Mutilate Compendium -out of date-

[Grindfreak]

The main reason I link straight to the front page of EJ's is because i'd rather have people browse the whole thing than to take a quick look at one corner of it.

And the information given here is spread all over EJ's aswell, they just happen to have a compilation thread aswell.

[danightryder]

http://www.roguerogue.com/ as the same info too

[GAfo]

We can also add, for non EJs, that ap is slightly better then agi (1.1) due to the poisons not being affected by the agi crit.
But probably you are going to write it down when you start explaining about gems :S

[winternights]

The rough draft is not counting AP but Strength at 1.1, and Str is affected by BoK.

If you're referring to that EP, AP is a bit lower but still in general better than Agi.

[GAfo]

We assume it as 1.1 just cause it's more then 1, so yea, still slightly better then agi

[NonMagical]

Though it is common sense you didn't spell it out like you did other things in the same section:

If your Rupture is about to drop (and HFB + SnD both have a significant amount of time remaining) pool your energy to renew it.

Also, since this is mostly a guide to people who are new to the spec / rotation you may want to explain why certain things are important along with the numbers you have already posted.

One area that comes to mind is you explained about the dodge % and expertise, but you didn't explain why a dodge is a big deal: Due to Envenom renewing SnD and the volatile nature of raiding Mutilate you may find yourself renewing a 2 or 3 second SnD and if it doesn't land it you risk dropping SnD and suffering a (sometimes) substantial DPS loss.

[danightryder]

We can also add, for non EJs, that ap is slightly better then agi (1.1) due to the poisons not being affected by the agi crit.
But probably you are going to write it down when you start explaining about gems :S

Even though ap is slightly better than agi point for point. After raid buffs agi pulls ahead since your raid buffs adds to your agility, (Totem of STR and mark of the wild) Then slap 10% increase (blessing if kings) on your agility and it pulls ahead. Not to mention Mutilate is a very crit dependant spec so you need that crit from agility to proc more combo points and energy from focus attacks.

So on the PVP side of things, if your not running with a teammate that has stat buffs it may be more benificial to stack some AP mixed in with your agility.

[GAfo]

Even though ap is slightly better than agi point for point. After raid buffs agi pulls ahead since your raid buffs adds to your agility, (Totem of STR and mark of the wild) Then slap 10% increase (blessing if kings) on your agility and it pulls ahead. Not to mention Mutilate is a very crit dependant spec so you need that crit from agility to proc more combo points and energy from focus attacks.

So on the PVP side of things, if your not running with a teammate that has stat buffs it may be more benificial to stack some AP mixed in with your agility.

no.

Even fully buffed ap > agi for max DPS.
This count the increased % of all the buffs, and the dps you loose from poison due to having half of the ap and 0 crit.
It's already been calculated, and as I said in other post, you can check it yourself using the spreadsheet.

And no, i'm not saying agi is garbage, i'm just pointing out that if you want that 1-2 dps more, you should put ap instead of agi, agi will nowhere increase your dps(i mean not as much as ap), just your avoidance.

[Grindfreak]

I will add more to this tomorrow, and I have been modifying texts where I've found it to be necessary,
Thanks for any suggestions, and please do keep them coming, I desided to Sticky this thread myself.

If you have any ideas you want implemented, you can suggest them here, or PM me.

[Hammond]

Just wanna thank you for summerisng DPS for Muti in an amazingly clean way

Just come back to playing rogue and needed to catch up on what was happening

this helped me alot and i am looking forward to see what other stuff you can find

thanks again m8 <3

[Grimmauld]

Good summary of the EJ material.

You might want to add a note about weapon speed for new players/people unfamiliar with mutilate mechanics. Namely, that in PvE Fast/Slow is superior to Slow/Fast and Fast/Fast is superior to everything (This assumes the same DPS on both weapons).

[Grindfreak]

Good summary of the EJ material.

You might want to add a note about weapon speed for new players/people unfamiliar with mutilate mechanics. Namely, that in PvE Fast/Slow is superior to Slow/Fast and Fast/Fast is superior to everything (This assumes the same DPS on both weapons).

Good idea, I'll add it tomorrow.

[Neeklus]

Five stars.

I've picked up two daggers at the mid 70's point (74 actually) and am wondering if it's worth speccing mutilate. Is it more efficient (for single target ownage) or will Combat see me through until 80?

[Roar]

Not sure, you've said you gonna add it or not..
but you should add information about what glyphs etc to use as mutilate.

--
Here's a short cut to the pocket guide at elitist jerks:
http://elitistjerks.com/f78/t37183-pocket_guide_wotlk/
--

Glyphs

Nothing too special here, but the following glyphs are the best ones depending on your build.

[Glyph of Sinister Strike] (not needed for Mutilate builds)
[Glyph of Slice and Dice]
[Glyph of Rupture]

[couplemate]

Not sure, you've said you gonna add it or not..
but you should add information about what glyphs etc to use as mutilate.

--
Here's a short cut to the pocket guide at elitist jerks:
http://elitistjerks.com/f78/t37183-pocket_guide_wotlk/
--

I would be highly surprised if there were rogues that did NOT know that the glyphs mentioned are basically :S the ONLY pve DPS inc glyphs ...

Ohhh btw Did you know that Glyph of Vigor gives you 10 free nrgy ?!??!?!?!?!?!
I cannot believe how many rogues have asked me about THAT "Why doesn't my glyph of vigor give me the 10energy it say???" "Did you take the talent Vigor....... did you READ the glyph?"

/sigh


I'd love there to be some sort of Mutilate Glyph on par with the Sinister strike one, I mean GOD thats a good glyph, one I'd deem mandatory for ANY SS spammin spec its ALMOST a 1/2 seal fate for free..... 2.5talents for free xD lol and it was buffed :O (40 to 50%) I'm not saying copy it for mutilate, I'm saying maybe something just as strong maybe LOL.

[Grindfreak]

personally I run with SnD, Rupture and Sinister Strike

in my mutilate build, I generally swap to combat for Sartharion with drakes, and
Malygos.

[Grimmauld]

I think what the Mutilate community should be most looking for is a glyph associated with Envenom or Deadly Poison. There has been a lot of talk about a glyph that would let you use Envenom without dropping your DP stacks. That is my personal hope for an new Assassination glyph.

[danightryder]

I think what the Mutilate community should be most looking for is a glyph associated with Envenom or Deadly Poison. There has been a lot of talk about a glyph that would let you use Envenom without dropping your DP stacks. That is my personal hope for an new Assassination glyph.

As good as that glyph sounds, if that was to happen i think people might drop rupture from their rotation and spam envenom every 4-5 combo points since you can generate the combo points so fast. A 4-5 Point envenom can crit anywhere between 8-12k depending on trinket/enchant procs or type of mobs (murder talent) So I think i'd drop rupture from my rotation and just envenom unless they decide to buff rupture somehow. It would be HUGE dps increase but not one that blizz would favor. Thats just my opinion i could be looking at it wrong though, who knows. But it does sound nice. Until then, I use Garrote, rupture, SnD Glyphs.

[Grimmauld]

It would certainly change up the mechanics. I have my doubts that it would really remove Rupture from the rotation, but it's very possible given all the instant poison procs you could get with the Envenom buff up all the time. If Rupture did become obsolete, I wouldn't be opposed to removing a couple points from Cut to the Chase and putting them elsewhere, since so many Envenoms should take care of refreshing SnD even if it's doesn't do it 100% of the time.

As for glyphs, I use SnD, Rupture, and Vigor. I picked up Vigor the other day for a little burstiness on trash and whatnot. It also helps out in fights like Malygos where your energy tends to regen to full without you being able to attack.

[Deogii]

is there anyway u could also put in the list of top dps daggers like top 5 or something....like i kno wd is best id like to kno what i should be aiming for and see where SR is in that list too if it is...