New 5 man dungeons loot shouldn't be better than the previous raid tier content?

[Psilar]

The short answer: No.
The long answer: GOD %&@$ing NO!!

What you're suggesting is what a lot of people get tired of hearing: Bring back TBC mechanics. Requiring you go one raid to the next per character and gate the content is a horrible idea. As someone else mentioned if we gear up at 4.0 and the gear never improves unless we raid then we're done for the expansion. Horrible, Horible, HORRIBLE idea. ZA/ZG being slightly less than current wasn't too big an insult, but 4 slots needed something better for non-raiders: Head, Shoulders, Ranged, and Strength weapons. 4.3 heroics needed to be higher than 372 to get an item level high enough to raid the content with LFR otherwise you had to grind heroics for the valor for 397 and then LFR would be a downgrade. It's just a horrible idea to never improve the armor and require raid-to-raid gating again.

This person gets it

[xanzul]

Hey everyone just wanna hear about your opinions of this matter, do you think it will be a good idea to make all new 5 man dungeons loot equels even if some of them released after the first tier raid content?

In my personal opinion I think it will be a great idea because this will prevent the old tier contents of the expansion get obsolete (not sure how to spell it sorry :P). This will make the players progress and farm old tiers to prepare for the latest raid tier content.


Now some people will say: Hey but if they make all loots equel even for the new 5 man dungeons this mean players will not even bother do them and instead rather do the easy ones the ones that released with the expansion. That may be true but they can solve that by making the new 5 man dungeons have some awesome rewards like mount, pets, achievements, and some unique gimmic loots ( dagger that makes you mind control some mobs for fun and stuff like that).

Discuss please.

Blizzard is never going back to that raiding model ever again. It just ends up being a tedious grind that isn't even remotely fun.

[Airwaves]

Would you people please give up. This system has been in place since the start of wrath. Nothing is going to change and LFR is here to stay.

[darqhur]

Hrmm. I remember TBC a little. At first I thought attunements were fun. After a few alts, they weren't so fun anymore. Gated progression also meant that guilds poached players and then dropped them when they didn't need them anymore.

Really though, it all came back to what a PITA it was to drag somebody through all the tiers in order to do things beyond kara. Nobody wanted to have to drag you through it, and you didn't want to deal with pugging up to current content. Badges started more or less as a way to keep people rolling through the older stuff as a means of getting vendor gear when rng was against you.

I remember enough about old wow not to really want it back. I like the old stuff mostly because it paved the way for what is here now.

[Harry Botter]

In it's current form, no it is working as intended. In MoP, yes, since they are adding challenge modes to dungeons, they very well may normalize ilvl on old 5 mans as newer ones come out. Probably not, but it's wishful thinking anways.

[Velshin]

Would you people please give up. This system has been in place since the start of wrath. Nothing is going to change and LFR is here to stay.

This topic is not about LFR should stay or not in fact I like the LFR system I'm not against it this topic is just about the item lvl of the new 5 man dungeons.

[Deleted]

5man loot is worse than previous tier raid gear?
T11 346
T12 353
T12 378

[Master Guns]

What I mean is when they make a new 5 man heroic loot is stronger than the previous old raid content or equel to it this will make players either alts or mains farm these new 5 man dungeons loot instead of bothering themselves with the old raid since it's faster and easier to form 5 man grp instead of 10 or 25 man raid grp.

Yeah. What's the problem?

[ComputerNerd]

And forcing players through ever increasing quantites of old content only penalises alts or newer players.

[Nephlim]

Putting effort into something with an end goal in mind? NOOOOO WAY!!! FREE EPIXZ FOR EVERYONE!

inb4 i have 6 85 alts, good taht means you obviously have more tahn enough time on your hands.

[Ryve]

Putting effort into something with an end goal in mind? NOOOOO WAY!!! FREE EPIXZ FOR EVERYONE!

inb4 i have 6 85 alts, good taht means you obviously have more tahn enough time on your hands.

Free out-dated epics of a lower level than was available to players in the previous tier? Oh my, stop the press!

[tylenol]

Others mentioned, the heroics dropped 391/397, who cares about normal mode?

[Apocolips]

Gearing is so easy, so yes, i agree.

[Sunnydee]

so he wants raid gear without raiding or what? i dont get the point...

[Osmeric]

I think they're sort of shooting themselves in the foot a bit by making the new 5-man gear "just as good" (or better) as the last raidtier.

Sorry, you are wrong, and obviously so. If 5 mans deliver gear worse than the previous tier raid, then either (1) raids need to be seriously detuned so the average player doesn't need previous tier gear to do the next one, or (2) new players are forced to try to find a raid group doing the previous tier. Neither possibility ends up being acceptable compared to what they've done.

[Snow White]

Does it ever get tiresome playing a game only for loot drops?

[mitbrandir]

Yes. I hate it that people who dont put effort in the game can get the same gear that i could.

[Miralynn]

That's the point, though. In addition to adding more five-man progression, they allow alts and new players to gear up for current content more easily. That's on purpose.

This. And if you want to see why, go back to the end of TBC. People who started playing or hit level cap late in the expansion pretty much ended up stuck in Kara/ZA-only guilds because the guilds raiding current content couldn't be arsed to spend weeks grinding old content to gear new people up - and even then the current-content guilds would just poach players from the old-content guilds once they were geared. The new model means that no matter WHEN in an expansion you hit cap, you have a chance to start raiding.

[Honen]

Jeez.... people just either don't know their WoW history because they are new to the game (in which case WELCOME) or they are so focused on whining about something they forget it.

Enter the ICC 5mans in Wrath. ToC loot (T9) was 232 on 10man. ICC 5man loot was 232.

In other words... it's been done before, it will continue to be done.

[Velshin]

I think they're sort of shooting themselves in the foot a bit by making the new 5-man gear "just as good" (or better) as the last raidtier.

There is no point in going to Firelands (unless it's heroic mode) since it drops ilvl 378 stuff just like 5m HoT HCs do. Duh.
Now. I think this is bad. Because only having 1 raid-dungeon to do is really too little in my opinion. 8 raidbosses? Hardly enough to keep a person busy with every week.
I would've made 5m HoT HCs drop ilvl 368 gear or something, so there still would be an incentive for pugs to go do FLs. I know people might feel bored with a previous tier, but once again that was because you had very little variation, just like you're getting bored of DS now because it's only 8 different encounters everytime.

Back in Vanilla I remember doing BWL/AQ40 every week, it gave a good sense of variety. Then when Naxx released we focussed only on Naxx until we managed to clear the place and then we went back to AQ40/Naxx runs. There just was much more variety to the encounters and it kept people interested in raiding much longer.

Thank you good sir for completly understand my point. My point about lowering the 5 man dungeons item lvl is to make players busy more than just the latest raid so players will not get bored easily and feel the lack of content.

---------- Post added 2012-03-03 at 06:32 PM ----------

Jeez.... people just either don't know their WoW history because they are new to the game (in which case WELCOME) or they are so focused on whining about something they forget it.

Enter the ICC 5mans in Wrath. ToC loot (T9) was 232 on 10man. ICC 5man loot was 232.

In other words... it's been done before, it will continue to be done.

I know mate it's been done in fact before wrath. It started with the sunwell patch with mgt 5 man.

I want to make things clear for everyone that the point of my opinion first of all it's just an opinion I never said they should do it and I never said I'm right 100% ofc not. I'm not against casual who get the same gears as me in 5 man or whatever I'm in fact one of the casuals I don't play the game a lot anymore. The point of my opinion is to make players busy not only with the latest raid but also the previous raid run them to progress them not only run them for fun or achiev or heroic mode but the feel of the progress. By doing that the lifespan of the raids will be longer than now and if players get bored by DS for example they can still go FL normal or heroic still viable for them.

For the people saying it will penalty the alts and stuff like that I don't think it's as big penalty as you think because valor random epics still there, crafting epics still there, and the LFR still there. My focus change was about the 5 man item lvl only without taking away the other features.