Cataclysm Raid Progression Refinements

[Jimmy Hughes]

As a mage in a STRICT 10 MAN ONLY raiding guild based on progression.. this is awesome! We finally get the same quality of items just because we choose to raid in a smaller unit.


What i'm worried about is "10 and 25 man raids will be the same difficulty", some encounters in 25 man features could become pretty challenging with only 10 players.

toravon for example... does this mean the 10 man encounter would have 3 frost orbs to deal with? little things like that would make 10 man seem even harder than 25 man

[Netherinfern0]

Hmmm read the post all you tards, 6 boss raids?, ZA, ZG comes to mind... 4/3 day reset... Hmmm, Think before 'OMFGACCOUNTCANCELLOMGGGGGGGG'

[PrettyBiased]

I'm actually pretty cool with some of this. I don't care that 10 man heroic drops the same gear as 25 heroic if both of them are extremely challenging for their size of group. I wish they addressed reusing weapon name skins and models though, it really, really needs to award unique items for heroic mode.


The worst part of this? They think gating is good and want to keep using it


MAKE YOUR CONTENT CHALLENGING AND IT WILL GATE ITSELF, STOP RELEASING RUBBISH THAT IS QUICKLY BEATEN AND QUICKLY FORGOTTEN SO YOU'RE PLACING BRICK WALLS BEHIND EVERY BOSS SO WE CANNOT PROGRESS. If you continue gating my instance I am going to gate my payments to you, you'll get my 15$ when you allow the next boss to be attempted

[Fuzzzie]

I never liked the whole, run 25 man then do it all over again in 10 man. It burns you out from the content too fast. I would rather see 2-3 raids and get them done than have to sit around running the same crap 2-3 times a week. If it means I end up only raiding for 3 days a week I can live with that.

[vendelin]

Totally off-topic but Deviltry, you got THE best Sig-Avatar combo!

[DaGhostDS]

the only problem i see is the lack of raid to do when one is completed

[aduroris]

you're fucking bad. just shut the fuck up, you fucking baddie. I CAN"T BELIEVE THE IGNORANCE. "Hi im a baddie, and i have no skill. i should get 25 man loot in a 10 man because i don't have the situational awareness or skill to live through a fight in 25 man. PLZHELPKTHX"

i think im about to actually rage quit.....

I think it's actually quite the opposite. In 10-man raids there is much less room for error. One person dies, there's a great possibility for a wipe. One or two people die in a 25-man, I don't think it makes _that_ big of a deal.

[Captdeadman]

I can already predict what threads will be made a few weeks after Cataclysm comes out...
"In WoTLK, at least 25 mans were harder, and gave better loot"
"In WoTLK, you could run 25 mans with the guild, and do 10 mans with friends"

[Deleted]

So is it only me who think its bullshit that they now want to make same lockouts for 10 and 25 man raids?
I mean whats the point in that? why cant we be able to go into 10 and 25 man as we want instead of choosing if we want to go 10 og 25?
I know that with the same loot in 10 and 25 man the same lockout isnt going to be a problem, but i would just still have the option to acturally choose if i wanna go 10 and 25 man.

For me these news are really shitty

[Deleted]

hurrrr guild leveling will save us duuurrrr

When Guild Leveling rewards, for example, Epic recipes to be used only on the guild, I have no doubt that those with the chance of doing 25 will continue to do. Since they are still better rewarded than everyone else.

[Coldkil]

you're fucking bad. just shut the fuck up, you fucking baddie. I CAN"T BELIEVE THE IGNORANCE. "Hi im a baddie, and i have no skill. i should get 25 man loot in a 10 man because i don't have the situational awareness or skill to live through a fight in 25 man. PLZHELPKTHX"

i think im about to actually rage quit.....

so you have both LKH25 kill and the frostwyrm huh?

[tjkiler]

like some1 on guild forum sad how are they going to make 10 and 25man the same difficulty?! they gona shrink the room size in 10man?! they gona put a slow effect on all the players in there too? wtf

[trilog]

btw another thing which will fuck off many ppl.

U have 30 ppl in the guild, 2-3 ppl cant come to raid 2-3 ppl have to sit out. Now this 2-3 ppl could at least raid 10 mans with their guild, the next day or after the raid. What will those ppl do in Cataclysm? =)

this is how it was in TBC and vanilla you idiot. the only people upset about this change are those who fail at basic math (even with a 1/5 ratio, a 25m still gets more loot over the course of a month as show earlier) but who have only raided in WOTLK and therefore are bad and horribly casual by default.

this is a great change.

[Downwithopp]

As a mage in a STRICT 10 MAN ONLY raiding guild based on progression.. this is awesome! We finally get the same quality of items just because we choose to raid in a smaller unit.


What i'm worried about is "10 and 25 man raids will be the same difficulty", some encounters in 25 man features could become pretty challenging with only 10 players.

toravon for example... does this mean the 10 man encounter would have 3 frost orbs to deal with? little things like that would make 10 man seem even harder than 25 man

People who say they play in a 10 man focused on progression are generally terrible.

[pilch]

FAIL

[VanishO2]

About time 10 and 25 shared lockouts... now the "10 man progression or 25 progression, your choice" will exist.

But...

By dropping the same loot, giving an extra "gold" isn't that much of incentive to do "more players to screw everything" 25man instead of a "safe" 10man. Unless they're drastically changing the way we can easily farm tons of gold without help of other 9 or 24 players. Also extra badges? Again, unless they drastically change the system (no more "emblems of latest tier" lolroics run? NO badges for 10mans since it will be easier to get gear with the higher chance of beeing the only one that can use the drop and easier overall raid system?), 2 or 3 extra badges isn't that much appealling too.

The extra items (since it shouldn't be higher ilvl drop to keep their new system balanced) will be mounts, pets and legendaries (really doubt they will give "Shadowmournes" to 10man raids)... mounts and pets aren't exactly what 100% of the community raid for... so...

All this won't stop the "roflstomp" 10man raid with 25man gear (actually would make it faster and easier) unless they can really get both 10 and 25 to match in dificult (as ppl alread said, it will be ALWAYS easier to control 10 ppl in a small room over 25 ppl on the same small room), be it having more boss abilities in 10 (weird) or changing the dungeon maps to match the number of players (imagine the frozen throne plataform even smaller for 10man) or whatever they can pull out (like using the same "they should have this set of buffs always" instead of "not every 10man have those, unlike 25, so we can't balance the 10 man encounter around having it, we need to make it easier", but unfortunatelly that means more homogenization between classes).

Also, that kills the "paragon and others will always stay 25 for the world 1st kills" if they succeed with the "10 = 25". Aren't they saying that dificult will be the same? Why a 25man kill would be worth more than the 10man kill? Worse if they throw just one "server 1st" for both 10 and 25 raids as suggested (aggree with a server 1st 10 and 25, not one feat for whoever kills it 1st, be it 10 or 25".

And, let's not forget that they want 10man to be puggable by Dungeon Finder... how the system can work if the 10man will be "harder"? Unless, of course, they change the system and their mentality.

[Shammywan]

This is an unbelievable low in Blizz's desires to change the game and not lose people due to being bored... If they truly want to change it, make 25 man way harder than 10 man, so that the ilvl difference is earned. Keeps undeserving people from farming the first bosses in 25 man too, as they will be easy again.

With these changes they have to either give bosses in 25 man less abilities, or lower the damage of the 25 man bosses; in either case 10 man will be more challenging for everyone except the healers and the raid leader.

So, who's is going to do the 25 man after a month of gearing up quickly? In 10 man you even have all the offspec gear for yourself if you take one of each class!

[Deleted]

Just wait until they remove raids and introduce only 5 man dungeons because they are easier to balance

[Hevesker]

QQQQQQQQ -om nom nom- QQQQQ -nom- QQq- eugh-QQQQ -cant eat anymore- QQQQ- tears-QQQ

[Progar]

Pretty fucking much.

the rise of the alts