Item Level Squish, Kor'kron Dark Shaman, 5.4 RPPM Mechanics Change, Blue Posts, Art

The Comma is Coming, Interview with D1 and D2’s Lead Designer, Feedback Needed for a Ladder-Like System, Clarifications on the Console Version

Arena Deck Building Contest, Daily Blue Wrap-up - EU Beta Access, Turn Timer, Pyroblast Buff

Item Level Squish Feedback
Demonstrating why we warn you about taking translated interviews as fact, Ghostcrawler mentioned today that he did not confirm an upcoming item squish, along with answering a few common concerns. You can take part in the ongoing discussion here.
Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
mmo-champion says item squish soon confirmed. Please do not regress my character. I worked hard to get him to where he is.
I didn't confirm it. Still we think there are a lot of good reasons to get numbers down to more parsable levels. (Source)
100m, 100k, and 100 are all equally 'parsable'. It's all about formatting.
We describe automobile speed in miles / kilometers per hour and not inches / cms, because big numbers are awkard. (Source)
Exactly. We use KILOmeters per hour. What's the problem with using KILOdamage per second?
That's the mega damage solution, and we're just worried it will look a little silly. You crit for 200 MEGADAMAGE! (Source)

I now have to find 24 other people to do BT/DS/BWL/ICC and follow mechanics just for pets and mog gear? no ty!
I have said several times that item squish would not affect the ability to solo old content. That's not the intent. (Source)

But can you nerf every player without in anyway effecting soloing low level content? Keep everything the same but the numbers?
"If player enters old instance, then buff all their stats." (Source)

Patch 5.4 - Kor'kron Dark Shaman Preview
The Kor'kron Dark Shaman is the 7th encounter in the Siege of Orgrimmar Raid.


Name Points Category
Heroic: Kor'kron Dark Shaman Defeat the Kor'kron Dark Shaman in Siege of Orgrimmar on Heroic difficulty.
10Pandaria Raid
Rescue Raiders Rescue a set of caged prisoners, a group of unwilling combat participants, and Ji Firepaw before defeating the Kor'kron Dark Shaman in Siege of Org...
10Pandaria Raid

Originally Posted by MMO-Champion
  • Spirit Link - Damage dealt is shared between Earthbreaker Haromm and Wavebinder Kardris.
  • Bloodlust - When the Dark Shaman reach 25% health remaining, they will go into a blood frenzy, increasing all damage dealt by 25% and haste by 25%.
  • Darkfang and Bloodclaw - The riding wolves of the Dark Shaman, Darkfang and Bloodclaw will viciously defend their masters.
    • Swipe - Inflicts 300,000 Physical damage to targets in a 8-yard cone in front of the caster.
    • Rend - Viciously rends a player, causing them to bleed for 16,000 Physical damage every 1 sec. for 15 sec. This effect stacks.
  • Totems - The Dark Shaman will drop Totems during the fight that grant them new abilities.
    • Poisonmist Totem - Poisonmist Totem grants Earthbreaker Haromm the Toxic Mist ability, and grants Wavebinder Kardris the Toxic Storm ability. The Dark Shaman drop Poisonmist Totems upon reaching 85% health.
    • Foulstream Totem - Foulstream Totem grants Earthbreaker Haromm the Foul Stream ability, and grants Wavebinder Kardris the Foul Geyser ability. The Dark Shaman drop Foulstream Totems upon reaching 65% health.
    • Ashflare Totem - Ashflare Totem grants Earthbreaker Haromm the Ashen Wall ability, and grants Wavebinder Kardris the Falling Ash ability. The Dark Shaman drop Ashflare Totems upon reaching 45% health.
    • Rusted Iron Totem - Rusted Iron Totem grants Earthbreaker Haromm the Iron Tomb ability, and grants Wavebinder Kardris the Iron Prison ability. The Dark Shaman drop Rusted Iron Totems upon reaching 95% health.
  • Earthbreaker Haromm
    • Froststorm Strike - Strikes a player with frost-lined weapons, inflicting 325,000 Frost damage and causing the player to take 25% additional damage from Froststorm Strike for 30 sec. This effect stacks.
    • Toxic Mist - Injects several players with a toxic mist, inflicting 50,000 Nature damage every 3 sec. for 30 sec and causing growing Toxicity. Due to the internal nature of the corruption, Toxic Mist pierces all immunities. This ability is granted by Poisonmist Totem.
      • Toxicity - Increases Nature damage taken by 10% per stack.
    • Foul Stream - A stream of foul liquid inflicts 220,000 Nature damage to all enemies on a line. This ability is granted by Foulstream Totem.
    • Ashen Wall - Summons a line of stationary Ash Elementals that will attack any nearby enemies. This ability is granted by Ashflare Totem.
    • Iron Tomb - Inflicts 500,000 Physical damage to players within 3 yards and creates an Iron Tomb. This ability is granted by Rusted Iron Totem.
  • Wavebinder Kardris
    • Froststorm Bolt - Fires a bolt of bitter frost, inflicting 450,000 Frost damage.
    • Toxic Storm - Summons a powerful toxic storm that inflicts 300,000 Nature damage to players within 9 yards every 2 sec. and periodically creates Toxic Tornadoes. The storm will move around and lasts for 60 sec. This ability is granted by Poisonmist Totem.
      • Toxic Tornado - Toxic winds inflict 300,000 Nature damage to players within 5 yards every 1 sec. and knock them up.
    • Foul Geyser - Conjure foul water that inflicts 450,000 Nature damage to players within 4 yards every 0.5 sec. for 8 sec. Each splash creates a Foul Slime. This ability is granted by Foulstream Totem.
      • Foul Slime - Foul Slimes are coated in Foulness.
        • Foulness - Inflicts 150,000 Nature damage to players within 3 yards every 1 sec.
    • Falling Ash - Summons a core of smouldering ash that will fall over 30 sec. Inflicts 999,999 Fire damage to players within 17 yards and 160,000 Fire damage to all players on impact. This ability is granted by Ashflare Totem.
    • Iron Prison - Encases the player in a prison of iron that slowly asphyxiates them, inflicting 100% of maximum health as Physical damage after 60 sec. This ability is granted by Rusted Iron Totem.



Raid Testing Schedule - July 31-Aug 1
Originally Posted by Blizzard (Blue Tracker / Official Forums)
On Wednesday and Thursday, July 31 and August 1, we will continue testing raid encounters in the Siege of Orgrimmar raid. We're moving on to 10-player Heroic testing at this time and finishing up 10-player Normal, and will then move on to Heroic and then 25-player mode as the PTR cycle progresses.

Each encounter should be available at approximately the listed times below for all Public Test Realms.

Wednesday, July 31
Galakras - 10 Player Normal - 10:30 PDT (13:30 EDT, 19:30 CEST)
Garrosh Hellscream - 10 Player Normal - 16:00 PDT (19:00 EDT, 01:00 CEST)

Thursday, August 1
Kor'kron Dark Shaman - 10 Player Heroic - 13:30 PDT (16:30 EDT, 22:30 CEST)
General Nazgrim - 10 Player Heroic - 16:00 PDT (19:00 EDT, 01:00 CEST)

Patch 5.4 - Change to RPPM Mechanics
Originally Posted by Blizzard (Blue Tracker / Official Forums)
We think the cooldown lineup at the start of PvE encounters has gotten out of hand, and it’s having some rather negative effects on gameplay. Particularly with the number of RPPM procs most raiders have these days, the pull has just become way too important. It’s affecting gearing, it’s punishing classes that can’t capitalize on it as well as others, and it’s not how we’d like raiding to work.

To that end, we’re going to make another change to how RPPM mechanics work on the pull. Starting a raid encounter will set every RPPM proc’s “time since last proc” to 90 seconds. That means the more frequent procs will still be more or less guaranteed to go off, but the rarer (and more powerful) procs will just have a high chance. This should hopefully chill things out a little bit, without changing how you play too dramatically.

Can we clarify what 'rarer' RPPM procs are? We talking the meta-gem here?
We're not changing the actual RPPM proc rates at all, just how much time is "banked" before the pull. The underlying math that determines what the actual chances are isn't changing.

So, here's a couple hypothetical examples using very rough napkin math. I don't remember RPPMs for actual trinkets off the top of my head (and they're not particularly necessary for illustration purposes):

Trinket A has an RPPM that allows it to reach a 100% proc chance if it hasn't fired after 60 seconds. This trinket will have a guaranteed proc on the pull.

Trinket B has an RPPM that allows it to reach a 100% proc chance if it hasn't fired after 100 seconds. It will not be guaranteed to proc immediately, but will proc within the first 10 seconds.

Trinket C has an RPPM that allows it to reach a 100% proc chance after 2 minutes. It will not be guaranteed to proc immediately (regardless of how much time you've spent out of combat), but will proc within the first 30 seconds.

Make sense?

My 502 UVLS doesn't have a guaranteed proc chance 2 minutes in though. Lore's example needs a trinket D, which is only guaranteed in excess of 6 minutes of no procs.
This is true -- some trinkets will now be unlikely to proc immediately (which is the point of the change). However, it should be noted that it's extremely unlikely for any RPPM proc to take until it hits a 100% chance to activate anyway.

Guilds are still going to wait. This change is good, but it's not good enough.
Aside from the fact that most groups wouldn't be ready for another pull within 90 seconds anyway, waiting has no effect whatsoever. As soon as a raid encounter is pulled, the time since last proc for all RPPM mechanics in the raid will be set to exactly 90 seconds. Doesn't matter if it's been 10 seconds or 10 minutes since the last pull.

I do want to say, this is distinctly a nerf to fun. It WAS A LOT of fun to open up full force pot, cloak, enchant, 2xtrinkets, meta, stormlash, + elemental + lava burst. I was hitting 75,000 spellpower
I feel like the "nerf to fun" argument gets overstated quite a bit. We're not nerfing it because it was fun, we're nerfing it because it was breaking the game.

I'm sure a lot of players would find it fun to be able to take down Heroic Lei Shen with a single spell. That doesn't make it good gameplay.

I'm skeptical to the idea that not getting a proc in the initial burst will somehow make these trinkets not worth using. After that first proc on the pull, the time since last proc is 0 anyway. It'll tone back the initial burst, definitely, but I'm not convinced that the entire value of a trinket like Unerring Vision of Lei Shen depends on that first proc.

Blue Posts
Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
Patch 5.4 Arena Changes
Yeah, i miss the teamnames but the patch is still going to be really good.
We understand that there are some players that will miss the customization and comradeship that came with arena teams. We're looking into ways in which we will be able to retain these particular feelings in arena after these changes occur, but at this time we don't have anything to share in this regard.

I wonder how the ladders will look now. Players with highest ratings etc? I hope they thought this through thoroughly.
The ladders will show individual players and their rankings will be based off of their personal rating. End of season rewards will still be awarded in the same manner as they are now, to the top "X"% of competitors, the percentage of course being different depending on the reward.

So it's all 100% individual? If I play with a team to 2600 and one of my teammates ends on 2560 and cutoff is 2570 he wont get a reward?
Well, while you may play with a few specific players and you consider yourselves a team, you're not actually in a set team. But this is also the case as if he also got the title just for playing with you, because there are no teams in 5.4 you could also feed the title to anyone that you wanted who was just under the cutoff.

Don't encourage wintrading...
I feel that I need to clarify on my last post as there was some misunderstanding of what I meant. I was not promoting win trading, nor was I saying that you will be able to feed your end of season rewards to others. I wanted to point out that if the system worked as Easydragon questioned, then you could feed your rewards to others if they were just under the cut-off because there are no set teams. Don't worry as you won't be able to feed the title to others by playing with them, the rewards are based off of your own personal ratings alone.

I apologize for any confusion my post may have caused, I have now rephrased it to clarify the above points. (Blue Tracker / Official Forums)

Utility and Hunters
So, this isn't solely specific to Hunters, but since it's an issue I see you guys bring up a lot, I want to talk briefly about "utility."

From a top-down perspective, our design philosophy regarding utility goes something like this: everyone brings some sort of benefit to the group, but no one gets an invite based solely on that benefit. We feel that current class mechanics satisfy the first part of that. We're mostly there with the second half, with some exceptions.

Sometimes we just make something too strong to the point that it feels mandatory. That's absolutely true. A current example would be Demonic Gateway, particularly in PvE. It gives a very large benefit in many encounters, and since more Gateways are nearly always a good thing, many raid teams will seek to bring as many Warlocks as they can (though obviously, Warlock DPS has been a factor as well). In that particular case, we're making some changes in 5.4 and, if necessary, may continue to make changes.

The reason I bring that up is that it has the tendency to cast a harsher light than is probably fair on other classes. We feel that, ignoring the extreme outliers like Demonic Gateway, Hunters bring an acceptable amount of utility. Every Hunter has Trueshot Aura and access to an array of buffs and debuffs through their pets (even if not specced Beast Mastery), and abilities like Misdirection and Ice Trap which can be valuable on some encounters. If that's not enough utility to guarantee you a raid invite... then good. We'd rather you get your invite by being a solid raider with good performance.

I'm also slightly confused as to the logic behind some arguments, specifically those along the lines of "our DPS is low, so we need more utility to justify our raid slot." If that's the case, wouldn't you prefer we fix your damage output and/or tone down the overperformers?

I know this doesn't address every concern that's been brought up, and I apologize for that. If and when we have more to share, we will. But I did want to at least shed some light on our thoughts on the "utility" issue overall, for the sake of discussion.

Oh, one thing I can share: we like the idea of removing the focus cost from Dash, so we're going to. That includes Dive and Charge as well.

As has been mentioned in other "utility" threads, part of the problem here is that nobody agrees on what "utility" is. Is the dev definition of the word something you can shed a little light on? (I realize that may raise the "it's a trap!" alarm, so feel free to ignore if you think that would do more harm than good.)

My own working definition for a few years now has been: anything that is beneficial to the group, while in combat, that doesn't pertain directly to my personal performance in my role. Which basically, for a DPS class, would mean anything that doesn't cause me and only me to deal additional damage, and isn't an out-of-combat thing like summoning.
This is probably pretty close to our definition. As you mention, it's the sort of thing that I'd be hesitant to try to define precisely (it's something of a fluid term even internally).

Do you think it's fair that certain abilities (namely Ancient Hysteria and battle rez) are locked to Beast Mastery only? If it's a 25 man situation, probably, but in 10 man you do run the issue of not having either of these. Sometimes that could lead to Hunter's feeling as though they must have Beast Mastery as a spec.
It's something I can bring up again, but we do like these as Beast Mastery perks. Note that, at least in the case of Ancient Hysteria, 5.4 is adding Drums of Rage (a consumable form of Bloodlust/Heroism made by Leatherworkers) that, while not quite as effective as the Beast Mastery buff, should make things at least a little more flexible for 10-mans. (Blue Tracker / Official Forums)

Death Knight (Forums / Skills / Talent Calculator)
RPPM scaling with Runespeed Mechanics
As an update to this, since we've seen some confusion, Improved Unholy Presence is getting the same treatment as Unholy Presence, meaning it will now grant additional haste, not just additional attack speed and rune regen. (Blue Tracker / Official Forums)

PTR Testing and You
Originally Posted by Blizzard (Blue Tracker / Official Forums)
From Zul’Gurub and Ahn’Qiraj onward, we have made extensive use of our Public Test Realms in order to help find bugs and improve the tuning of our raid content. We have an extensive team of Quality Assurance testers and an internal raid group, but it’s impossible to replicate the sheer breadth of information we get from having hundreds of real raid groups attempting diverse strategies as they experience encounters for the first time. We learn a tremendous amount from that testing, both in the form of written feedback on these forums, which is carefully read by every encounter designer, and from spectating raids and observing how they fare.

Now, that’s what we get out of the PTR. Speaking pragmatically, we understand that not everyone's motivation in logging on to the PTR is to give us feedback. They want to check out the new content firsthand, see what’s coming to the live servers in a few weeks or months, and, in the case of raiding, get some competitive edge that will help them clear the content faster on the live servers when the patch is released. That’s fine. We thoroughly appreciate everyone who takes the time to give measured feedback, or goes out of their way to methodically test new features and report bugs they find. But at the end of the day, we’d rather have a packed PTR with a small percentage giving direct feedback, than a nearly-empty PTR where everyone gives it. Bugs that require very specific conditions are much more likely to occur with thousands of testers than with hundreds, and it’s clearly beneficial to everyone for us to find and fix those issues before they affect millions in a live environment.

When it comes to raid testing in particular, there’s a symbiotic relationship: The bleeding-edge guild that intentionally wipes to a boss at 5% so they can set up their boss addons, try out unusual strategies, and practice execution is there for competitive reasons. But we gain information even just from silently observing that will help us make our encounters better, and fundamentally, that is the purpose of raid testing on PTR. Our raid testing times are scheduled to coincide with our core work hours, so that designers can observe as much of the testing as possible, with the exception of LFR and Flexible tests which require more open-ended scheduling given their nature and target audience (and even then, if you were doing a PTR Flexible raid this past weekend, odds are decent that I or another developer was spying on your group – creepy, I know). When it comes to Heroic testing, we try to keep the testing windows as brief as possible, in order to minimize the impact of PTR testing on the progression “race.”

But that symbiotic relationship requires that we be around in some capacity to observe. Players who find a way to access bosses (especially Heroic bosses) that aren’t currently being tested should let us know, so we can correct the problem. We discovered that over the weekend a progression raid group accessed the Siege of Orgrimmar raid and spent hours on a Heroic boss in the middle of the night, after copying fresh characters with generic names, presumably with the hope of going unnoticed. Those actions go against the intent of the PTR, the spirit of fair play, and were clearly intended to go against our wishes for specific boss testing periods. PTR testing is a privilege, and we reserve the right to revoke PTR access from those who have shown an intent to abuse it.

If you come across an oversight in our testing protocols, or a serious, abusable bug or exploit in the course of your testing of a boss encounter on PTR, and you want to let us know without alerting everyone, please note that we can read edited or deleted forum posts. (On the live servers, please use the in-game bug reporting interface.) Otherwise, carry on with the fantastic feedback that we’ve been receiving about all facets of 5.4 content thus far, and we look forward to seeing you on the Public Test Realm!

Blizzard Art Update
Blizzard added five pieces to the World of Warcraft: Mists of Pandaria Art gallery.

This article was originally published in forum thread: Item Level Squish, Kor'kron Dark Shaman, 5.4 RPPM Mechanics Change, Blue Posts, Art started by chaud View original post
Published on 2013-07-31 07:10 AM
105 Comments
Comments 105 Comments
  1. Spellweaver's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Alenarien View Post
    One might almost find it worrying that there are people in the world, and this game, that are losing sleep over the fact that their numbers 'are too high'. Unfortunately, it seems the vocal minority is winning favour with Ghostcrawler on this matter again. I can't wait to hit for 10k at best again! How satisfying...
    But the exact same can be said about the people that are against the item squish.
    Both the people that want the item squish, and the ones that are against it, could be considered the vocal minority.
  1. Layuth's Avatar
    "We're not nerfing it because it was fun, we're nerfing it because it was breaking the game."

    The thing that is breaking this game is piss poor development that is allowing this to happen.
  1. Sodia's Avatar
    rofl its funy to see that some ppl think the item squish is goin to buff old boses :P stupidity know no bounds whot do you think they ar goin to give as gear from tbc or whot ?? ehh
  1. The Penguin's Avatar
    Humorous. Jay Wilson comments that the Diablo 1 Lead Designer ought to fuck off, for giving fair criticism and now that he's shown to be not too skilled, Blizzard has come back to the masters for real game design help. Maybe the Vivendi drop DID help the company!

    As for breaking the game, I doubt it. Game plays just fine IMHO.
  1. Palemoon's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Bruize View Post
    I think I'd like to start seeing some more cosmetic options/quest lines for each class similar to the green fire quest for warlocks. With the introduction of dark shamen, and the existing factions of druids, there are already some interesting options. With the addition of some quests and encounters, we could see some existing lore utilized in new ways. Druid of the Fang, Claw, Talon, etc. It could just cosmetically alter their shapeshift forms which is something druids had been wanting for a very long time.
    Of course that would instantly and furiously activate the people foaming about all the development and design time spent on a "fraction of the players" just so their cats look different, instead of (fixing bugs|adding new content|doing that thing)
  1. Lostkitty's Avatar
    I hope they do the Item Squish I want to start feeling powerful again... right now I just feel stupid over powered... not powerful yes there's a difference... Currently you have tanks running around with nearly 900k health and warlocks close behind... back in BC and Vanilla tanks was barely reaching 10k while most dps was sitting happily at 5-6k but now it's just to stupid...
  1. Outofmana's Avatar
    When playing shadow yday I actually thought how ridiculous the pull has become with all your trinkets proccing etc, good change but I fear not enough, would rather have it reset to 60sec instead of 90.
  1. Spammeister's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by dotSeed View Post
    Why are so many people unable to grasp what the ilvl squish is meant to do? These people seem to think the system is just going to reset them back to level 60 DPS then throw them at current day level 90+ mobs. Why is common sense so lacking?
    As I see it, Blizzard is the one lacking common sense.

    Because quite frankly, I don't think anyone thinks Blizzard knows what the hell they are talking about, or if they even have a cohesive plan (if they ever actually did). I don't see a real way forward with all these GC comments, all I see is pie-in-the-sky hugs and kisses.
  1. mmoc3eb006e951's Avatar
    Big numbers, small numbers. Who cares if strawberries are popping out of the boss. Getting the kill is what matters and the skill required to do so. Who cares about numbers.
  1. Shudder's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by nekobaka View Post
    The developers still make the statement that it isnt their goal to fully support soloing.
    Bullshit. Provide source.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Alenarien View Post
    One might almost find it worrying that there are people in the world, and this game, that are losing sleep over the fact that their numbers 'are too high'. Unfortunately, it seems the vocal minority is winning favour with Ghostcrawler on this matter again. I can't wait to hit for 10k at best again! How satisfying...
    Exactly this. The whiny vocal minority wanted heroics to be hard and we had catacalysm mess. Now we have the whiny vocal minority wanting a squish. If they have the balls to go through with this there is going to be an insane backlash from the majority of players, the ones who don't go to the forums, when they log in that day and see how insanely nerfed they are it's going to be hilarious watching servers become ghost towns. I'm actually looking forward to the carnage.
  1. mmoc6765cb3ae1's Avatar
    I'm not a GC hater and quite like reading his posts most of the time, but one of his more annoying habits is his self-adjudgment of what other people find fun. I personally wouldn't enjoy rolling around like a pig in human filth but I wouldn't say to someone that does that he isn't having fun. I just wish GC would stick to justifying changes with things like "it was better for the game" or "it was affecting X mechanic negatively" instead of telling people who are having fun doing something that they aren't having fun. You don't have to tell us someone one-shotting the current tier HC boss would be disastrous for the game, but I know for a fact I would have fun being the one doing it.
  1. mmoc65ba707d63's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by madrox View Post
    I just wish GC would stick to justifying changes with things like "it was better for the game" or "it was affecting X mechanic negatively" instead of telling people who are having fun doing something that they aren't having fun.
    Something like this?
    Originally Posted by Blizzard (Blue Tracker / Official Forums)
    I do want to say, this is distinctly a nerf to fun. It WAS A LOT of fun to open up full force pot, cloak, enchant, 2xtrinkets, meta, stormlash, + elemental + lava burst. I was hitting 75,000 spellpower
    I feel like the "nerf to fun" argument gets overstated quite a bit. We're not nerfing it because it was fun, we're nerfing it because it was breaking the game.
  1. mmoc27cecdbbd7's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Kazefiend View Post
    I actually hate how stupid people are being about the item squish. We need this shit to happen already because numbers are getting dumb.
    I kinda like seeing myself doing 1 million dps on council pulls.
  1. Stevecow's Avatar
    "We discovered that over the weekend a progression raid group accessed the Siege of Orgrimmar raid and spent hours on a Heroic boss in the middle of the night, after copying fresh characters with generic names, presumably with the hope of going unnoticed. Those actions go against the intent of the PTR, the spirit of fair play, and were clearly intended to go against our wishes for specific boss testing periods. PTR testing is a privilege, and we reserve the right to revoke PTR access from those who have shown an intent to abuse it."

    Anyone have any guess who it might of been or how they did it?
  1. Tenjen's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Bantokar View Post
    Big numbers, small numbers. Who cares if strawberries are popping out of the boss. Getting the kill is what matters and the skill required to do so. Who cares about numbers.
    warcraft is just one big set of complex calculations involving numbers. You saying that is tantamount to saying who gives a shit about DNA in biology or physics in flying aircraft.

    having 5 digits worth of stats on gear is ludicrous. things may be fine now but by the next expansion we'll really be hitting ridiculous numbers

    Quote Originally Posted by Shudder View Post

    Exactly this. The whiny vocal minority wanted heroics to be hard and we had catacalysm mess. Now we have the whiny vocal minority wanting a squish. If they have the balls to go through with this there is going to be an insane backlash from the majority of players, the ones who don't go to the forums, when they log in that day and see how insanely nerfed they are it's going to be hilarious watching servers become ghost towns. I'm actually looking forward to the carnage.
    Actually its the vocal minority thats opposing this. Blizz, bereft of people who want it, have wished to do an item squish because of what they're seeing when designing dps and stats. the feedback from calculations and the appearance of gear.

    This isnt a nerf. The Ratio's are the goddamn same. instead of saying we're gonna travel 328,084 feet, we're gonna say we're traveling 100km. instead of 97630 yen, we're saying we have 1000 dollars. Its worth the damn same.

    It's gonna be cumbersome as hell comparing blue items with stats that have 5 frikkin digits each. the numbers we throw out will just be meaningless 7 digit long bunches.

    It's not a problem in MoP, but if the next expac follows the same jump like the previous expacs, it will reach a point where the numbers are burying us or unintuitive at a glance.

    you hit a mob for 1million damage and take out 10% of its health. after the squish you hit a mob for 6000 and take away 10% of its health.

    Massive numbers inflation is never a good thing to develop and base judgements on for any sort of system.
  1. Cassidin's Avatar
    I understand the idea of an item/stat squish but personally I don't see the need for it. If I crit for 500,000 or 50,000 why would most people find one more confusing than the other? Higher numbers are not more difficult to understand imo. What I do believe though is that seeing my numbers go DOWN because suddenly we have all been squished will feel very meh to a lot of people (myself included). Yes we would still have the same power in relation to mobs/bosses as we have now, and in most cases it probably will not make low level content harder to solo (some exceptions could be as you get to previous expac to current maybe), but it would still FEEL like we are less powerful. That to me would feel very disappointing. If it happens, then after a few months we probably wont feel that way anymore but I still don't want to have my characters go through a phase in their "lives" where they went though a strange world event whereby everyone/thing turned into a weakling.
  1. Tenjen's Avatar
    actually cassidin its gone way past that. its not 500,000. its going to be more like 125850357 over and over in various combinations. saying 125m is a stop gap measure, a band aid.

    please people, just THINK about saying you're gonna travel 328,084 feet rather than say 100 km. in general conversation and decisions making, 328,084 feet is much more meaningless to an individual compared to just saying 100km.

    it wont feel like we're less powerful at all, how we feel is dependent on our performance and when we HIT a creature, it is still going to get horrifically hurt and crumple in the dust and we will be happy about it. Not because of the numbers flying above its head. but because we hit it and a chunk of its health flew off and it made the pain audio blizz set up for it.

    its the difference between driving a noisy as shit motor bike thats making you literally deaf so you dont hear the truck flattening into paste and putting a muffler on that damn thing. same bike, same power between your legs, no sensory overload/numbness.

    all this was covered in this article

    http://www.mmo-champion.com/content/...29-of-Pandaria
  1. tyrindor's Avatar
    But can you nerf every player without in anyway effecting soloing low level content? Keep everything the same but the numbers? "If player enters old instance, then buff all their stats."

    This is a nutty solution. So we'll be doing 1M DPS next expansion but only when in old raids? Out in the world we'll do less than we are doing now. How fake does this game need to get? 4 difficulties is enough, now stat scaling depending on where you are? They are basically admitting it's too much work to correctly do an item squish, so they'll just throw buffs on players when they are doing old content. Do it correctly or don't do it at all. My vote is not at all, it is too much work and displeases way to many people. Condense the numbers with a UI setting but keep them the same. There's no need for "MEGADAMAGE". Simply format numbers as 100k, 74k, 100M, 10B, etc..

    If I wanted stat scaling, i'd be playing GW2.
  1. Unholyground's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by lb View Post
    Oh boy the Blizzard Art ist great ... i wish i could draw like that ...
    If you don't understand how 3D is done then don't comment on it. The sketches are to be made into 3D and have to be done in flat perspective from all angles then they are used in a 3D program as references from each of the 3 axis'.
  1. Cassidin's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Tenjen View Post
    actually cassidin its gone way past that. its not 500,000. its going to be more like 125850357 over and over in various combinations. saying 125m is a stop gap measure, a band aid.
    The thing is I DO believe it will feel bad.... Even GC agreed with that back in 2012 when he said (source):

    We had the whole thing implemented, and we sat down and tried it out, and, you know, Mortal Strike hit for 200, and Fireball hit for 150, and we were like, “This feels wrong.” We knew exactly how it would feel like, and we knew that our damage as a percentage didn’t go down, but it felt terrible.
    I don't believe this has changed. I believe it will feel very odd to be suddenly doing smaller numbers.

    Ultimately, if it happens it happens and only time will REALLY tell how the community reacts to it. It MAY disappoint me if it happens, but it's not going to stop me playing.
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