Question about Tiny Abom

[mushypeaz]

Guess I am just looking for some reassurance on this, but I am in a 25 man guild using EPGP, and the decision was made to give Tiny Abom to a frost DK who was aboove me on EPGP. I argued my case that the trinket was pretty much worthless for a Frost DK compared to the benefit a Ret Paladin would get from it.

My suspissions were confirmed later when on an entire blood prince council fight the trinket's proc accounted for a whole 25k damage. Here is my armory (sorry cant' post links yet)

eu.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Balnazzar&cn=Mushypeaz

As you can see I am using a DMC:G, so it would ahve been a pretty sizable upgrade, Do you think that common sense should rule over common sense , or am I shit out of luck here?

[Fornaw]

Unfortunately loot systems like EPGP are made because common sense is uncommon (legendary perhaps?). As far as I know that trinket is pretty horrible for a DK, but you joined a guild that doesn't council loot. There is no way to ask for special loot rules on one item which benefit only yourself without appearing greedy.

[Zortorai90]

but our DK knows better than that and would have passed :P

since when did that group of words work together?

[Jaesaces]

This is why I avoid melee classes.

[The10thacc]

Our guild use dkp
But no dk/warr would roll on that cuz they know we dont like playing with retarded ppl and they will just be Gkicked for not doing the theorycrafting about there class...

[Nikoll]

loot system aside, your master looter should have been smarter than that. its only good for ret, enh, and hugh end mute rogues.

[Euclio]

since when did that group of words work together?

Makes sense to me :\

[Fredzilla]

since when did that group of words work together?

That's a legit group of words, I don't know what you're talking about.

As far as your problem goes, I'd suggest joining a guild where people know what they're doing, which it seems those people don't since they're giving TAJ to a DK.

[Deleted]

out of curiosity, could someone please elaborate why this trinket is good/bad for the classes mentioned?
not a melee specialist here
first I thought it was bad for frost DKs because of DWing, then I read on and read it was bad for DKs and good for shaman.

[Nikoll]

out of curiosity, could someone please elaborate why this trinket is good/bad for the classes mentioned?
not a melee specialist here
first I thought it was bad for frost DKs because of DWing, then I read on and read it was bad for DKs and good for shaman.

its good for paladins, shaman, and mute rogues because it procs thier poisons (except instant), weapon imbues, and seals. other melee classes just proc the 50% damage swing. mute and enh stack it up very fast because it stacks with their fast weapon swings. ret stacks even faster because weapon hits, seals, blood corruption refresh, and specials all proc it.

[eylieen]

no.
taiaj originally procced off poisons, weapon enchant procs, seals, and enh weapon imbues, but they changed the entire games's proc mechanics in an attempt to normalise trinkets like that (and weapons like bryntroll). before the change the 264 taiaj was a 4-500 dps increase over death's choice for mut rogues, since we had an insane number of motes proccing from extremely high poison application chance. blizzard simply made all proc mechanics only proc off white swings, not weapon imbues, poisons, seals, plague strike's secondary effect, or anything else. the heroic taiaj is still BIS trinket for a lot of melee classes, but it became far less overpowered with this change. i dont play a dk, so i'm not going to comment on the viability of the trinket for frost, but i will state that the above information about motes proccing off weapon imbues, enchants, poisons, etc, is incorrect.
edit: scourge strike's secondary effect, not plague strike. again, dont play a loldk

[Foibles]

From my knowledge of the trinket's workings post proc change (like eylieen mentioned), the trinket is so good for Mut/Enh/Ret because so much of their damage comes from white hits and the procs and effects that come with white hits. Windfury attacks, Flametoungue procs, poison applications, seal hits, etc are so powerful for these classes. Frost DKs on the other hand, have incredibly fast swing speeds also, but we gain nothing more than a white hit+20% from Necrosis, and possibly a Blood Caked Blade application, which is a very low amount of damage.

Long story short, Mut/Ret/Enh do a majority of their damage from white hits and the procs off white hits, while DKs and Warriors gain most of their damage from yellow weapon strikes.

[Badpaladin]

This is what procs motes for ret:

Melee hit: 2x (damage, Holy Vengeance)
Melee crit: 3x (damage, Holy Vengeance, Vengeance )
Auto attack SoV proc hit: 1x (damage)
Auto attack SoV proc crit: 2x (damage, Vengeance)
DS or CS hit: 1x (damage)
DS or CS crit: 2x (damage, Righteous Vengeance application, not tick)
J hit: 2x (damage, J debuff)
J crit: 3x (damage, J debuff, Righteous Vengeance application, not tick)

Now when you consider that we literally double the value of the trinket by it proccing SoV(which won't proc a mote sadly), making the trinket worth 6-8% of our DPS with decent RNG, there is no reason to give it to any other class first, especially a DK.

[ammor]

Almost as bad as my alts guild(Which I don't raid with) they use EPGP, and they gave TinyAbom to a Kitty Druid, and DBW to an Enhance Shaman...lol? ><

[Deleted]

but we gain nothing more than a white hit+20% from Necrosis, and possibly a Blood Caked Blade application, which is a very low amount of damage.

you don't even gain either of those. you just have a melee hit for a few K damage.

[Nikoll]

no.
taiaj originally procced off poisons, weapon enchant procs, seals, and enh weapon imbues, but they changed the entire games's proc mechanics in an attempt to normalise trinkets like that (and weapons like bryntroll). before the change the 264 taiaj was a 4-500 dps increase over death's choice for mut rogues, since we had an insane number of motes proccing from extremely high poison application chance. blizzard simply made all proc mechanics only proc off white swings, not weapon imbues, poisons, seals, plague strike's secondary effect, or anything else. the heroic taiaj is still BIS trinket for a lot of melee classes, but it became far less overpowered with this change. i dont play a dk, so i'm not going to comment on the viability of the trinket for frost, but i will state that the above information about motes proccing off weapon imbues, enchants, poisons, etc, is incorrect.
edit: scourge strike's secondary effect, not plague strike. again, dont play a loldk

the change was to make poisons not proc motes for rogus and 90% sure to make instant poison not proc on the proc swing. enh still procs wf/ft and ret still procs seals.

[Deleted]

tiny abom as far as im aware still procc seals for ret and stack,s on practically everything we do including seal apllications it is not impossible for a ret to gain 3 of the 8 stacks needed for the extra hit with only one attak so for retri this trinket is hugely imbalanced and a huge dps increase over other trinkets

[Deleted]

well, TaJ is about as big a DPS increase for ret as DBW and STS for DK's, warriors, hunters and ferals.

[Nillo]

well, TaJ is about as big a DPS increase for ret as DBW and STS for DK's, warriors, hunters and ferals.

I think even if you still need the ArP to get capped they are not even half as much of a dps upgrade as TaJ is for us (e.g. checked one of my warriors yesterdays he'd only get a 50 dps increase over WFS 264 with STS 271 after regemming all the excess ArP to Str) => You do have a good reason to ragequit if anyone else but a Ret gets that trinket.

TaJ for ret:




DBW for Warrior:



And TaJ isn't even modeled for DKs in Rawr !_!

[Sindy]

Most trinkets are around a 3% dps increase, some as high as 5%. For Ret TAiaJ yeilds around 8-11%. Tiny abom for ret gives more dps than any one trinket, for any class.

Yeah, what the guy said above me lol.