Explanation of 4.2 Balance Changes

[Thanntos]

These are not new nerfs/changes people, they have been listed for quite some time, this is just them explaining why they did what they did. (still disappointed with no news for Enhance thought this patch )

[Simca]

Not one melee class can get invulnerable for 8 seconds either. While the nerf may or may not be justified the comment doesn't make any sense the way you stated it.

Anyways overall just a bunch of non sense. Nerfing warriors for pve reasons when they were closest to keeping up with ranged dps. Brilliant idea. That had to be fixed - melee being able to keep up with ranged dps.

DKs have cooldowns are close to Paladins, Rogues, Warriors, Feral Druids, etc. It is pretty similar.

DKs did well in Arena before having 15% healing on half of their GCDs and they'll do fine without it.

[Deleted]

i made up an account just to give a comment on this thread.I agree with people about the CR and CoS nerf, CR wont really be on my bars, since i will be glyphing for CoS.As for warlocks, i might consider dropping affli completely. I am not a die-hard arena dude (yet) , but i was planning to be, and this sounds like less survivability for warlocks.As for the hunter nerf (i do not play a hunter myself), nerfing Multi-shot because it was "too easy to use"? Isn't Fan of Knives, Frost Nova and other multi-hitting abilities "easy to use"? Kinda lame ...Holy palas getting buffed - Good for the pallys, though, i havent really found it "easy" to kill a holy paladin yet, and some of the top healers in arena tournament atm, are paladins, shamans aand priests, so, PvP-wise, i think that paladins are equal to the rest of the healers, depending on the skill of the player.And nerfing basically all PvE content is just lame. Getting free epics isn't that fun, cuz' in the end, everyone will be too lazy to actually do anything, and you'll get epics even faster, with less effort.all in all abit disappointed, but it wont get me quitting ... yet.

[Nyoa]

So frost dk's were doing too much damage in pve? i call that bullshit until proved otherwise. Blizzards logic = if dk's are in 5% range to any caster they are doing too much damage

[Tarashan]

Hungering Cold was a useful interrupt and shortterm cc in pve. Now it is useless for either. And the change to dark succor makes death strike useless in pve. Gotta just love the changes. NOT Not even gonna start on the spriest changes. :/

[Simca]

So frost dk's were doing too much damage in pve? i call that bullshit until proved otherwise. Blizzards logic = if dk's are in 5% range to any caster they are doing too much damage

They were doing too much damage in PvP and were "middle-high" in PvE so they just simplified it and called it "too much damage in PvP and PvE". Makes it look better that way for them.

[Ryme]

Even the most articulate, logical, and passionate argument won’t always force our hand

Wow, surely the most logical argument that's articulated to it's utmost should ALWAYS change your stance and force change, else you're being wilfully ignorant or deceitful.

[Thunderstar]

I am new to posting on these forums, but I have been a long time WoW player. I never really look into reading why you make changes, I just go with the flow and learn to work around it. However, I do have a thought that you may or may not have thought about. I don't know how hard it would be to implement, but, with the tool-tip and the spell itself; you can have a 'to NPC / to Player,' tag. For example, I play a Boomkin, so my Wrath spell would look like this, 'Causes 675 to 761 Nature damage to the target NPC and 475 to 561 Nature damage to the target Player Character.' Or something along those lines. That way you can have the same spell for all classes, and keep PVE buffs/nerfs leveled out because each spell would be split into 2 different categories. So if a character is OP in PVE, you can nerf the PVE part, and keep the class viable in PVP and on-par with the other classes. You can balance out 2 different trees of each spell. This way would also require a lot of time going through every spell a class uses and splitting it in half however. But after that, I don't see a problem with it unless anyone else does. Thoughts?

[cFortyfive]

DKs have cooldowns are close to Paladins, Rogues, Warriors, Feral Druids, etc. It is pretty similar.

DKs did well in Arena before having 15% healing on half of their GCDs and they'll do fine without it.

I didn't argue on the latter but the former is simply wrong. Icebound fortitude has a 3 minute cooldown with 20% damage reduce and is the weakest ability of this kind in game. AMS while being great has a damage cap and doesn't work against physical.

So frost dk's were doing too much damage in pve? i call that bullshit until proved otherwise. Blizzards logic = if dk's are in 5% range to any caster they are doing too much damage

well obviously warriors suffer from the same fate.

[Deleted]

I am new to posting on these forums, but I have been a long time WoW player. I never really look into reading why you make changes, I just go with the flow and learn to work around it. However, I do have a thought that you may or may not have thought about. I don't know how hard it would be to implement, but, with the tool-tip and the spell itself; you can have a 'to NPC / to Player,' tag. For example, I play a Boomkin, so my Wrath spell would look like this, 'Causes 675 to 761 Nature damage to the target NPC and 475 to 561 Nature damage to the target Player Character.' Or something along those lines. That way you can have the same spell for all classes, and keep PVE buffs/nerfs leveled out because each spell would be split into 2 different categories. So if a character is OP in PVE, you can nerf the PVE part, and keep the class viable in PVP and on-par with the other classes. You can balance out 2 different trees of each spell. This way would also require a lot of time going through every spell a class uses and splitting it in half however. But after that, I don't see a problem with it unless anyone else does. Thoughts?

Love that idea. Would put some balance into the game, though, i do not know if this is possible ? maybe too many bugs or something like that ? Otherwise, blizz would have thought about it, would they not ?

[Snakez]

Hungering Cold was a useful interrupt and shortterm cc in pve. Now it is useless for either. And the change to dark succor makes death strike useless in pve. Gotta just love the changes. NOT Not even gonna start on the spriest changes. :/

1,5 sec cast for HC is laughable, people will be able to avoid it by leaving its range

[Thunderstar]

Love that idea. Would put some balance into the game, though, i do not know if this is possible ? maybe too many bugs or something like that ? Otherwise, blizz would have thought about it, would they not ?

You would think so. It's a pretty basic concept.

[Rukh]

Waitwait. Hungering cold is way more powerful than being able to AoE fear people? what?Also, what a red herring about balance. We KNOW its hard. That's why its silly when Blizzard says "this class is slightly too strong, instead of doing a teeny adjustment and seeing the results lets redisign half their abilities and then drastically nerf/buff them for the next 3 years. Why can't we get them to balance!!!!1"

[Wizzlecrank]

Increase the range on Hungering cold if it has a cast bar or increase the duration. Dark Succor is trash and should be removed/replaced. The holy shield change is a joke.And yeah the 2hand frost nerf is hilarious considering dw already does more damage.

[cFortyfive]

1,5 sec cast for HC is laughable, people will be able to avoid it leaving its range

Well while you can still set it up to make it hard to move away any decent team should easily be able to interrupt you.

[Snakez]

dark succor change is the least of my concerns tbh

For blood DKs its no big deal duh

[Nyoa]

DKs have cooldowns are close to Paladins, Rogues, Warriors, Feral Druids, etc. It is pretty similar.

DKs did well in Arena before having 15% healing on half of their GCDs and they'll do fine without it.

please do tell what cooldowns DK's have that are similar to those classes? there must be some reason why DK's are instantly focus nuked down when they enter the arena. 20% physical damage reduction and lesser version of CoS. compared to immunity + melee immunity that is also castable on team mates, + stunbrake if you want to compare to IBF. cos, CR, evasion + reset. warriors have it hard but they have better shieldwall, granted it will lock your damage but save you from focus nuke, spellreflect and regeneration. Ferals have barkskin that can easily be improved to 50% with talents, also bearform and enraged regeneration.

I argue that DK's have the worst cooldowns against focus nuke in the game. Even shamans have 40% all damage reduction in shamanistic rage and the totem shield

[Zalavaaris]

You're right, any frost Dk speccing into Hungering Cold is doing it wrong. The only exception possibly being if that Dk's sole purpose is to kite, where I could see it being only a slight hindrance, you'd just have to use your brain and cast it pre-emptively.

Are you daft? You do understand you NEED that talent for Howling Blast right? It is a very helpful utility to have especialy when glyphed.

[Nyoa]

They were doing too much damage in PvP and were "middle-high" in PvE so they just simplified it and called it "too much damage in PvP and PvE". Makes it look better that way for them.

yes, DK's are bursting ridicilous amounts of damage in pvp but it kinda pisses me off when they claim the same about pve -.-

[Dannz]

You're right, any frost Dk speccing into Hungering Cold is doing it wrong. The only exception possibly being if that Dk's sole purpose is to kite, where I could see it being only a slight hindrance, you'd just have to use your brain and cast it pre-emptively.

hungering cold was great for pve, gathering the adds on conclave heroic, freezing them, waiting for those spore attacks to stop, and everyone focus aoe them down was a blast... now it won't be possible with being hit by the mobs and having +2 second cast time cuz of pushbacks, you'll eat aoe dmg :3

Love that idea. Would put some balance into the game, though, i do not know if this is possible ? maybe too many bugs or something like that ? Otherwise, blizz would have thought about it, would they not ?

they alrdy do that with some spells in the game, like sap works only for some seconds on players, but up to 3 mins on NPC's, there's no problem in doing that. Blizzards reasons for not doing this with every spell in-game so far has been "it's makes the game overly complicated for new comers, learning how all the spells work for pve and pvp" and that "tooltips will become too big"