Enh Shaman Boss opening

[Corixa]

just want to know how everyone does it.. my dps is always a bit lower than other shaman in the begining but i would catch up in the end...

what i do is speed pot (before combat), flame shock, wolves, totems (unless i can predrop it), heroism (if needed and if no other shaman do it), SR, then normal rotation..

[Baabinator]

That's all fine, but you shouldn't do wolves until you actually reach the target

higher percentage on the target = more dps (if they have to run a while towards it, you're losing out)

How i do it:
-drop SoE/flametongue totem thingie (while at far range)
-speedpot out of combat
-flame shock while closing in
-redrop totem (SoE-Windfury-searing-mana spring (or HST))
-now i've reached my target
-stormstrike
-drop magma totem
-wolves
-BL
-normal rotation

I don't use SR if i don't need the mana (don't have (2) set bonus yet ) else it's just a wasted GCD

[SolSphere]

Pot before combat
Stand just far enough out to where if I used FS, and ran in my GCD would just be over when I got to SS range.
Drop totems
Pop wolves
Hit up SR
Hero
SS and go

I don't know if that the best mathmatecally o not, but it's what I find the easiest to do,
and gives me the best chance of proccing MW5 the fastest imo.

So just about the same as you. I drop totems when i drop them because raid DPS increase over personal increase, and i want my wolves to have the best atk the entire tiem they are out anyway.

[Contion_BB]

Why are you all suggesting SR after Wolves... with the t10 set bonus...

You should pop any on use trinket and SR... before wolves cause if the set bonus procs it returns more DPS... since any stats increase you get gets applied to your wolves... if you pop that stuff after your wolves your wolves aren't getting the added stats.

[Araun]

Why are you all suggesting SR after Wolves... with the t10 set bonus...

You should pop any on use trinket and SR... before wolves cause if the set bonus procs it returns more DPS... since any stats increase you get gets applied to your wolves... if you pop that stuff after your wolves your wolves aren't getting the added stats.

are you sure clean %dmg is transfered to wolves as well?

[Contion_BB]

are you sure clean %dmg is transfered to wolves as well?

DO this little test... pull up your pet window (if you don't know how there is a script somewhere to activate it without your wolves out) go to a test dummy pull out your wolves and then SR...

then after that repeat the process but with SR (make sure your SR 2piece proced then pop wolves

you will notice a stats difference

I am trying to get the script but the EJ forums are not loading for me for some reason...


and Besides you should pop SR all the time on CD... don't wait till you NEED mana... cause them your ruining your chance to DPS more...

[Corixa]

hmm i thought wolves stats change dynamically with my stats (e.g. trinket procs) after summon, could be different with 2pc bonus?

[Contion_BB]

hmm i thought wolves stats change dynamically with my stats (e.g. trinket procs) after summon, could be different with 2pc bonus?

NO they don't change dynamically... and as proof... again pull up your pet window and pop your wolves and then pop a trinket or something...

the wolves are considered separate from the shaman... When a Paladin cast King or Might on a Warrior Class your Wolves get the buff... you aren't a warrior so...

[SolSphere]

Why are you all suggesting SR after Wolves... with the t10 set bonus...

You should pop any on use trinket and SR... before wolves cause if the set bonus procs it returns more DPS... since any stats increase you get gets applied to your wolves... if you pop that stuff after your wolves your wolves aren't getting the added stats.

because I know that wolves atk is dynamic with my own. So anytime that wolves are out after I have poped my SR T10 bonus they do not get it.

Wolves -> SR
Wolves will out last the duration of any other buff except totems
Therefore to get the most of the other CDs pop wolves first.

---------- Post added 06-16-2010 at 12:17 PM ----------

NO they don't change dynamically... and as proof... again pull up your pet window and pop your wolves and then pop a trinket or something...

the wolves are considered separate from the shaman... When a Paladin cast King or Might on a Warrior Class your Wolves get the buff... you aren't a warrior so...

Sorry for double post, but this is incorrect.
Wolves do scale dynamicly.
Fire elemental does not. (just sayin)

[Autonomy]

That's all fine, but you shouldn't do wolves until you actually reach the target

higher percentage on the target = more dps (if they have to run a while towards it, you're losing out)

How i do it:
-drop SoE/flametongue totem thingie (while at far range)
-speedpot out of combat
-flame shock while closing in
-redrop totem (SoE-Windfury-searing-mana spring (or HST))
-now i've reached my target
-stormstrike
-drop magma totem
-wolves
-BL
-normal rotation

I don't use SR if i don't need the mana (don't have (2) set bonus yet ) else it's just a wasted GCD

I find it amusing that you'd suggest not popping wolves until you're at the target - you do realize if you hit wolves and sprint in both you and your wolves get there faster? Not sure how, in any way, it would lessen the time they have on the boss considering they'd be sprinting AND jump to the target. It allows you to hit lust faster which benefits your raid more overall rather than waiting for that one extra GCD you need to use yourself before you can pop it. Not sure about you, but I'd prefer to run in 60% faster on a fight to get set up asap.. saves you more in the long run to already have your wolves out and attacking with sprint up, flame shock on the target as you sprint in, totems in the center for a fight like Rotface so you never have to move them, SR, speed pot, and either lust or make the ele shaman do it

[Baabinator]

I find it amusing that you'd suggest not popping wolves until you're at the target - you do realize if you hit wolves and sprint in both you and your wolves get there faster? Not sure how, in any way, it would lessen the time they have on the boss considering they'd be sprinting AND jump to the target. It allows you to hit lust faster which benefits your raid more overall rather than waiting for that one extra GCD you need to use yourself before you can pop it. Not sure about you, but I'd prefer to run in 60% faster on a fight to get set up asap.. saves you more in the long run to already have your wolves out and attacking with sprint up, flame shock on the target as you sprint in, totems in the center for a fight like Rotface so you never have to move them, SR, lust, and speed pot.

You are right about the wolves. My bad

[Wintermut3]

On a normal static DPS fight it would be:

Flame Shock whilst running in
Totems (excluding magma)
Wolves
SR
Magma
SS/allthatotherstuff

Always keep my normal totems and my magma on different keybinds to save mana and generally because it's a lot more handy.
Also magma will get benefits of SR.
Wolves and Totems might switch around depending on the distance of the boss.

[Nikoll]

You should keep magma on the other totems bind. That way on totem refresh you can refresh magma. Basicaly when your totems have 30 seconds or so left and it's time to dro magma you pop it all and refresh it in one gcd.

[Autonomy]

You should keep magma on the other totems bind. That way on totem refresh you can refresh magma. Basicaly when your totems have 30 seconds or so left and it's time to dro magma you pop it all and refresh it in one gcd.

It goes both ways, sometimes it's helpful but most of the time it's not.

[Wintermut3]

I'd rather spend a GCD than an extra 1k mana every 18-20 seconds or when the boss repositions. Besides, I personally feel a lot more comfortable knowing exactly when and where I pop my major totems, rather than pumping them out every now and then.

[Autonomy]

So plan ahead. On a fight like Blood Queen, after the fear, drop your totems running back in. It's not hard to know how far out you can drop them to still be in range. In that situation you're not necessarily wasting a GCD because you would've been doing nothing running back in, and it doesn't hurt to redrop them all after dropping tremor.
As for the extra 1k mana part.. if you're honestly having mana problems then dropping magma is not your main issue. There are just times where dropping your totems as you're running in or out is more convenient than anything else and at that time, you would not want magma down because that would also just be a waste of mana. To me, it sounds like you're too meticulous about placement and waste your time by not setting up early.

[Wintermut3]

I think I might have worded myself a bit weird/wrong. What I mean is that I have them on separate keybinds just because I am planning ahead. It's not always the best possible situation to have my major totems in melee range, hence why I prefer the option of dropping my major totems separately from my magma. I might have made it sound like I never re-pop my major totems until they're running out. Course I am repopping them as I properly should to accommodate to the fight.

As for the mana issue. It's not really an issue for me, but I like to have some room for error in case a SR gets interrupted in any way or badly timed.

All I meant to say is that I dont want to re-pop my water/earth/wind totems every 20 seconds when I'm renewing my magma totem, because I feel it's more convenient to have them separate, despite the possible DPS loss of using an extra gcd.

[Shallyah]

You should always use SR before anything else, specially if you're Haste pre-potting so you can take most advantage of it. Then pop totems, then Wolves, then Heroism.

Also, I'm not sure what are some people talking about keybindings and totems, but definitely should have a different keybinding for Magma Totem than the whole set. I don't have a totem set without Magma though, because most of the time you replace the totems it's good that you also replace Magma Totem, specially if you plan ahead and replace your totem set when your previous Magma Totem is about to run out. If not, you lost 1k mana. Big deal. Yet to find a situation where that brings me below 50% mana in 25 man.

[SolSphere]

You should always use SR before anything else, specially if you're Haste pre-potting so you can take most advantage of it. Then pop totems, then Wolves, then Heroism.

Also, I'm not sure what are some people talking about keybindings and totems, but definitely should have a different keybinding for Magma Totem than the whole set. I don't have a totem set without Magma though, because most of the time you replace the totems it's good that you also replace Magma Totem, specially if you plan ahead and replace your totem set when your previous Magma Totem is about to run out. If not, you lost 1k mana. Big deal. Yet to find a situation where that brings me below 50% mana in 25 man.

For reasons I posted above and because of our theorycrafted BiS priorty, this information is wrong.

Snagged from Elitist Jerks Forums

1)Maelstrom Weapon x 5 stacks - Lightning Bolt
2)Flame Shock
3)Stormstrike if debuff not active
4)Lightning Shield if not active
5)Fire Elemental
6)Magma Totem if not active
7)Spirit Wolves
8)Shamanistic Rage
9)Earthshock
10)Stormstrike
11)Lava Lash
12)Fire Nova
13)Magma Totem
14)Lightning Shield

Popping SR before, say, wolves, robs them of the added benefits of any time elapsed prior to them hitting the boss.


Example: (FAKE AS ALL GET OUT NUMBERS, BUT KEPT CONSISTANT)

pop wovles and they hit for 100 each swing and say 2 times a second (each)
working on a 1.5 GCD
SR lasts for 15 seconds
2 wovles in the fight

100 .5secs for 15 seconds = 3000 damage (base) x 2 (2 wolves) = 6000 damage x 2 (number of wolf CDs in the fight) =12000 damage (base)

pop Elemental Rage first (remember 1.5sec GCD)
SR is going tolast for 13.5 seconds for the wolves (right here I cold probably stop as I'm sure you notice why you don't pop it before wolves now...)
112 .5secs for 13.5 + 100 .5secs for 1.5seconds
3024 + 300 = 3324 x2 (2 wolves) = 6648
Wolves would be available again after 3 60 second periods (3 minutes) aligning it agin 1.5 seconds AFTER SR CD so it's safe to say we would be repeating this for the second wolves

6648 x 2 = 13296

pop Elemental Rage after wolves
SR is going total of 15 second for the wolves
112 .5secs for 15 secs = 3360 x2(2 wolves) = 6720 x 2 (nmber of CDs) = 13440

you lose 144 damage in the example with fake numbers. I would cry if my wolves only did 200 DPS =/
The harder they hit the more this number gets impacted. Their attack speed was probaly off as well, but again it was kept consistant, so the fact that you lose damage is still valid. And this is if you pop wolves at the earliest possible moment after you use SR on a 1.5 GCD. If you pop something else you would be losing another 1.5 seconds of wolves having Elemental Rage benefits.

No this is not some astronomical number, and for a couple of seconds it should not be, but fact is fact. And better is just plain better.


Wolves -> SR

---------- Post added 06-17-2010 at 08:50 AM ----------

As for the totem post up there as well. Put all the totems on one bar AND have a seperate binding for magma totem maybe? I am all kinds of confused when reading that up there so maybe this is what was meant anyway?