Divine Intervention, the oddball Paladin spell

[bluepencil]

After reading the Cataclysm Holy Paladin discussions... the mechanics of DI appeared in my head.

"Divine Intervention - The paladin sacrifices himself or herself to remove the targeted party member from harm's way. Enemies will stop attacking the protected party member, who will be immune to all harmful attacks but will not be able to take any action for 3 min."

We all know what pallies use DI for: Primarily to save yourself repair costs during a wipe, and secondarily to save someone else repair costs during a wipe. Occasionally for faster raid recovery (it's getting more so that running back in is usually as fast or faster).
Obviously that doesn't really sound right; kinda like saying: Believe in the Light and save some munnies!

What was the intent of Divine Intervention in the first place?
To save a paladin and his chosen target some gold?
A raid recovery tool from times past where people had to spend a long time running back?

So far, it seems that DI is an extremely rare skill that you use when the raid is guaranteed a wipe. It is an "ohshit" button in the sense that: "ohshit wipe incoming time to save some gold". It has no real combat benefit, and even when some paladins creatively used it to remove Saurfang's Mark in ICC, Blizzard has made known that DI was not intended to be used in such a fashion.

My point of discussion: Do any pallies here use DI for any other purposes? What do you think DI's purpose is, should be, or can be?

[morechezzez]

My point of discussion: Do any pallies here use DI for any other purposes? What do you think DI's purpose is, should be, or can be?

exploiting fights like yogg?

[belfpala]

If we could go back in time, I would say DI should do exactly what Guardian Spirit from the Priest Holy tree does. Because that's no longer possible, I have no idea.

[Posid]

Well originally it had a 1 hour cooldown and was used to save people from running back (note it took a long time to run back in instances like MC, BWL and AQ40).

I used to use it in BGs a lot in a fight that was more or less a lost cause, hordes didn't have paladins so they were pretty much wtf when they saw the spell, and often bought you a few moments for others to come help prevent the cap.

As for now it saves me and a target of my choosing a repair bill when the raid leader calls wipe

I kind of like it, I've had a lot of fun with it both in vanilla and in WotLK. I like that every spell doesn't have to have a completely obvious use, and spells that you can have a bit of fun with. So I wouldn't mind if it got left untouched with cata.

As for what it was intentionally made for, it was probably the first thing I said.

[Ronark]

From the idea's thread:

Divine Intervention
40 yd range
Instant 10 min cooldown
Reagents:
Symbol of Divinity
The paladin sacrifices 50% of <his/her> current HP to revive the targeted party member from death with 4800 health and 3525 mana. Enemies will not attack the protected party member, who will be immune to all harmful attacks for 6 seconds.


To bring DI "in-line" with other "wipe prevention tools", since we no longer have to run back through instances, it seems. Basically, a weaker BRez which also damages the paladin (instead of killing them).

[Elica]

I'm hoping to see this spell redesigned in expansion. It feels like a relic of ancient times and it is only used to save repair costs.

Perhaps it could be changed into a BoP type spell, but have it provide immunity to magic instead of physical damage for a few seconds. Of course it should apply forbearence and perhaps share a cooldown with Aura Mastery to prevent chaining silence immunity.

[Moshy]

Its like slow fall, levitate or water walking. It's just one of those abilities that don't really hurt any body and is used to not have to pay repair bills so much.
Night of wiping on LK? Coordinate divine intervention with another paladin and that night can go very smoothly for your repair bill
Seriously though there is 100% no need to change it, it's here and here to stay hopefully.

[twiztedreamz]

From the idea's thread:

great idea but i sense great qq among other classes "omg they gave pallies a brez can we has some to"

[bluepencil]

Exploits aside (seems like that's all DI is good for, before Blizzard steps in and nerfs corrects it), sacrificing oneself seems to be quite a big deal. Unlike Guardian Spirit, which occurs on death, DI is something you need to make a decision to use. It could be a really interesting mechanic, since nobody intends to die on purpose.
Something like using DI on someone would kill the paladin, but bubble the target for 12 seconds; basically sacrificing yourself to put Divine Shield on someone else. Perhaps this DI shield doesn't drop your threat, so you can cast it on the tanks. You still save yourself some gold if you wipe, but you add a little more utility to DI?

[Posid]

If they want to give us a battle res, why can't they do it with an entirely new ability? Paladins seem like the classes with the least abilities. While this spell might not have any combat use, it's still a fun skill to cock about with.

[Jack Daniels]

Prevent from flaming in all caps and bolded letters. ~Ron

[bluepencil]

From the idea's thread:

I actually kinda like the idea of "giving my life for someone else", feels like something a zealous paladin would do. It'd be fine if the DI killed the paladin, so it would have to be an intelligent on who to bring back. It would definitely be situational, like during a 5% zerg that doesn't need much healing you'd want to bring back a DPS... or to bring back a druid so he can battle res you later so you can both go on... etc.

I understand DI right now is a "playful" spell that we just like to fool around with, but at the cost of a life, it's pretty much more useless than water walking or slow fall.

[bluepencil]

NOT ALL ABILITIES IN THIS GAME WERE MADE TO EITHER HAVE A FULLY PERFECT PURPOSE IN BOTH PVP AND PVE. SOME ABILITIES ARE CLASS ICONIC, TO MAKE YOU FEEL LIKE YOU'RE PLAYING SOMETHING ELSE THAN A WARRIOR WITH MANA.

THESE THREADS MAKE ME WANT TO PUKE IN YOUR NECKS.

Hey angry dude, we know some abilities are iconic, but that's exactly what I'm talking about. Is killing yourself to save some repair costs an iconic Paladin trait? Maybe it would be if Goblins could be paladins... ;D

[Elixor]

"My son, "kough"... I wished I could continue to journey with you... But it seems Hogger was of greater strength than the damn farmers told us "kough". But you my son... You shall shall not be harmed... You shall find Mankrik´s wife in due time "kough" Farewell........ /cast Divine Intervention.

[Ridesdel]

"My son, "kough"... I wished I could continue to journey with you... But it seems Hogger was of greater strength than the damn farmers told us "kough". But you my son... You shall shall not be harmed... You shall find Mankrik´s wife in due time "kough" Farewell........ /cast Divine Intervention.

"NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO! FATHER, WHY!!!!!???? Wait.... I don't even know you!"

[Leidus]

From the idea's thread:

Turning DI into a battle rez would be really nifty, and it is about time they spread that out to another class.

Plus, bringing someone back to life at a crucial point during a fight against a great evil would definitely be an intervention of the divine, fulfilling the needs of the angry dude and others that would want this to still have an iconic feel. To be honest, killing myself to save someone isn't Divine Intervention, it's me intervening...

PS. My repair bills hate me for siding with people who'd want to change DI.

[Talen]

From the idea's thread:

Still like it.

I could see this as a talent in the holy tree rather than abseline skill though.

Maybe make Holy Shock baseline as a Paladins mid heal, move DI down and put this DivInt in the gap?

EJL

[Talen]

PS. My repair bills hate me for siding with people who'd want to change DI.

Paladins are supposed to make sacrifices.

EJL

[Bananengurke]

brezzes another player costing 90% of the player's health but also creating a debuff that increases dmg taken by 40%, decreases dmg and healing by 40$


ie not for tanks and only in special situations

[Xiphias]

I like the battle res idea, ESPECIALLY the "the target is immune to all damage and is ignored by enemies for 6 seconds" part... being battle ressed sucks when the druid does it over fire.

Just make the cast time a little long (but please don't make it a Holy-only talent.. if the cast time is long enough, Ret won't want to cast it, and a tank can only cast it if they aren't tanking at the time -- after all, any druid (save a tank druid?) can theoretically pop out a battle res...) and perhaps make it cost the Paladin 50% of their health.

I'd like battle res being available to other classes. It's sort of like the bloodlust thing... though with Druids, they have all sorts of reasons to be brought to raids already. (And it's irritating when half the druids die, so the first half of the druids waste time battle ressing the other half of the druids, who then battle res the members who were actually contributing... heh)

Perhaps they'll just take battle res out completely, instead. I'd be okay with that, too. It just seems like such a super-handy tool... it's saved more raid wipes than Divine Intervention has (well, that just helps you retry faster; battle res has actually recovered from potential wipes, due to a mispositioned tank, or bad timing on healer incapacitation, or whatnot)...

Just my two cents on the matter...