Survival Needs to Stay and be Fixed

[SnowTang]

No thanks. Blizzard removed my favorite spec in the game and replaced it with a garbage melee spec. Until they remove it, I will continue to voice my opinion on how trash it is. Besides, there's a reason it has the smallest, tiniest, playerbase of any spec in the entire game, and if you think it's not because it's a trash melee spec you're blind.

[Deleted]

Don't know. That's fun to me. I never really have a problem reaching 6 stacks of mongoose bites.

But before you reach 6 stacks, your damage output feels/is horrible and it's annoying in the first place because you want to be at your peak for certain mechanics whenever they appear. "Planning" to be at 6 stacks doesn't help either because you can't plan the procs in the first place, which means you might end the 6 stack with well, 6 stacks and not 6+3 or whatever.
It's really a super weird spec to play in raids.

It's fun/fine in world content though.

[Banard]

Fix Melee Survival.

No delete it. We didnt need another melee spec. Bring back the old surv. There was no improvement. Undo every change Legion made.

[Myta]

This sounds made up

80th Percentile last 2 weeks, IE most current form of Tomb with Crucible Talents

Overall Survival is near bottom:
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/statistics/13/#dataset=80

However any fight that involves cleave dps, soaking, high mobility, than Survival rockets to the top(A Survival Hunter was in 1st kill of Gul'dan and crushing it also):
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/statist...t=80&boss=2051

Survival has the tools, it's a good spec functionally, it has utility, it does great DPS.

It's just horrendously difficult to play perfectly.

[hawtlol]

But before you reach 6 stacks, your damage output feels/is horrible and it's annoying in the first place because you want to be at your peak for certain mechanics whenever they appear. "Planning" to be at 6 stacks doesn't help either because you can't plan the procs in the first place, which means you might end the 6 stack with well, 6 stacks and not 6+3 or whatever.
It's really a super weird spec to play in raids.

It's fun/fine in world content though.

I mean are you just used to the easy system where classes don't have any real build up? I had no problem getting to 6 stacks to be able to eagle's fury every single time during mythic gul'dan progression while also getting off all 3 butchery's. I think a lot of you just aren't aware on how to play the spec? What is your common opener?
I'm a top parsing Survival Hunter and have played it all Legion.

I'll start off with a PPP at 3 sec on DBM countdown. 2 seconds I pop cobra. At 1 I harpoon to my target. Lacerate>Caltrops, Raptor Strike. Use my 3 mongoose bite stacks. Maybe I'll have another before I use them up since my haste and crit are so high. Once I run out of my initial stacks I pop Snake Hunter and start spamming mongoose bite until about 1 sec left on my Mongoose window which usually gives me about 9 total mongoose attacks in total on top of the lacerate, SS, and caltrops damage going off. and with 1 second left I eagle's fury and can maybe get off another mongoose bite before the window fully runs out leading to 10 mongoose bites, 4 of which are at 6 stacks with the damage boost from aspect of eagle and are hitting like trucks. I'm usually peaking around 3 million and sustain anywhere from 1.3-1.6 million.

[Donkeywing]

Thats a pleonasm mate

[Deleted]

I mean are you just used to the easy system where classes don't have any real build up? I had no problem getting to 6 stacks to be able to eagle's fury every single time during mythic gul'dan progression while also getting off all 3 butchery's. I think a lot of you just aren't aware on how to play the spec? What is your common opener?
I'm a top parsing Survival Hunter and have played it all Legion.

I'll start off with a PPP at 3 sec on DBM countdown. 2 seconds I pop cobra. At 1 I harpoon to my target. Lacerate>Caltrops, Raptor Strike. Use my 3 mongoose bite stacks. Maybe I'll have another before I use them up since my haste and crit are so high. Once I run out of my initial stacks I pop Snake Hunter and start spamming mongoose bite until about 1 sec left on my Mongoose window which usually gives me about 9 total mongoose attacks in total on top of the lacerate, SS, and caltrops damage going off. and with 1 second left I eagle's fury and can maybe get off another mongoose bite before the window fully runs out leading to 10 mongoose bites, 4 of which are at 6 stacks with the damage boost from aspect of eagle and are hitting like trucks. I'm usually peaking around 3 million and sustain anywhere from 1.3-1.6 million.

Yeah I am. At least in WoW, because the game is designed in a way where classes with a huge windup/buildup are/feel unrewarding in most situations. This would work in FF14 just fine though

Pretty much confirms what I've been saying.
What a huge amount of shit to do when other specs do the same with just 2-3 buttons and super punishing when you mess up too.
And since you can't get up to 6 in an instant, you also lose burst potential whenever you start a mongoose-window to early/late. Which will always translate to some problems mid-combat.

With MM I can literally start with 100% when I use windburst, which isn't as punishing to delay when an add will appear in 5-10 seconds.


There is simply no need to have Mongoose stack up 6 times... it's not really more entertaining to have 6 instead of 3 for example. I just don't get it - what's the point? Especially on a class with a 1,5gcd?

[chezwickcheese]

It is staying. They specifically said that there would be no major spec overhauls in BFA.

They also said that tier sets would stay but look what happened.

Survival needs some work. Keep it melee, keep the theme but rework the abilities and make it less clunky/punishing. The class fantasy of fighting side by side with your pet with a giant spear is really cool.

[Sarkol]

They are indeed reworking Survival somewhat in BFA. It's staying melee.

[Deleted]

Please Blizzard, take out a lot of those hit shots and put more traps, exclusive cool traps, and give us the Lone Wolf talent please, SURVIVAL needs to be a SURVIVAL, without the pet, PLEASE. I want cobra trap, snake trap, some fucking bomb a fuck trap, something, give me 6 or 8 traps for me

[Deleted]

Survival got a mention in the Q&A to get more "significant changes", so thats something.

I hope they keep it melee but improve the gameplay.

[Ningjinq]

They did say it’s staying melee.

[oplawlz]

Even if they fix and make Survival flavor of the expansion, being ahead 600k dps compared to other Hunter specs I still wouldn't play it.
Why? I rolled a Huntard to be Ranged.

No one is telling you to roll survival. You have two ranged specs, they should stay ranged. One melee spec isn't hurting you or anyone else.

[Nythiz]

I mean are you just used to the easy system where classes don't have any real build up? I had no problem getting to 6 stacks to be able to eagle's fury every single time during mythic gul'dan progression while also getting off all 3 butchery's. I think a lot of you just aren't aware on how to play the spec? What is your common opener?

It's easy to get to 6 stacks, that's not the issue being raised here. It's just a clunky mechanic. Exactly as KrayZee says the build up feels very unrewarding and the end result really isn't all that special either.

The opener in raids really isn't that important for the point being made here. Survival lacks burst in those few first seconds. And that might not matter to some, but if you need to swap to a priority add or if you're running out in the world and you want to nuke a quest mob SV is clearly inferior to MM or BM (or most other classes/specs for that matter). Where the latter two can nearly one or two shot with simply using basic attacks out of the gate. SV needs this whole build up that doesn't even see it's climax before the mob dies.
People really dislike how something like MB mechanic doesn't even work properly while swapping/questing because shit dies before you get to 3 stacks and MB is really shitty shitty damage until you get to 6 stacks.

I'll start off with a PPP at 3 sec on DBM countdown. 2 seconds I pop cobra. At 1 I harpoon to my target. Lacerate>Caltrops, Raptor Strike. Use my 3 mongoose bite stacks. Maybe I'll have another before I use them up since my haste and crit are so high. Once I run out of my initial stacks I pop Snake Hunter and start spamming mongoose bite until about 1 sec left on my Mongoose window which usually gives me about 9 total mongoose attacks in total on top of the lacerate, SS, and caltrops damage going off. and with 1 second left I eagle's fury and can maybe get off another mongoose bite before the window fully runs out leading to 10 mongoose bites, 4 of which are at 6 stacks with the damage boost from aspect of eagle and are hitting like trucks. I'm usually peaking around 3 million and sustain anywhere from 1.3-1.6 million.

It's still pretty clunky though. Just because you pop a 2 minute cooldown that gives an instant 3 MB stacks might make it seem a bit smoother, when you go back into that MB burst rotation 5 seconds later, you don't have that luxury.
And as KrayZee says it can be quite random. Sometimes you get 6 stacks and have enough time for 3-5 more MB in that window. Sometimes you struggle to even get to 5 stacks due to bad procs.

[Myta]

Please Blizzard, take out a lot of those hit shots and put more traps, exclusive cool traps, and give us the Lone Wolf talent please, SURVIVAL needs to be a SURVIVAL, without the pet, PLEASE. I want cobra trap, snake trap, some fucking bomb a fuck trap, something, give me 6 or 8 traps for me

Naw, Marks is the nopet option. Survival is all about meleeing with your pet.

[Deleted]

Why with a pet? Cant do it without the pet?

[Bepples]

No one is telling you to roll survival. You have two ranged specs, they should stay ranged. One melee spec isn't hurting you or anyone else.

How naive is this? Yes it IS hurting us because our favourite spec got removed to make it happen.

- - - Updated - - -

Why with a pet? Cant do it without the pet?

This sort of post is proof that melee Hunter is an oxymoron and people just want another clone warrior spec at Hunter's expense. A lot of Survival players are imploring Blizzard to remove the only aspect of the spec that still makes it remotely connected to the Hunter class.

[kasuke06]

I miss being the canny hunter with poisons, traps, explosives, and spoopy shadow magic. now I have a spear. and so much clunky bullshit that the spec really just comes off as "we couldn't think of another ranged artifact. just make them melee and give their formerly unique things to MM, but make them shit so that no good MM player will ever take them"

[threads]

How naive is this? Yes it IS hurting us because our favourite spec got removed to make it happen.

yea for some reason no current SV hunter understands this.

[Deleted]

This sort of post is proof that melee Hunter is an oxymoron and people just want another clone warrior spec at Hunter's expense. A lot of Survival players are imploring Blizzard to remove the only aspect of the spec that still makes it remotely connected to the Hunter class.

I'm saying get rid of the pet (with the lone wolf talent), take out some of the hits with the weapon and add more traps to the hunter. I don't want a warrior, i just want a SURVIVAL hunter, a guy who is a survival by himself.