Oneth's Intuition on single target fights

[Hoto]

For those who don't know the item and are too lazy to do the research:
Oneth's intuition is a legendary that gives you a 20% chance to cast a free starsurge every time you cast starfall and vice versa a 20% chance to get a free starfall for every starsurge you cast.

On fights like Ursoc or Nythendra, (pure single target) is it worth using one GCD to cast the free starfall instead of just doing your classic single target rotation? Keep in mind casting the free starfall also gives you 20% chance to get a free starsurge.

I was checking my logs and on average this are the spell damages :

• Stasurge : 352k
• Starfall : 258k
• Lunar Strike : 221k
• Solar Wrath : 152k

Maybe I'm missing some point but it's probably better to ignore starfalls on single target and just spam as many starsurges as possible?

[Adramelch]

It's a huge dps boost.

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...done&source=13

It's in Russian (but it was top parse with OI on Ursoc mythic), but you can see his starfall alone doing 10% of his DPS. You can only imagine how strong that is when you factor in the DoT empowerment. Ursoc is not a pure ST fight however, but even on ST it's worth casting the starfall (and it becomes even stronger if you spec to StFl I assume).

[Hoto]

It's a huge dps boost.

It's in Russian (but it was top parse with OI on Ursoc mythic), but you can see his starfall alone doing 10% of his DPS. You can only imagine how strong that is when you factor in the DoT empowerment. Ursoc is not a pure ST fight however, but even on ST it's worth casting the starfall (and it becomes even stronger if you spec to StFl I assume).

Mythic Ursoc is not a single target fight, since he creates a clone of himself.
Also you can see in this fight Starfall doing more damage than starsurge with a lower crit chance, so in that case obviously it's a dps gain.
I only want to know for a PURE single target fight.

[ryklin]

ok so starfall can be cast while moving, has a 20% chance to give you an extra starsurge (not actually sure about this, can the free starfall give a free starsurge?) and does a bit over twice the damage of wrath to 1 target before the dot bonus at like 0 mastery gear (this will change with your mastery, but it's a pretty big difference level) and has the same cast time as a wrath before factoring in the dot buffs

wrath generates 25% of a starsurge and takes about 1 gcd to cast while not moving

just from the above, it's obvious it's yes, but you can hold off on it if you won't be casting starsurges to cast something while moving, and I can do more math on it, but part of it will come down to your artifact traits and secondary stats, so it'll look different for everyone, but the starfall should still pull ahead, but the exact number of ticks you'll need for the starfall to still pull ahead can change if the boss is moving

but just add together your raw starfall damage+4/9 of your dots total damage and compare that to 1/4 of your starsurge and 1/4 empowerment bonuses and a wrath, it's hilarious how far ahead a starfall is

NOTE: Remember, starfall is actually not crazily far behind starsurge on single target if you don't account for it costing 50% more ap


the big thing I'd take note of though is this legendary makes fury seem a lot weaker relatively speaking though, and I can't really, I can't find a good parse of it quickly just looking at my guild's heroic kills cause despite our druid having it, he still uses fury of elune which greatly reduces the benefit of the legendary (and we even farm heroic by going nyth>ursoc>codex>the rest of them so people can take single targ talents)

[Adramelch]

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...-done&source=3

Heroic nythendra. 3.5% from just Starfall + whatever the DoTs gain. It's just worth it no matter how you see it.
@ryklin: It can double-dip afaik.

[vorchun]

It's a huge dps boost.

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports...done&source=13

It's in Russian (but it was top parse with OI on Ursoc mythic), but you can see his starfall alone doing 10% of his DPS. You can only imagine how strong that is when you factor in the DoT empowerment. Ursoc is not a pure ST fight however, but even on ST it's worth casting the starfall (and it becomes even stronger if you spec to StFl I assume).

Not sure where you got that 10% number, starfall did 4.92% in that log.

[Adramelch]

Not sure where you got that 10% number, starfall did 4.92% in that log.

Yeah I realised afterwards I was looking at Moonfire by mistake.

[Nythiz]

Maybe I'm missing some point but it's probably better to ignore starfalls on single target and just spam as many starsurges as possible?

But this is not the tradeoff.

You're not tradeing a starsurge for a starfall, because the starfall costs 0 AP
What you trade is a GCD for a starfall; which at the end of a fight generally means that you trade a non-empowered solar wrath for it.

That GCD gives you: 9 * 44% SP (starfall itself) + 0.20 * 450% SP (20% chance on a free starsurge) + 192.5% SP from stellar empowerment benefit** = 678.5% SP
**Stellar empowerment is completely gear dependent so I have no clue whatsoever how much it is, but for ease's sake I assumed you get 1/4th of a full MF/SF worth of damage out of it. It's probably even way higher considering haste and mastery levels above 50%. But just to put a number on it i went with 25% of both DoTs.

And you get that for only the cost of a GCD, which would otherwise likely have been spent on a Wrath cast for 200% Spellpower.

Disclaimer: Math might be off on some points, but it's more to make a point that Starfall is quite good.

[Adramelch]

But this is not the tradeoff.

You're not tradeing a starsurge for a starfall, because the starfall costs 0 AP
What you trade is a GCD for a starfall; which at the end of a fight generally means that you trade a non-empowered solar wrath for it.

That GCD gives you: 9 * 44% SP (starfall itself) + 0.20 * 450% SP (20% chance on a free starsurge) + 192.5% SP from stellar empowerment benefit** = 678.5% SP
**Stellar empowerment is completely gear dependent so I have no clue whatsoever how much it is, but for ease's sake I assumed you get 1/4th of a full MF/SF worth of damage out of it. It's probably even way higher considering haste and mastery levels above 50%. But just to put a number on it i went with 25% of both DoTs.

And you get that for only the cost of a GCD, which would otherwise likely have been spent on a Wrath cast for 200% Spellpower.

In fact I think the stellar empowerment is quite a big factor, which makes starfall pretty competetive to starsurge even ignoring the legendary proc. Given the fact it's completely free should make it a no-brainer use if you can land the full duration.

Disclaimer: Math might be off on some points, but it's more to make a point that Starfall is quite good.

Or to put it more simply, just the damage of Starfall itself is double than that of a Wrath cast. Just to give people some perspective on how valuable the legendary can be even on single target.

[xtramuscle]

The trinket can proc back to back to back, meaning that starfall can give you a extra ss or more

[Hoto]

Thanks for all the answers guys
Hopefully my silly question can enlighten someone who just got the legendary.

[Shiftaced]

I have this legendary as well. Any feedback about ditching Incarn for stellar flare?

[Mangetsu]

/bump

I have this legendary as well. Any feedback about ditching Incarn for stellar flare?

Been wondering about that too. Gebuz's Balance guide suggests dropping Incarnation for Stellar Flare, as well as taking Astral Communion instead of Blessing of the Ancients with Oneth's Intuition, but I don't see people doing that in logs. Are the sims inaccurate or is it something else as well? Any thoughts?

[Slippykins]

/bump



Been wondering about that too. Gebuz's Balance guide suggests dropping Incarnation for Stellar Flare, as well as taking Astral Communion instead of Blessing of the Ancients with Oneth's Intuition, but I don't see people doing that in logs. Are the sims inaccurate or is it something else as well? Any thoughts?

It was theorised that you would swap in StFL if you got OI because of the synergy, but at the end of the day Incarnation is too powerful to give up.

[cparle87]

It was theorised that you would swap in StFL if you got OI because of the synergy, but at the end of the day Incarnation is too powerful to give up.

I'm pretty new to boomkin, but isn't Incarnation nothing more than a +5% damage buff over the baseline ability for 30 sec every 3 minutes?

[Myztikrice]

I'm pretty new to boomkin, but isn't Incarnation nothing more than a +5% damage buff over the baseline ability for 30 sec every 3 minutes?

no it also makes it last 30 seconds instead of 15. the base cd only lasts 15 seconds

[FuxieDK]

Oneth's intuition is a legendary that gives you a 20% chance to cast a free starsurge every time you cast starfall

False. It have a 20% chance to give a free Starsurge every time Starfall deals damage..

Keep in mind casting the free starfall also gives you 20% chance to get a free starsurge.

This is as far from the truth as possible..

Free Starfall DOES NOT proc free Starsurge, nor does free Starsurge proc free Starfall..
I've had this legendary for over 2 months and it have not happened a single time..

[xtramuscle]

False. It have a 20% chance to give a free Starsurge every time Starfall deals damage..

This is as far from the truth as possible..

Free Starfall DOES NOT proc free Starsurge, nor does free Starsurge proc free Starfall..
I've had this legendary for over 2 months and it have not happened a single time..

You're wrong about everything you said. It's chance on CAST not on damage. And starflower can proc starsurge and it does proc back to back to back. Either you're not tracking it properly or you're super unlucky. No one is saying the free one is certain to proc another, but it is possible. It's just a 1 in 25 chance.

[FuxieDK]

You're wrong about everything you said. It's chance on CAST not on damage. And starflower can proc starsurge and it does proc back to back to back. Either you're not tracking it properly or you're super unlucky. No one is saying the free one is certain to proc another, but it is possible. It's just a 1 in 25 chance.

If Starsurge proc on Starfall cast, please explain why you can get 3, 4 or 5 Starsurge procs on big AoE packs, when you Hardcastle Starfall, yet NEVER procs on free cast.

[Arienda]

If Starsurge proc on Starfall cast, please explain why you can get 3, 4 or 5 Starsurge procs on big AoE packs, when you Hardcastle Starfall, yet NEVER procs on free cast.

Is it possible that every time it applies/refreshes the starfall debuff on a target is what has the chance to proc it? Just a random idea.