Patch 9.1.5 Content Update Preview

Too little, too late.

Originally Posted by Lolites

people who dont even play but come every day to forum to make few threads throwing shit about every aspect of the game are definitely funiest

Naaaah, apologists are waaaay funnier. Yourself included.

Vocal Minority. Remember that one? Tell me, on the scale from 0 to 10, exactly how stupid do you feel right now?

It's actually healthy for the game if people who have quit come back and share what exactly made them quit, so, you know, Blizzard could do something about it and bring back players. It's people like you "blizz can do no wrong" who are bad for the health of the game, because even if its pretty obvious that the ship is sinking, you keep parroting that "everything is ok". YOU are the ones killing this game.

Originally Posted by Empower

So two more weeks?

Rejoice, if they touch enough people, we will have 10.0 by christmas

Finally I can enjoy all the content of the game that was previously fractured in 4 parts and required few alts.
9.1.5, these people could have let us know beforehand

Originally Posted by Vakir

Your reading comprehension is great. Yes, that was my point and the point of those I was quoting. They did say they had one and then they lied by walking it back and saying they could not. Blizzard did even worse by actively obfuscating this fact. First they had said that things were in place to be able to do this, which was obvious to anyone with braincells with or without them confirming it.

But later, they walked that back, stating the ripcord wasn't made and it was, in fact, going to detrimental to the system. There's a post gone now because it's from Beta forums, so it can't be linked, but to summarize it: "We can't do it because it would give players more ability to enjoy the game without extra steps that are lucrative for MAU numbers 'unravel the entire system' and there's certain Legendaries and Conduits that only come from certain Covenants and we can't have those be obtainable through one Covenant and have it change to a different one if you swapped - it's just soooo haaaaard guys. : ((((( "

If you must, the first video I could find that has the post quoted in its entirety is available here. I want to avoid embedding it because it gives views to a hack that rhymes with Smellular.

So in short, yes. We know. There was a ripcord. Anyone with a brain could see it was possible before Blizzard even confirmed there was one. They lied and said there wasn't and that it would totally unravel a very intricate (read: bullshit) system that everyone saw right through, but it turns out they could've easily done it to begin with and their voice otherwise was pure lipservice in the name of extending out playtime artificially, which is all any of these systems are.

It's fine, though. Creepy sex predators like you need to shill for other creepy sex predators. No one should ever forget what you did.



Absolutely not. The entire tone of the community and the overall mood of everyone involved needs to be miserable. Nobody should be allowed to accept this after everything that happened, both on a development level and a corporate culture level. Anyone with braincells should stay mad and until absolutely everything that's a problem is permanently upended, the culture should be encouraged to be hostile to Blizzard.

This is about completely changing their philosophy. Just like taking too long to add Wakening Essences and just like how long the nonsense with HoA Essences and Corruptions took to partially fix, there's nothing stopping them from making 10.0 systems that have the same problem.

They should be treated as actively hostile to players and any integrity until they prove otherwise.

Cool, you know what you should do in a hostile environment? FUCKING LEAVE. Again we have people feeling the need to post they left this game expansion ago, there is no good reason to still be here posting consistently if you stopped playing, leave the game, leave the environment. I personally don't have issues with the development, so why should I be mad, because you are? If you are made and feel like the game isn't good/fun then don't play stop posting. Blizzard isn't going to read bitch post number 2315252151 on this website, people that enjoy the game and are looking for news will. You know what blizzard will see, people leaving.

I am just going to start ignore listing all these people that "quit".

God between here and the wow reddit I think 90% of the online Karen population is accounted for.

Originally Posted by bledgor

Cool, you know what you should do in a hostile environment? FUCKING LEAVE. Again we have people feeling the need to post they left this game expansion ago, there is no good reason to still be here posting consistently if you stopped playing, leave the game, leave the environment. I personally don't have issues with the development, so why should I be mad, because you are? If you are made and feel like the game isn't good/fun then don't play stop posting. Blizzard isn't going to read bitch post number 2315252151 on this website, people that enjoy the game and are looking for news will. You know what blizzard will see, people leaving.

I did leave. So did a bunch of others. That's most likely why it's happening. But I'll continue to post and continue to leave feedback, whether they are reading or not, because I want the game to be better and the shitty pillars it's built on to not be the same ones used in future iterations.

Many people aren't going to be satisfied if they keep doing toxic things to their game that they know are toxic, only to say "we're sowwy" when it inconveniences them only to be enough of a problem to temporarily change their direction. Good will needs to be earned over a long period of time, and I'm glad it's at a point where enough people, whether it's a small sample size or not, are taking notice.

If you have a culture of apologists who also don't seem to understand the problem - the same tools that liked this terrible system and turned out to be the actual "vocal minority" and were actively wrong - those people need to have their noses put in the dog shit until they listen.

Not all opinions are created equal, and people don't suddenly get to make everything warm and fuzzy when things that were argued in favor of for over a year are only getting dealt with when it indirectly benefits Blizzard rather than is a good experience for the customers in the first place.

In short, if this is hard for you to read, good. Even if this leads to you ignoring people, good. My ideal world is one where people at the bottom of the barrel are completely alone. I hope your echo-chamber shrinks so small or it becomes so uncomfortable for you that you learn that you are a problem. And that's why I don't care if Blizzard themselves read it.

So its BFA all over again.

Originally Posted by Acidbaron

''While we hope many players will be pleased at the increased accessibility and freedom for experimentation these changes will permit, we know that you might be wondering why we didn’t make adjustments like these sooner. After all, a large portion of the community has been vocal about wanting to see changes along these lines since mid-2020, when Shadowlands was still in Beta.

When it comes to the limitations on Covenant-switching, millions of players experienced Shadowlands for the first time through the lens of their Covenant of choice, and that would have not been possible had the choice carried less weight from the outset. Nevertheless, after the conclusion of the Chains of Domination campaign, the Covenants are united against the Jailer, and revisiting player feedback in that context has led us to re-evaluate our approach. In terms of the day-to-day player experience, the advantages of a rigid division between Covenants have diminished since Shadowlands launched, while the downsides (feeling disadvantaged in certain types of content, or having to choose between mechanical advantages and aesthetics) have only grown. That balance of factors no longer justifies the original limitations on Covenant-switching, so in 9.1.5 we’re looking to provide a way to circumvent them.''



I am sorry but the release could have done without this explanation what is fairly weak and to claim it was held back for so long out of -lore related issues- is not in the slightest believable. It is actually rather insulting, instead of merely admitting to bad design.

So all of these things currently going on, none of that is impacting these changes? yes that is completely believable and honest.

Hey, at least that lore its in the game, for once.

Shit xp. Finish some raids to last the expansion and move dev resrources already to a revamp away from bleeding subs ie. less pay2win crap and *the horror* go back to making the game challenging outside M+ & M raids.

Crazy to me how games like Cyberpunk get all the flak they deserve but people are still so willing to give Blizzard kudos for the most basic of changes that should've happened before the game ever launched.

Originally Posted by Mazzic518

Too little, too late.

It is funny, because that is the exact sentiment expressed in the first response on the official forums and it has garnered more likes than the bluepost at the moment (183 to 151). Been reading through the official thread and about 70% of the posts seem to be in this category of criticism. Plenty of people calling out the fact that they're still defending the terrible system while admitting that they're changing it because it was so terrible that it became necessary to change it.

They still seem to have the mindset of "You think you do, but you really don't" as part of their development plan, so 10.0 is probably screwed too.

Originally Posted by Garretdejiko

Rejoice, if they touch enough people, we will have 10.0 by christmas

Finally the secret to game design.

Originally Posted by Vakir

I did leave. So did a bunch of others. That's most likely why it's happening. But I'll continue to post and continue to leave feedback, whether they are reading or not, because I want the game to be better and the shitty pillars it's built on to not be the same ones used in future iterations.

Cool, you didn't leave, you just stopped playing and instead spend at least minutes if not hours browsing a website dedicated to the game you left because of reasons for the reason to post your opinions about a game you no longer play to people that play the game. If it has such shitty pillars it means the foundation is crap and you can have a good building from crap foundation, in that case, feel encouraged to MOVE ON.

Originally Posted by Vakir

Many people aren't going to be satisfied if they keep doing toxic things to their game that they know are toxic, only to say "we're sowwy" when it inconveniences them only to be enough of a problem to temporarily change their direction. Good will needs to be earned over a long period of time, and I'm glad it's at a point where enough people, whether it's a small sample size or not, are taking notice.

You call it toxic, I don't find conduit energy or covenant locking toxic, I find it to be the R in MMORPG, as in a role, as in a specific function that you are limited/bound to in order to successfully fulfill the ROLE you are playing. Yes sometimes it is detrimental to another aspect of the game, but that is how roles can work. Sometimes you need to compromise role for gameplay, and sometimes I think gameplay can fuck off for the roleplay aspect. Sorry you cant min max every single aspect of the game in order to cover for your shortcomings (yes you can do M+20s and mythic raid as the worst covenant with bad conduits).

Originally Posted by Vakir

If you have a culture of apologists who also don't seem to understand the problem - the same tools that liked this terrible system and turned out to be the actual "vocal minority" and were actively wrong - those people need to have their noses put in the dog shit until they listen.

You can understand the problem and post constructively, you can also realize your voice isn't being heard and make your complete absence you message. Choosing to stay and enjoying/thinking different doesn't make you an apologists, but calling everyone who thinks differently than you an apologist does make you a jackass. I never said I liked the system, just I didn't find it some massive game ruining issue and easily found ways to play/enjoy the game with it you dolt. Just because someone bitches to a manager and gets a free meal doesn't make them right Karen.

Originally Posted by Vakir

Not all opinions are created equal, and people don't suddenly get to make everything warm and fuzzy when things that were argued in favor of for over a year are only getting dealt with when it indirectly benefits Blizzard rather than is a good experience for the customers in the first place.

you are right, not all opinions are created equal, and the opinion that you should stay on a forum for a game you don't play to continuously read and post negative bullshit is right up there with the opinion the Earth is flat.

Originally Posted by Vakir

In short, if this is hard for you to read, good. Even if this leads to you ignoring people, good. My ideal world is one where people at the bottom of the barrel are completely alone. I hope your echo-chamber shrinks so small or it becomes so uncomfortable for you that you learn that you are a problem. And that's why I don't care if Blizzard themselves read it.

Not hard, just annoying. My ideal world is a place where people are mature enough to realize they can walk away from things they dont like and not constantly spout negative whining, cause guess what, when people are overly negative in life and constantly bitch they tend to end up alone. If I have to ignore half the idiots on this site that "quit" the game, fine by me. I have a group I raid and do M+, losing even a million people would in no way impact my fun. I do believe that you losing your audience that you can Karen it up for will cause you much anguish, so enjoy.

too little, too late...

Originally Posted by OrangeJuice

I'm not fully convinced that this wasn't their plan from the start, to be honest. Theres so many changes that its hard to believe this wasn't preplanned months ago. I.E. before SL even launched.

You're not wrong to think that, honestly - and it seems a lot of people agree, they've become cynical because they did this in Legion and BfA.

Originally Posted by TEHPALLYTANK

Been reading through the official thread and about 70% of the posts seem to be in this category of criticism.

This is heartening to me. Not because I want WoW and Blizzard to fail, but because they need to stop doing this exact dance over and over again. Their paying customers need to be telling them that it's too little, too late. And that they need to stop designing arbitrary, temporary systems with planned obsolescence in mind. I hope people let them know, as politely as they possibly can (which is sadly out of reach for some, I know) that they will not support this bullshit anymore.

Originally Posted by Lahkesis

This is heartening to me. Not because I want WoW and Blizzard to fail, but because they need to stop doing this exact dance over and over again. Their paying customers need to be telling them that it's too little, too late. And that they need to stop designing arbitrary, temporary systems with planned obsolescence in mind. I hope people let them know, as politely as they possibly can (which is sadly out of reach for some, I know) that they will not support this bullshit anymore.

I think obsolescence is fine in terms of class kit. Make specs play different each expansion then shake it up but don't use it to push terrible grind systems.

Originally Posted by bledgor

It always makes me mad how there will be dozens of people on these threads who feel the need to come in and type out "too little too late" or "I already quit not coming back". If you have quit, please for the love of god, move on. Stop posting here, stop checking these forums every fifteen minutes for the newest wow bashing thread, and move on.

No.

That's about all the response you deserve. Nobody has to rationalize their presence on these forums to you, and you have no basis to demand to control what they do and say.

As long as the mods and the people who own and run the site allow us to post, we will continue to do so, regardless if you agree with it, or not, or if you're angry.

too little, too late...

Originally Posted by Gadzooks

No.

That's about all the response you deserve. Nobody has to rationalize their presence on these forums to you, and you have no basis to demand to control what they do and say.

As long as the mods and the people who own and run the site allow us to post, we will continue to do so, regardless if you agree with it, or not, or if you're angry.

Cool, I didn't say you cant post or cant be constructive, I said if you quit and only want to be negative to leave. Enjoy ignore troll.

Stop saying "To little, to late" when Blizz are literally adding everything and more we have been suggesting for the past year.
Im very happy they are starting to listen, and with the new leadership and internal changes i'm looking forward to the future of wow.