DK Tanks

[Kadena]

Improved in 4.3 or not?

[Affectionate]

quality of life improved yes, "fixed" ? not quite, we'll still have issues with spike damage.

[Deleted]

http://us.battle.net/wow/en/feed/news#deathknights

http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/to...1768194?page=1

http://elitistjerks.com/f72/t125290-...6/#post2023868

Decide yourself

[StaeleAilar]

i HATE dk tanks >.>
simply because of the spikes they take. I'm a healer and i can be ready to like heal them up on fights like alysrazor etc then BAM dead. Wasn't even blinking or anything and they still died O_o

[Affectionate]

i HATE dk tanks >.>
simply because of the spikes they take. I'm a healer and i can be ready to like heal them up on fights like alysrazor etc then BAM dead. Wasn't even blinking or anything and they still died O_o

then you're playing with some bad ones

[gamma Ray]

i HATE dk tanks >.>
simply because of the spikes they take. I'm a healer and i can be ready to like heal them up on fights like alysrazor etc then BAM dead. Wasn't even blinking or anything and they still died O_o

Then they don't know what they are doing. DK tanks have much more control over their spike damage than other tanks. There are so many CDs they can, and should be rolling at any time.

[Deleted]

Having played the PTR for a while now not much is fixed. Some of our QOL issues are fixed kinda

We still have the following issues.

No powerfull raid cooldowns
We still have to apply debuffs before we can start to use DS and block (not good if there is loads of damage at the start of the fight)
Avoidance fights mastery still
We can still get 2 shot.
We still have the lowest armor and take the most damage.
We have so much more room for error than the other tanks
Other tanks can still Blockcap so are still superior.
We have lower damage now due to the rune not being refunded from DS if it does miss.
We are still the worst Add tank.
We take spike damage just as before.
DS causes overhealing and the healing is suppose to makeup for lack of armor.. Does no good with its overheal.
Healers cant mind read when your going to DS
You can be in a position where you really need a cooldown or a DS but cant due to the rune system.
You still need an Addon to track your blood shields / heals.

Many other reasons but its safe to say if your a DK tank your still going to be the worst tank come 4.3 Paladins are far to strong. Warriors will be in same boat as block capping becomes super easy for them also.

As a DK your be taken to a fight where you can gimp some of the mechanics with AMS or hard hitting slow bosses. (not many of them about heh) The 1.8sec swing timers kinda screw you over when you think a block tank always blocks or avoids melee damage but a DK can only do so many DS a minute and lack a raid cooldown.

We suck but are viable. I would say more viable at normal content but allot less viable at heroic content.

Remember we suck because we "work correctly" Regardless of skill a block tank will be better 99% of the time.

The only people who say "we are fine"

a) Can't play and think they are doing just fine (most DK's fit this description met many think they are fine and cant even tell me what rune DS uses)
b) Can play but have not reached hard enough content to notice the issues.

[StaeleAilar]

then you're playing with some bad ones

No comment, they may read these forums lol.

[Valius]

Good DK's are fine, awful dk's are still bad.

Well time DS's > Other meatsheilds.

[Valestik]

Death Knights will still take spike damage consistently more than the others. Passive mitigation>Active. Druids, CTC capped warriors/Paladins always reduce melee attacks (druids less so, with crit being RNG) while a death knight is guaranteed to take full damage swings every now and then.

[Sobegreen]

With GC's latest post he seems to more or less say that Blizzard wants all tanks to use hit/exp but since its so late in this expansion they don't think it would be fair to make us do it without forcing the other tanks to. I'd put money that they'll make hit/exp very valuable in the next expansion and with other tanks taking a new play style like ours it'll be a pretty big deal.

We discussed some of our Blood changes in a recent blog. We wanted to make it less punitive for DKs to miss Death Strike. Long term, we still want to make hit and expertise matter more to tanks, not less, but it wasn’t fair to punish DK players for working the “right way” when the other tanks aren’t there yet. We also reduced the cooldown of Outbreak for Blood DKs so that applying diseases doesn’t compete with Death Strike runes as much, and we simplified Blade Barrier so that there is less pressure to spend runes instead of sitting on them.

So our 4.3 changes should probably be mostly looked at as a bandaid for the rest of Cata and not a long term play style change.

[Deleted]

We have so much more room for error than the other tanks

Sure this is what you were trying to say?

Straight question.

[Dranosh]

I can beat prot paladins with avodiance spec,In damage taken.I have only issue in alysrazor hc(so much spike damage)

[Darsithis]

Sure this is what you were trying to say?

Straight question.

'

I think he meant LESS room for error . And we do. A mis-timed DS can mean a very bad spike in damage if you're unlucky with avoidance.

To those complaining about healing DK's, I can tell you from both ends, a well-played DK is a breeze to heal. My healers in raid and in dungeons enjoy healing me (because they don't have to concentrate on topping me off, even when I dip to 50% and below), and when I've healed good DK's, I've rarely dipped below 80% or so mana as holy.

That's not to say everyone experiences running with a DK the same way, but comparatively I've noticed a lot more damage on the part of a warrior than a DK (paladins seem to take the least along with druids).

OT: in 4.3, we get a QoL improvement on the part of diseases (30 second talented Outbreak) and DS heals/absorbs at the cost of dps. But overall, our mechanics will not be changing, AT LEAST AS IT STANDS NOW! 4.3 isn't out yet, so don't get too sure that nothing is changing

[Jinto]

Blood needs a significant armor buff. That is probably enough of a bandaid to "fix" DK tanking.

[Ssith]

just going to say that the "heal it back" method is now, and always has been, a failure.

[Shiira]

To those complaining about healing DK's, I can tell you from both ends, a well-played DK is a breeze to heal. My healers in raid and in dungeons enjoy healing me (because they don't have to concentrate on topping me off, even when I dip to 50% and below), and when I've healed good DK's, I've rarely dipped below 80% or so mana as holy.

This is fairly accurate for 5 mans, normal modes and some of the nerfed hard modes.

The problems start when you are tanking serious progress content, the lack of effective health and passive mitigation means that death knight tanks are far more susceptible to spike damage than the other tanks.

I have picked up a few pieces of 391 tank gear for my offspec, and I have roughly 32k armour unbuffed. That's several thousand less than the block tanks have now, and it's also several thousand less than I had in 264 gear back at level 80. Meanwhile warriors and paladins are block capping. Death knight effective health is pretty much a complete joke right now.

[SurrealNight]

Having played the PTR for a while now not much is fixed. Some of our QOL issues are fixed kinda

How hard are the T13 bosses hitting? One of the big issues with Cata 25m and Heroic bosses hitting for 100k. This made it impossible to reach a '3 hit' range unless someone has figured out how to hit 300k buffed.

Since 4.3 isn't improving anything as far as mitigation goes, DK's basically need 30% more HP to perform on par with warrior/pally's.

[godmodeon]

DK's basically need 30% more HP to perform on par with warrior/pally's.

...what? No. Just no. We are far from fine, but that's just absurd. Yes, I tank heroics, and yes, I die to some spike damage once in a blue moon (i.e.: When healers are lagging, or like maybe once every 2 months), but seriously. Our Pally tank takes more damage and spike damage than me. I never get 2 shot unless I've got my back turned from what's hitting me. Healers never complain, but give me compliments. I realize nerfs in Firelands helped a lot of this, but I really don't see any tanks besides Druids outperforming me and that was literally once.