Marrowgar, Icecrown Citadel, Blue posts

[Samin]

So you are SUPPOSED to carry pugs and have a wipefest?

How do you carry pugs? You one-man the raid while all other 24 do nothing and are getting carried?
If you mean the gearscore, the comment was mainly to people who want Epic-achievement for heroics and do gearchecks for heroic daily. you know..because violet hold is srs bsns on heroic.

[Bowen]

They dislike people actually have to move with the times to find decent people, yet they can't see the problem that they have created with the easy access :S

[Deleted]

Oh look, merely a setback again.
Do any major character ever fucking dies anymore in WoW?

The "merely a setback" joke is getting annoying, especially on a world full of magic, demons and necromancers.

It's the Lich King, the most powerful necromancer in Azeroth. Bringing dead people back is his job.

[Wrinkle]

I like the fact that the video didn't have music and included the vent sounds. More educational than any heavy metal backed boss kill.

[Deleted]

They already confirmed at BlizzCon that Bolvar will be one of the bosses in icc...

[Deathcold]

Someone would be better off writing an "achievement score" addon.
Check what instance the player has done, and how long ago those were. Based on that you'd know at least what he's got experience with.

Then, check the number of kills and use that to produce a number in tandem with gear score and you'll get a much more accurate reading than just the gear score alone.

BE IMBA does something like this, it keep track all raid kills you have. It dont give points for it, but you can check it out.

[Kalx]

I guess we actually SAVE Bolvar from Deathbringer Saurfang, or something
considering the Deathbringer Saurfang was already datamined, except if Blizz changed their minds, Bolvar won't be an actual boss =p

[Deleted]

Great to see other people than me on this site, who is fan of the serie "Heroes"

[Ringthane]

So you are SUPPOSED to carry pugs and have a wipefest?

Yep. I'm sorry that you might have to work a little harder than "AOE lol AOE lol AOE lol LOOT". If that's too hard for you, there's always a game of Scrabble going online if you look for one.

The rest of us - the actual players - would love to go back to the days when there was still a little challenge to things.

[VanishO2]

So, Horde fights a still not fully converted Bolvar and saves him.

And at the same time, unfortunately, Alliance fights an alread converted and without hope of saving Saurfang Jr. (Deathbringer Saurfang) and that pisses the Horde (Garrosh) keeping the conflict up for Cataclysm?

LoL

[halendor]

Icecrown Citadel - Save the Paladin, Save the World

Hah. An obvious Heroes reference "Save the cheerleader, save the world"

[lmh86]

If that's too hard for you, there's always a game of Scrabble going online if you look for one.

You're suggesting that being good at Scrabble is easier than being good at WoW? lol

[Mascotte]

So you are SUPPOSED to carry pugs and have a wipefest?

If your that awesome go find a guild so you can be with awesome people like you and get your awesome loot from awesome hard modes and stay far away from pugging in general.

O wait, no that doesn't make sense, pugging should be exclusive to the guys that have no use for the loot any more!

[Eyetotem]

Ultimately, we're really not that interested in trying to shut mods like this down. Players will always have the Armory and to a lesser extent Inspect with which to judge other players.



On the one hand, we can recognize that there is value in being able to determine if that guy you are considering for your pug is much less experienced and talented than he claims to be and is going to drag everyone else down and cause other players to leave.

Because we ALL know gear=talent.

This is where account achievements, such as have you completed 10 man Naxx would be nice. That way PUGs would not say "Link Achievement" before going to a CoS run.

[Nekosom]

I dunno who couldn't have seen Bolvar still being alive, it was obvious during the encounter with Alexstrasza right after the Wrath Gate incident.

The surprise isn't that Bolvar is in Icecrown..it's that he hasn't been turned yet. The assumption has been that Saurfang the Younger and Bolvar were turned into Death Knights, and while that seems to be true of Saurfang, Bolvar may yet be saved.

What I find interesting is the Lich King's search for a new champion. Was it not originally the intention of Ner'zhul to merge with Arthas, but merely did it out of necessity? Given that the Lich King now has a body, why does he have a need for a new champion? It seems silly to me that the Lich King would need a new Arthas, when the old Arthas is more badass than ever. It just seems like an unwilling participant such as Bolvar would make a poor champion, seeing as many of the Lich King's most powerful followers are the willing. Unless of course he's meant as a lure. Hmm, I wonder?

[bloodwine77]

My biggest beef with gearscore checkers is I have met my fair share of horrible players in ToC10/25 level gear.

I've been in H ToC 5-man pugs where we wipe and fail multiple times when both the tank and healer are 4500+ gearscores (scores are according to the in-game addon).

There have always been players that do better jobs with less gear. Some players just know their class more than others and can squeeze out more of their characters. Also, many players are lazy or do not keep up with current trends and perform in a lackluster fashion. I'd go as far to say that I've met enough bad players at 4k+ gearscore that gearchecking is fairly worthless except to keep a 2-3k gearscored person out of ToC10/25, or to keep a fresh 80 from tanking VoA or Onyxia. Things of that sort.

I have seen crazy requirements in trade chat for raids, like "MUST DO 4K+ DPS FOR NAXX10 RUN!! PST WITH ACHIEV!!". At first thought you think they are on a badge farm run and want to get it over with, but the reality is in many cases they are trying to find others to carry the slack and the rest of the fail raid.

[DrgnDancer]

So you are SUPPOSED to carry pugs and have a wipefest?

They aren't talking about people checking out gear scores and achievements and making reasonable intelligent decisions about who gets into your progression raid. They're talking about "OMG, why is this guy tanking H-Nex with a 2100 GS? He's horrible! Why I had to cast two whole heals on him during that trash pull!" I've seen this myself. My alt is a druid, and her off spec is tanking. Now, as the off-spec of an alt, her tanking gear is unsurprisingly lack luster. It's not awful (and it's getting better), but it's not fantastic either. I've actually had PuGs comment about how she *only* had 31K health (closer to 35K now, but this was a few weeks ago) tanking H-VH.

I mean seriously. It wasn't all that long ago that most people were in half blues-half purples, Naxx25 gear was the shit, we *drooled* over a tank with >30K health in a PuG, and we were doing the SAME content. Half blues-half purples is pretty much acceptable gear up through Naxx 10. If the rest of the raid is strong then carrying someone in ALL blues through Naxx10 is no big deal (My guild got the 8 man achievement a few months ago on a mostly alt run. We had two guys below 2K DPS, and my druid's heal set at the time was as bad or worse than her tank set is now. We has three or four mostly Ulduar geared people that kept things from falling apart). Naxx25 gear acceptability runs at "mostly heroic purple".

Doesn't mean you need to bring a guy in all blues on your ToC run, or even your Ony run, but people are getting ridiculous about gear score.


On the Bolvar issue, I see this going one of three ways. Either both Horde and Alliance are trying to rescue Bolvar (for their own reasons) and Saurfang the Younger is the "Greatest Deathknight"; both Saurfang and Bolvar are still alive and get converted at the last minute then each faction has to fight the opposite faction's hero; or each faction has to fight their OWN faction's hero to save the other faction's hero. The second one could go a long way to helping Blizz get the whole faction war hinted at in Cataclysm going. Horde is forced to Kill Bolvar and/or Alliance is forced to kill Saurfang Jr. and the opposite faction misunderstands. Much hilarity ensues as the Lick King manages to start a very destructive cross faction war even as we're killing him. I think the first option is most likely though. There's a good balance with the LK trying to replace Tirion with Bolvar as his champion. Both are Paladins as Arthas was in his former life.

[Ffamran]

No Saurfang Jr? I swear on the Wrath Gate that Bolvar doesn't die to the Lich King, but Saurfang Jr does, and has his soul drawn into the Lich King's runeblade... bleh, I don't get this.

[Zlodo]

The "merely a setback" joke is getting annoying,

Agreed, hence my post.

especially on a world full of magic, demons and necromancers.

This seems contradictory with what I quoted above.

[rhorle]

I'm glad bolvar is back, and I expected him to be. As others have said wrathgate video made as much clear and the quests afterwards with the dragon queen. The bolvar story is the best story of wotlk and definitely made me happy to be alliance experincing it from setting foot up to the wrathgate ending.

As for why the lich king is looking for a new champion when he has arthas is because champion does not equal a new host. It merely means a leader of the troops, exactly what all his other famous death knights were. Except this one is to be better then the rest. Tirion wasn't going to become the new lichking but he was going to become nearly as powerful if he was corrupted.