Resto: Should Blizzard bring back Tidal Force?

[Staplecrab]

"Oh crap moar healz noaw!" button they can hit (Paladin's Avenging Wrath and Divine Favor, Priest's Power Infusion (disc) and Chakra (holy) and Resto Druid's Tree of Life).

Chakra is not big healing throughput cooldown like the other spells you listed. It would be better compared to keeping Water Shield on.

Resto Shaman are definitely in dire need of a decent PVE cooldown. I'd be interested in seeing something similar to PW:Barrier. Perhaps an earth totem reduces damage taken by the raid (or by those within it's radius) for a small amount of time. Or perhaps a talent that will stop the target of your earth shield from dying and restore them to 50% health once every 2 minutes similar to the way guardian spirit works (though that does seem a little passive for a big CD).

[Hypernetic]

Chakra is not big healing throughput cooldown like the other spells you listed. It would be better compared to keeping Water Shield on.

Resto Shaman are definitely in dire need of a decent PVE cooldown. I'd be interested in seeing something similar to PW:Barrier. Perhaps an earth totem reduces damage taken by the raid (or by those within it's radius) for a small amount of time. Or perhaps a talent that will stop the target of your earth shield from dying and restore them to 50% health once every 2 minutes similar to the way guardian spirit works (though that does seem a little passive for a big CD).

While defensive stuff would be nice, shaman have always been more about raw healing in my eyes. I think a throughput cooldown would be more fitting for the class.

[Deleted]

I Use it on atramedes in the air phase for the first kiter and to pull people from devouring flames in valiona and theralion when they mess up. But hey it's still fun for pulling guildies back when they think they are smart running faster than me : p.

I've used it in atramedes, but it's a bit of a double edged sword (at least in 10 man), yeah you pull them away from the fire... but you almost always pull them into the sound nukes that are landing meaning they pick up a ton of sound. We have an engy rogue as second kiter which means we can gong early and have him sprint around for ages with the fire without needing lifegrip.

I have used it on twins when people screw up, but it seems it gets more use as a someone else is bad recovery tool than something used in it's own right.

[Mojototem]

Having it back would give us an 'Oh shi-" macro that we need badly right now.
That being said though, I would rather see us be retuned so that we didn't constantly require emergency buttons:S

[Hypernetic]

I've used it in atramedes, but it's a bit of a double edged sword (at least in 10 man), yeah you pull them away from the fire... but you almost always pull them into the sound nukes that are landing meaning they pick up a ton of sound. We have an engy rogue as second kiter which means we can gong early and have him sprint around for ages with the fire without needing lifegrip.

I have used it on twins when people screw up, but it seems it gets more use as a someone else is bad recovery tool than something used in it's own right.

Be careful with rocket boots, if that's why you said "engy rogue". Our hunter popped his boots a few weeks ago and had a malfunction that shot him in the air. The laser promptly switched targets and owned my face.

[Icecx]

Reposting because I think it's very interesting:


Though it isn't a great asset, Spiritwalker's Grace is a cooldown. In my opinion, lower it's cooldown to compensate for it's lack of PvE viability and then add in one or two more cooldowns:

Tidal Force:
Instant Cast
3 Minute Cooldown
Increases your Critical Strike chance of your abilities by 20% for 20 seconds. Whenever you gain a critical effect from one of your healing spells while under the effects of Tidal Force, you gain mana equal to three charges of Water Shield.

and/or:

New Talent (replaces Ancestral Resolve in the tree, but moved down):
Each time you proc an Ancestral Spirit, you gain the Refreshed buff, which stacks up to five times. This buff reduces the damage you take while casting by 2% per stack.

Refreshing Shield:
Instant Cast
5 Minute Cooldown
Combines the strength of your Refreshed stacks to protect the target. When used, the target gains a Refreshing Shield, reducing incoming damage by 4% per stack of Refreshed on the Shaman, up to a maximum of 20%.

[Deleted]

Chakra is not big healing throughput cooldown like the other spells you listed. It would be better compared to keeping Water Shield on.

I know, it's already been said. In my defence I've been up for 36 hours without a break and have never played a priest... Thats my excuse for failing and I'm sticking to it!

[akami]

While I do agree that Restoration needs another cooldown, I don't think Tidal Force is going to cut it. Oh yay I get maybe 2 crits? Yeah that's not really on par with other big cooldowns like Tree of Life or Guardian Spirit.

I agree with pretty much EVERYTHING Radux has said thus far. Instead of repeating I will simply say people on this thread should understand what he's saying because if you disagree you're awful.

[araine]

When the majority of raids build their healing group around mana tide I have to disagree with you.

And bring the MTT buff to someone else in the raid and you have than zero reason to bring in a resto shaman since they are god awful right now

[Jademist]

A brief comparison:

Paladins:
Divine Favor
Avenging Wrath
Divine Shield
Divine Protection

Priests:
Desperate Prayer (Holy/Disc)
Guardian Spirit (Holy)
PW: Barrier (disc)
Pain Suppression (disc)

Druids:
Barkskin
Tranquility
Tree of Life

Shaman:
??????

To answer the OP; Something would be better than nothing.

We have.....
That insta-cast one and Mana tide.
Yeah.
That. lol

[akami]

What they need to do is give shamans another group heal that isn't horrible. Priests have circle of healing, Prayer of healing, and prayer of mending. Shamans have a shitty chain heal and healing rain, which is useless unless you're two healing or 3 healing with 2 bad healers. (useless as in everyone is topped off and most of the 10k mana heal is converted to over healing.... yes i play with a priest and a paladin and POH = healing rain being useless). We don't need a shitty cool down increasing our crit.... We either need 1. A cooldown decreasing the cast time of our abilities by 20% and reducing the mana cost... maybe even something like paladin divine illumination..... or 2. a GOOD group heal 3. Ancestral awakening to not be horrible 4. another hot or increasing the instant heal effect on riptide by a LOT and an increase in the HoT amount...... the list could go on for days.

I have a 4/12 hm shaman, a disc priest, and a resto druid - all geared and all tested in raids. Currently NOTHING a shaman has can compared to a disc priest... or a holy priest for that matter. I don't need mana tide on my druid or my priest and my HPS and healing capabilities on both classes is significantly better compared to my shaman. Other than chain heal / healing rain a shaman needs to sit there single target healing the entire raid, unless people are positioned for healing rain and or chain heal. Regardless with the new MTT and chain heal still being horrible it's not even worth using CH in ten mans IMO. Healing rain is 10k mana and most of it is useless when 3 healing. We need something like prayer of healing, a hard instant heal hitting the entire group so that it would all be effective healing when used properly. Healing rain is supposed to be the signature shaman heal and IMHO it's just bad compared to what every other healer has as far as raid aoe healing goes. Need either a new aoe heal, another hot / instant heal, a mana reduction / mana regen cd other than tide, telluric currents giving 25/50% increased LB damage when specced into it for 1/2 points....... the possibilities are limitless but most likely none will be taken on by Blizz. Why? Because half of the buffs would be OP in PVP. (my unrealistic telluric currents buff for example). Oh well, reroll.

[Optimist]

I don't think you can really include Mana Tide in this solely because of the fact that Priests have Hymn of Hope. Now I understand that Mana Tide is more powerful, it's pretty much the same concept.

Regardless of whether it is a similar ability to another class, it's a cooldown ability that shamans have and it counts.

A brief comparison:

Paladins:
Divine Favor
Avenging Wrath
Divine Shield
Divine Protection

Priests:
Desperate Prayer (Holy/Disc)
Guardian Spirit (Holy)
PW: Barrier (disc)
Pain Suppression (disc)

Druids:
Barkskin
Tranquility
Tree of Life

Shaman:
??????

To answer the OP; Something would be better than nothing.

Well you also get self rez, meaning if you die you can come back potentially 2 times in a fight (if a Brez is used on you). Currently no other healer in-game has access to a self rez that doesn't burn the Soul Stone/Brez timer. Situational sure, but a dead healer doesn't help keep the raid alive.

[akami]

Regardless of whether it is a similar ability to another class, it's a cooldown ability that shamans have and it counts.




Well you also get self rez, meaning if you die you can come back potentially 2 times in a fight (if a Brez is used on you). Currently no other healer in-game has access to a self rez that doesn't burn the Soul Stone/Brez timer. Situational sure, but a dead healer doesn't help keep the raid alive.

Explain to me how having ankh makes up for being substantially limited as a healing class. Simply said, I do not die on any boss fight on my shaman and even if I died, on a HM boss lets say..... coming back with ankh would do little to save the raid considering you do not come back with a decent sized mana pool. Ankh is more important for... lets say an ENH shaman who can pop up and continue putting out damage to burn a boss.

[Herrenos]

Typing this list out for my own benefit mostly, but also because this thread has a lot of misinformation

All the healing/mana restoration cooldowns the healing classes have:

Shaman:
Nature's Swiftness - single instant cast greater heal
Mana Tide - raidwide spirit boost for mana regen on healers
sort of a healing cooldown: Spiritwalker's grace - cast healing spells while moving

Druid:
Tree of Life: 15% bonus healing for 25 seconds
Nature's switftness: a single instant-cast greater heal
Tranquility: Long-cooldown very high throughput channeled healing spell
Innervate: Self-only mana regen
sort of a healing cooldown: glyphed rebirth, with rezzed raid member at full health

Holy Priest:
Guardian Spirit: 40% increased healing on the target, plus will save the target from death while buff is active
Divine Hymn: Long cooldown very high throughput channeled healing spell
Hymn of Hope: Channeled mana return
Shadowfiend: Short-duration pet that restores mana per attack
Sort of a healing cooldown: Leap of Faith, pulling someone in danger of dying out of harm's way.

Discipline priest:
Power Word: Barrier: AOE bubble that reduces all damage taken by 30% and increases healing received by 10% when glyphed
Pain Suppression: Reduces damage taken by target by 40% for 8 seconds
Power Infusion: Decreases cast time and mana costs by 20% for 15 seconds
Archangel: Up to 5% mana back and up to 15% increased healing for 18 seconds
Divine Hymn: Long cooldown very high throughput channeled healing spell
Hymn of Hope: Channeled mana return
Shadowfiend: Short-duration pet that restores mana per attack
Sort of a healing cooldown: Leap of Faith, pulling someone in danger of dying out of harm's way.

Paladins:
Avenging Wrath: Increases Healing done by 20% for 20 seconds
Guardian of Ancient Kings: Short-duration pet that heals the raid for you.
Lay on Hands: Long-cooldown Instant-cast heal equal to paladin's max HP
Divine Favor: Increases healing done by 20% and crit chance by 20% for 20 seconds
Divine Plea: Self-only mana regen
Hand of Sacrifice: Redirection of damage to the paladin, effectively a damage reduction cooldown
Hand of Protection, the infamous bubble.

[Hypernetic]

Regardless of whether it is a similar ability to another class, it's a cooldown ability that shamans have and it counts.




Well you also get self rez, meaning if you die you can come back potentially 2 times in a fight (if a Brez is used on you). Currently no other healer in-game has access to a self rez that doesn't burn the Soul Stone/Brez timer. Situational sure, but a dead healer doesn't help keep the raid alive.

That's cool and all, but when you pop you have about enough mana to cast 2 heals or so which is about enough to heal yourself before the next burst of raid damage kills you.

[SuperNick]

I basically don't use or have a need to use Spiritwalkers grace in any fight. Yeah, I guess in atramedes you could partially justify it, but we all start moving in air phase and people take VERY little damage, if any.

Frankly I find it a waste of 3k mana and would rather my 3k mana than pretend it's a useful cooldown for resto.

[Revelations]

While I do agree that Restoration needs another cooldown, I don't think Tidal Force is going to cut it. Oh yay I get maybe 2 crits? Yeah that's not really on par with other big cooldowns like Tree of Life or Guardian Spirit.

I'd rather have Force back than... absolutely nothing. But you are right, that would not really be on par with the big cooldowns like ToL and GS - also considering Shamans are currently the worst healers in terms of raw HPS.. Don't see why Blizzard removed Force and replaced it with nothing.

[Hypernetic]

I'd rather have Force back than... absolutely nothing. But you are right, that would not really be on par with the big cooldowns like ToL and GS - also considering Shamans are currently the worst healers in terms of raw HPS.. Don't see why Blizzard removed Force and replaced it with nothing.

I honestly think they just screwed up. They were trying to find a way to make Spirit Link work during Cata development but couldn't (again). I feel like we are somewhat balanced around having an imbalanced CD like that. Or they simply had to work on other classes and never had the time to make a second pass on Shaman. We were the first class that they worked on in alpha, at least in the builds I tested, so it really seems like they took lessons learned from re-designing us and applied them to other classes, but forgot to apply them to us.

Hopefully, there are big changes on the way for 4.1, but I won't get my hopes up too high. I do hold out some hope that their complete silence in regards to Shaman is a sign that they are working hard on changes, but don't want to say anything until they are finalized. Of course the Shaman player in me feels that they just don't care and/or have no idea what they are doing.

[Eliot123]

I can already see how it is going to be for the next expansion, in talent previews out final talent shall be... Spirit Link!...aaaand then they'll just fail again and in the last 3 seconds before the release, make some random spell up.
Hope they have something prepared for the next patch. :/ Tidal Force would be nice but if anything, they should incorporate it into Nature's Swiftness.

[Teriz]

Druid:
Tree of Life: 15% bonus healing for 25 seconds
Nature's switftness: a single instant-cast greater heal
Tranquility: Long-cooldown very high throughput channeled healing spell
Innervate: Self-only mana regen
sort of a healing cooldown: glyphed rebirth, with rezzed raid member at full health

I want to add that ToL is a defensive and throughput cooldown. Not only does it boost healing, it increases the Druid's armor by 120%, gets them out of roots/snares, and increases the power of certain spells;

+15% healing done
+120% armor
Polymorph Protection
[Lifebloom] can be cast on unlimited targets
[Wild Growth] affects two more targets
[Regrowth] is instant cast
[Entangling Roots] is instant cast
[Wrath] has its cast time reduced

Honestly, its one of the best healing CDs in the game. Druids are stupid to hate on it.

Also glyph of innervate allows Druids to gain 50% of Innervate's effect when they cast it on someone else. So its not self only. Let's also not forget that Druid's lifebloom ability causes Replenishment.

When you look at that, Mana Tide doesn't compare. And no, I don't consider SWG a healing CD.