit gear, and almost no versatility gear. So that definitely hurts.

[Azelas]

Paladins are stressful as hell to heal. It's not that they die. It's just that they drop stupidly low and then they kinda bring themselves back up, but at that point im already panicking and spamming flash heals on them.

I personally prefer how warriors play: I can kind of predict the approximate amount of damage they will take each couple seconds, and plan on that. But they're not bad, Paladins are still decent enough tanks imo, and their aoe damage is insane, at least in my experience.

[Deleted]

I am a healer who tanks heroics and no way are we squishy.

[Cheeki Breeki]

You guys must be healing shit paladins,bad geared paladins or both because my health never drops. I can do any heroic without a healer and mythics are a joke and the only defensive i need to use is just my passive from shield or my steed with talent, hell i chain pull and round up 2 bigs packs in most mythics and never drop below 80% and ive never seen my healers mana go below 70% through out the whole mythic.

[Heirod]

I am a healer who tanks heroics and no way are we squishy.

yesterday we did darkheart ticket hero, healer was afk. i self healed for the whole istance. atm at 820 ilvl.

we are ok, just we need to plan the cd use.

[Shaktard]

843 ilvl here atm and, at least in hcs, I don't feel squishy at all. As others have said.. its a cycle of dipping low and then healing yourself back up with LotP.

Mythic on the other hand.. I do dip low a bit too often for my liking but that's what CDs are for.

And yea, I'm not seeing a lot of versatility on gear right now. Should hopefully get a bit better.

[Wallack]

With talents and consecration and everything how much will LoTP heal you in percentage? It says 35 of your missing health plus 20% if on consecration? or plus 20% of that 35% ?

[Monzsterr]

Going into mythics (a little under geared) with my guild was a humbling experience. Not because paladin is bad, I've found it's very solid. But because I found I was doing it horribly horribly wrong. I spent the prepatch cheesing HFC for fat dps and didn't even learn the actual damage mitigation methods. So, here is the basics I had to learn.
So I'm assuming Righteous Protector as a talent.
What I've found is absolutely core to this that I didn't clue into at first is that judgment lowers the cooldown of shield of the righteous, and shield of the righteous lowers the cooldown (from talent) on light of the protector. LotP will heal you for about %50 of missing health while standing in consecration.
So what can be done is to only use shield of the righteous when you're about to cap it at 3 charges, or when big inc damage is coming, or when LotP is on cooldown and you want it back really quick. If you have 2 charges and LotP up you can often just eat some damage and get your LotP back quickly by saving the shield for after you've used LotP. You want to avoid using your second or third charge of shield while LotP is still up.
I was quite used to old hammer of the righteous / crusader strike taking priority in the rotation. But getting your judgment off asap to get your SotR charges back is really important. The priority order has very changed very much from last xpac even thought the buttons are very much the same. Just figuring out the very simple concept of maximising the cool down reductions by using judgment and SotR well changed everything. Went from scrub to half ways competent.

[Deleted]

Any healer of my guild told me how awesome it is to heal my prot pally since they most of the time don't have to do anything besides focussing on the rest of the group. Been chainpulling 2-3 packs in mythics using CDs specced into DPS with Seraphim and destroying everything with avenging wrath.
Using your CDs in the right spots and not trying to be too conservative with your Guardian although it's a 5min CD is key in my opinion. Pulling aggressively with CDs and being a little more cautious or using stuns when they're down. I think the most important point in not getting smashed on trash is to first really learn how to maximize your DPS. Seraphim is very important here. Killing packs before they start hurting is always better than trying to sustain damage for a longer period of time.

[Deleted]

Pallies cannot die in current content simple as that. HP dancing is the most effective way of LotP usage and thats why sometimes someone may find it fun to mess around with it specially when current bosses need much more than a single autoattack to nuke u dead. Dps is monstrous specially in aoe packs.
Concerning Hammer i really stop looking at it anymore , judge-conc-avenger my gcd usage, may hit a hammer from time to time macroing it with shield and lotp for the extra mitigation but usually am filling the gaps of the rotation with some minor cd (there is always something handy there that involves more than autoattacks lewl).
Last defender is absolutely brilliant for current content and i really cannot decide between that tier of talents for aoe packs.

[Deleted]

Hand of the Protector is useless really. Sure the CD is reduced a bit, but you won't spike in HP that much in relation to that.
At the same time, Final Stand is so strong it's insane.

Sure, you can all debate about Prot Palas and that you "never take dmg". But believe me, when push comes to shove we ARE the squishiest tank atm (Have a Prot, DH and Warrior on almost same ilvl and have both DPS/healed/tanked as Paladin in mythics). Even if we cycle CD's (yes that is our new playstyle) we WILL have to kite on higher Mythic+ dungeons to not die during downtime if the group isn't 100% synced.

It is also hard to judge sometimes how much damage the tank actually is taking. Most big pulls comes down to good hard CC (stuns), interrupts and not overlapping CD's. DPS that knows what they are doing can reduce the incoming damage the tank will receive by huge margins. From this aspect, Prot Palas have potential to be the most optimal tanks in dungeons.

[Maylander]

I haven't tried Prot all that much, but I have tried Holy quite a lot, and as a healer I'm not a fan of the "spikey" tanks, which there are quite a few of right now. Basically, Warrior and Druid appears to have constant, predictable mitigation. Everyone else rely on some form of "drop before going back up" style that almost gives me a heart attack at times. As a healer, I don't like asking myself "is his healing CD ready? Will he bounce back up again?".

That being said, I have no idea how it will all turn out in raids. Something tells me that Ignore Pain, which is completely broken in 5-mans, might just be laughable to a proper raid boss.