Dev Watercooler - Mists of Pandaria Looting Explained

[Deleted]

How and why do people find this a good system?!? It's like the ultimate stupidity. You might win the same item four weeks in a row, while not getting the item you need (EVEN IF IT DROPS). There HAS and NEEDS to be some sort of "This person already got this item, so if he wins the roll he gets something else class/spec appropraite - if nothing is available this person gets the ability to pass to the next highest roller or take the piece of loot for offspec/sell/de".

[Prag]

New loot system - Love it! Can we implement this yesterday?

New Valor ideas - Very very very excited for this. Although, I did like the way I felt like Valor gave me a piece when the dice wouldn't, with the new loot system it will feel like a new experience.

Overall, one of the more exciting watercooler blogs. Makes me even more excited for MoP.

[VanishO2]

This new system is just as terrible as the last. The LFR way wasn't perfect by any means, but the biggest problems were that some people needed on items they didn't need, and the tables were broken seeing as how Ret Paladins could win holy gear etc. This new way does not solve either of those problems. Now instead of having a 1/7 or 1/8 chance of winning your piece of loot, you have a 1/25 for every single drop. And oh, Good Guy Timmy the full Heroic warrior decided to run his LFR today, he wins 5 pieces because he's a lucky guy! Too bad he can't trade you the items he doesn't need but has been assigned with no way to pass. Why would you not enable a pass loot option. If someone is nice enough to say, I don't want this loot because I'm not a jerk, LET THEM PASS ON IT.

Because ppl would start to exploit running a raid full of druids, paladins, etc. to bias the loot system in dropping only paladin gear, druid gear, etc...

"It's not rocket science"...

Your loot chance didn't change, check your math, it actually increased. You're rolling against the game, not the other players anymore.

[asher1611]

The hypo given by GC is incorrect. All weapons are hunter weapons.

[Nelrock]

There will be plenty of reputation gear, crafting gear, world drops, 5man heroic gear and pvp gear to get at each new tier. The odds of getting way more than "4 items per boss" is stupidly higher now, if you take into account the charms... it's "worse".

I haven't heard it mentioned...but...if there's a chance more items drop...then wouldn't that mean theres a chance nothing drops if nobody wins a roll? RNG is RNG after all.

[Nathanyel]

There is not loot on the boss

The "loot" still exists, if only virtual as the result of winning the roll. When you win, your roll is converted into a random appropriate from the boss's loot table.

[Wolfie of Medivh]

How and why do people find this a good system?!? It's like the ultimate stupidity. You might win the same item four weeks in a row, while not getting the item you need (EVEN IF IT DROPS). There HAS and NEEDS to be some sort of "This person already got this item, so if he wins the roll he gets something else class/spec appropraite - if nothing is available this person gets the ability to pass to the next highest roller or take the piece of loot for offspec/sell/de".

Well it's no different then the current system in that case - I rolled for 4 weeks to get my Warlock a helm, it never dropped. At least here on every boss I'd have the chance to possibly see loot.

[Deleted]

And there I see a problem.

Everyone will roll, whether they want or not, whether they need items or not, whether there is even appropriate loot for them on the boss. At worst, the 4 rogues win the rolls, but there is no leather or Agi weapon on the boss's loot table, so they all get some gold, but no one gets an item. A let-down for the whole raid.
Another, personal example: you are helping a friend's alt of the same class by queueing as a healer/tank. You win many rolls for gear you don't need anymore, but your friend wins nothing.
You cannot even pass to increase the chances of your friend, or just those of the randoms you queued with.

Basically, instead of the 3-10 applicable players rolling on a drop now, all 25 players roll "Need" on anything that drops.

Nobody will be rolling against anyone with this new system, nobody will 'win' rolls from other players anymore. Every player just rolls 1-100 for himself, and if he rolls higher than an imaginary treshold number (let's say 80), he gets an item. This has nothing to do with other players in the group. For example on one boss, all 25 players might get loot, and on the next boss, nobody might get loot.

The system now means that there is a chance to have your loot drop, and even IF it drops, you have to roll against X other imbeciles who might not even need the item. With the new system there is only one roll, a personal roll to check if you win something. If you do, you get your item. No interference with other players.

[Deleted]

I like the sound of what GC wrote. Not only the actual features but also the tone.He sounds like he's really confident about the changes and has a clear perspective on how they'll work out. That's always good to hear when a designer has a clear vision. Something I felt a bit lacking in Cataclysm.Now if only they added the item-squish, I'd be a lot moire excited.

[Howard Moon]

Every player in the raid has a probability of loot, independent from other players. That's what the blue post says. That means that in theory, all 25 players can win something, and it is also possible for nobody to win anything. At least, that's how I understood it.

[Ryzzen]

Overall I think the changes will be good, but I do have one question. The post specifically says "spec" on multiple occasions and not "role". Will your loot be determined by the spec you are currently in, or by the role that you entered the LFR as? If the former, I expect to see people queueing as a healer and then possibly going to a dps/tank spec for the boss fight if they want a particular piece of gear for those specs. Also, dpsers going to tank spec to gear up for that role.

It seems like the system should be determining loot based on your role in LFR and not just your current spec.

[Bahska]

Yes, like during the 7 years of swtor development + beta... lol

Rift says hello

[Azrile]

I see flaws now already. Thank god it's in beta-state!

Says nothing about able to win a item you already have in either inventory or @ bank. You should not be able to if you ask me.
Also, says nothing about the Gurthalak-issue (correct me if I'm wrong). Today pallys (any specc and role) can roll and win it. Same goes for DK's (no, it ain't a tank weapon, even if blood use 2h's).
Same goes for a few trinkets.

Also, will there be some built-in filtration depending on afk ppl etc? As it is now, ppl want and are kicking afk ppl (seen a few just standing still and also die by will, just to do as little as possible on a few bosses, specially DW). Those should not be able to win items at all.

At least set some active-in-fight aspects into the rolls. If using skills less than 20% of the time (or whatever the absolut minimum would be) then not able to roll. Also gives a warning when you're below that part of eligible players.

Also, as said before (several times). Give PvP-gear a own category when counting ilvl for gear. Count pvp-gear as heirloom (lvl 1) or something. No one really want them for PvE-content, same as PvP-players don't want PvE-players in BG's.

There is craftable PvE AND PvP-items for a reason if you ask me.

You should probably spend more time reading and less posting.

1. He said specifically that they did not want looting to be ´more efficient´ for players. You get duplicates, you get duplicates. End of story. This change was NOT made to allow you to get items at a faster rate.. it was added to take the social drama away from LFR. End of story

2. Yeah yeah.. only top 3 dps get loot, only top healer gets loot.. anyone who dies should never get loot. All stupid rules. That is one of the aspects of this change.. if someone does less DPS than you and wins an item, it has no effect on if you can win an item.

3. Obviously you missed all the talk about pvp gear. The devs actually do want you to pvp with pve gear if you are just getting started. Also, the ilvl of pvp gear will be lower than equivalent pve gear, so we won´t have issues like the beginning of cata where people used craftable pvp gear to beat the barriers for LFD.

So yeah.. next time please read before you post. everything you said has already been covered many times.

[Yeehaw]

Awesome! Can't wait!

[VanishO2]

So...there's a possibility 25 items are handed out? I have a hard time believing that.

Not only 25, but more if you get ppl with the charms for extra rolls.

You could get 25 drops x number of bosses.

In a raid like DS, with 8 bosses, the raid could be lucky and get 200 drops from it, 25 from each boss. And it could be even higher with everyone carrying charms and winning the extra rolls.

That's why they're considering not selling valor gear. it will be freaking fast to gear.

[Wolfie of Medivh]

The "loot" still exists, if only virtual as the result of winning the roll. When you win, your roll is converted into a random appropriate from the boss's loot table.

In theory, yes, but I bet Blizz would not let that happen - if less then 2 people win they just do a reroll or automatically change the threshold or something like that.

All i know is in my heroic raids, plenty of times people don't walk out with loot - just last week we had 3 heroic bosses downed where they dropped needless tokens (we're vendoring/sharding heroic Pal/Pri/War tokens while there are members of our raid on the War/Hunt/Sham token who haven't even gotten normal versions of some gear yet) and other gear that wasn't needed. THat's just RNG.

[psycho42]

I'm not sure why people are all up in arms about the new loot system. What you get has no effect on what others get, and if you win 2 of the same items in 2 week, that is no different the way boss drops work now. It is now up in the hands of the RNG gods. I hope they change nothing, this is exactly what the game needed. Also, there is no more rolls at all, please remember that. Kill boss, maybe get loot, might be a new piece, might be the same one you got 3 weeks in a row. RNG

[Deadanon]

How and why do people find this a good system?!? It's like the ultimate stupidity. You might win the same item four weeks in a row, while not getting the item you need (EVEN IF IT DROPS). There HAS and NEEDS to be some sort of "This person already got this item, so if he wins the roll he gets something else class/spec appropraite - if nothing is available this person gets the ability to pass to the next highest roller or take the piece of loot for offspec/sell/de".

Ye this is an issue they somehow need to look at.

Its ok for the same item to drop again and again and again when everyone can loot it. But its kinda depressing to think that some one person might have 4 drops of the same item on the same boss but zero items from the next 3 bosses. And thats whole month of subscription fee.

Not very smart to me - I have to admit.

[Achaman]

im assuming those who do the most work so most dps on a boss would get a higher chance of getting an item?

[lancore89]

Yeah, grinding dailies to increase your loot chances. Now that will be fun -.-